Is Avery Guilty?

PintoBean

PintoBean

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So has anyone watched the Netflix documentary series Making of a Murderer? It is done in the vein of NPR's Serial, if that interested you. I believe Netflix meant to capture the vibe in the very excellent The Thin Blue Line. I watched it kind of half-heartedly and was pretty shocked at the subsequent tsunami of support for Steven Avery. Personally, I think he is guilty, would have voted guilty if on the jury, and was unimpressed with the one-sided/advocacy style documentary. What are your thoughts? How did you reach that conclusion?

Quick summary for those of you who haven't seen, but might be interested: A man named Steven Avery is convicted of the rape and brutal beating of a woman, and imprisoned for 18 years, at which point he is finally exonerated by DNA evidence and the right guy is caught. Upon release, he begins a 36 million dollar lawsuit against the county he was tried and convicted in. However, shortly thereafter he is arrested and convicted of the rape and murder of another woman in the same county. The documentary highlights all the reasons we should believe he is not guilty. Here is the trailer:
[video=youtube;qxgbdYaR_KQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qxgbdYaR_KQ[/video]​
 
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I don't know. I wasn't there, i haven't see the documentary, i am not a lawyer, and i'm not him.

That being said, i think it's a bit naive to believe a documentary made by an entertainment company, and trust that they presented all the facts. I'm not saying it's not factual, i just wouldn't look at the film itself as a primary source. Again though, i haven't seen it. I do find it a bit odd people seem to be jumping to conclusions about this stuff with such certainty and conviction (armchair lawyers or whatever.) Maybe i need to see it to understand, I don't know.
 
[MENTION=2240]rawr[/MENTION]: That's precisely my point! I don't believe the documentary presented all the facts. While some documentaries are excellent, and actually do a very good job of presenting multiple sides to an issue, this one clearly had an agenda. It rubbed me the wrong way, and that is why I spent some time consulting other sources on the case.

The reason I brought it up is because a lot of people have watched the documentary and are now very opinionated on the case. I was just curious if anyone else had seen it and had thoughts on it. And you don't have to be a lawyer or the defendant to have an opinion. If you haven't watched it, have no thoughts or opinions on this case, it is perfectly fine to not reply and let this thread wither and die.
 
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I've seen the documentary. I think it was written and presented to set a certain tone that this man is being victimized by the system. I think a proper documentary should talk about the facts, and only the facts, and present them in an unopinionated fashion. This doesn't count for me. It's all very one-sided and, I think, meant to instill doubt within the public to help the guy's case. Just another media outlet to sway public opinion. Had it been presented in a factual manner without the intention to brainwash my rational thought, I may have taken it seriously.
 
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I've seen the documentary. I think it was written and presented to set a certain tone that this man is being victimized by the system. I think a proper documentary should talk about the facts, and only the facts, and present them in an unopinionated fashion. This doesn't count for me. It's all very one-sided and, I think, meant to instill doubt within the public to help the guy's case. Just another media outlet to sway public opinion. Had it been presented in a factual manner without the intention to brainwash my rational thought, I may have taken it seriously.
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Yes, [MENTION=13729]Free[/MENTION] very well put. My big issue with it was that to believe he was not guilty would require to believe someone else was guilty. Given that Avery called the victim 3x according to cell phone records to get her to come to his property where, by all accounts, she was last seen, and given that her car was found there and her remains were found there, it beggars belief to stretch that someone in law enforcement (or even another Avery) had anything to do with it.
 
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PintoBean said:
Yes, [MENTION=13729]Free[/MENTION] very well put. My big issue with it was that to believe he was not guilty would require to believe someone else was guilty. Given that Avery called the victim 3x according to cell phone records to get her to come to his property where, by all accounts, she was last seen, and given that her car was found there and her remains were found there, it beggars belief to stretch that someone in law enforcement (or even another Avery) had anything to do with it.
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Exactly. I know there are some cases where innocence is found after conviction, but I simply do not think that will be the case with this man. He's pointing the finger at an entire jurisdiction being guilty of a conspiracy cover-up of his own actions. I personally think his previous case of the same crime that proved him innocent left him feeling a little too safe that he could successfully manipulate the system, and he's continuing to attempt to do so.
 
One thing I will say though is that I am not 100% about the nephew, Dassey. He is so low IQ that, while the confession is clearly not coerced, it is spoon fed. It is a classic low IQ thing to do confess to anything in hopes of leaving faster. He actually confessed to slashing the victim's throat (which given the lack of DNA in the garage, seems impossible), and then asked if he could leave in time to make it to his 6th hour class.
 
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PintoBean said:
One thing I will say though is that I am not 100% about the nephew, Dassey. He is so low IQ that, while the confession is clearly not coerced, it is spoon fed. It is a classic low IQ thing to do confess to anything in hopes of leaving faster. He actually confessed to slashing the victim's throat (which given the lack of DNA in the bedroom, seems impossible), and then asked if he could leave in time to make it to his 6th hour class.
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I agree. I'm not sold on the nephew either for the same reasons. I think he is being used a pawn... on both sides. One to prove guilt, and the other to prove innocence. He was used by both parties and his true guilt may only be that of trying to help his uncle and also being swayed into thinking he could help himself through confession.
 
Ok, in all honesty, I fell asleep watching this thing so I don't know a the details. What I do know, especially reading that article jacobi posted, is that I think he's guilty and his poor dumb nephew tried to help him.
 
Free said:
I agree. I'm not sold on the nephew either for the same reasons. I think he is being used a pawn... on both sides. One to prove guilt, and the other to prove innocence. He was used by both parties and his true guilt may only be that of trying to help his uncle and also being swayed into thinking he could help himself through confession.
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Yeah, I agree. I meant garage, btw, and fixed it in my OP. I just can't tell with that kid though. On one hand, he really is too low IQ to make anything up on his own, and he did come up with some of the details himself. Also, he does confess to his mom in a recorded conversation on the phone at one point. On the other hand, I think he actually doesn't know if he was involved or not, which is a problem. A well known issue with confessions is that certain susceptible personality types (kids, mentally ill, low intelligence etc) can become convinced of things such as they only dreamed something and weren't involved, or alternatively, that they are in fact involved when they weren't after picking up info from leading questions and other sources. At this point, I doubt he could give a straight account one way or another.
 
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Misadventure said:
Ok, in all honesty, I fell asleep watching this thing so I don't know a the details. What I do know, especially reading that article jacobi posted, is that I think he's guilty and his poor dumb nephew tried to help him.
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I know! I am more surprised by the media stir it has caused rather than interested in the actual documentary. I did not find it engrossing either. I had the same issue with NPR's serial and nothing in it changed my belief in Adnan's guilt.
 
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