Treason
- Thread starter Sriracha
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Shall suffer death OR be imprisoned for no less than 5 years.....
Hmmmm pretty big chasam there.
What brings it up?
Hmmmm pretty big chasam there.
What brings it up?
sprinkles
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Probably.
Treason is a pretty broad matter that requires some latitude to deal with.
Treason is a pretty broad matter that requires some latitude to deal with.
Nothing in particular, my mind was wandering today.
(Yes, a sensor's mind is capable is doing that!)ZcM4xzkjgzCjytBc
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What she's saying is that treason isn't always black & white. The context regards eventhorizon's wondering why there is such a difference in punishment.
ZcM4xzkjgzCjytBc
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Continue the conversation, this is what I'm wanting to read.
What u want from me and what u gon get from me are two different things.
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I wonder if immigration officers let someone in, who is ISIS affiliated constitutes treason?
PintoBean
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Probably not, unless they did so in an act willful collusion. If there were enough red flags, it could be an act of criminal negligence. Or they could be held civilly liable for damages caused by the act of admitting such a person or persons.
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Sounds like your line before a mud fight. Hubba hubba.
United States
Walter Allen was convicted of treason on September 16, 1922 for taking part in the 1921 miners war with the coal companies and the US Army on Blair Mountain, West Virginia. He was sentenced to 10 years and fined. During his appealed to the Supreme Court he disappeared while out on bail. United Mineworkers of America leader William Blizzard was acquitted of the charge of treason by the jury on May 25, 1922.
Robert Henry Best, convicted of treason on April 16, 1948 and served a life sentence.
John Brown, convicted of treason against the Commonwealth of Virginia in 1859 and executed for attempting to organize armed resistance to slavery.
Iva Toguri D'Aquino, who is frequently identified with "Tokyo Rose" convicted 1949. Subsequently pardoned by President Gerald Ford.
Governor Thomas Dorr 1844, convicted of treason against the state of Rhode Island; see Dorr Rebellion; released in 1845; civil rights restored in 1851; verdict annulled in 1854.
John Fries, the leader of Fries' Rebellion, convicted of treason in 1800 along with two accomplices, and pardoned that same year by John Adams.
Mildred Gillars, also known as "Axis Sally", convicted of treason on March 8, 1949; served 12 years of a 10- to 30-year prison sentence.
Herbert Hans Haupt, German-born naturalized U.S. citizen, was convicted of treason in 1942 and executed after being named as a German spy by fellow German spies defecting to the United States.
Tomoya Kawakita, sentenced to death for treason in 1952, but eventually released by President John F. Kennedy to be deported to Japan.
Martin James Monti, United States Army Air Forces pilot, convicted of treason for defecting to the Waffen SS in 1944. He was paroled in 1960.
William Bruce Mumford, convicted of treason and hanged in 1862 for tearing down a United States flag during the American Civil War.
Aaron Dwight Stevens, took part in John Brown's raid and was executed in 1860 for treason against Virginia.
Philip Vigol and John Mitchell, convicted of treason and sentenced to hanging; pardoned by George Washington; see Whiskey Rebellion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_convicted_of_treason
Walter Allen was convicted of treason on September 16, 1922 for taking part in the 1921 miners war with the coal companies and the US Army on Blair Mountain, West Virginia. He was sentenced to 10 years and fined. During his appealed to the Supreme Court he disappeared while out on bail. United Mineworkers of America leader William Blizzard was acquitted of the charge of treason by the jury on May 25, 1922.
Robert Henry Best, convicted of treason on April 16, 1948 and served a life sentence.
John Brown, convicted of treason against the Commonwealth of Virginia in 1859 and executed for attempting to organize armed resistance to slavery.
Iva Toguri D'Aquino, who is frequently identified with "Tokyo Rose" convicted 1949. Subsequently pardoned by President Gerald Ford.
Governor Thomas Dorr 1844, convicted of treason against the state of Rhode Island; see Dorr Rebellion; released in 1845; civil rights restored in 1851; verdict annulled in 1854.
John Fries, the leader of Fries' Rebellion, convicted of treason in 1800 along with two accomplices, and pardoned that same year by John Adams.
Mildred Gillars, also known as "Axis Sally", convicted of treason on March 8, 1949; served 12 years of a 10- to 30-year prison sentence.
Herbert Hans Haupt, German-born naturalized U.S. citizen, was convicted of treason in 1942 and executed after being named as a German spy by fellow German spies defecting to the United States.
Tomoya Kawakita, sentenced to death for treason in 1952, but eventually released by President John F. Kennedy to be deported to Japan.
Martin James Monti, United States Army Air Forces pilot, convicted of treason for defecting to the Waffen SS in 1944. He was paroled in 1960.
William Bruce Mumford, convicted of treason and hanged in 1862 for tearing down a United States flag during the American Civil War.
Aaron Dwight Stevens, took part in John Brown's raid and was executed in 1860 for treason against Virginia.
Philip Vigol and John Mitchell, convicted of treason and sentenced to hanging; pardoned by George Washington; see Whiskey Rebellion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_convicted_of_treason
This helps:
Two Types of Treason
There are two ways to commit treason: levying war against the government, and providing aid or comfort to the enemy.
Levying war isn’t limited to formally declaring war. It includes any forcible opposition to the execution of a public law. Such “forcible opposition” ordinarily requires actual use of force by multiple people with the common purpose of preventing some law from being enforced. Weapons aren’t always required; sheer numbers can be enough.
Merely conspiring to overthrow the government isn’t levying war—there must be an actual assemblage of people who are ready and intend to use force. (But see “Related Crimes,” below.) So, no person acting alone can be guilty of levying war.
Providing Aid or Comfort
Providing aid or comfort to the enemy covers a variety of actions, from providing financial assistance to harboring an enemy soldier. Any intentional act that furthers the enemy’s hostile designs or weakens the United States gives aid and comfort to, and “adheres to,” the enemy.
Sympathy alone.
Sympathy for the enemy by itself doesn’t constitute aiding or comforting. Rather, the actor must take some kind of action to provide aid or comfort.
Time of war.
Treason by aiding the enemy can’t be committed during peacetime; there must be an actual enemy for the traitor to aid. The requisite enemy designation typically requires a formal declaration of war.
Attempt.
Someone can be convicted of treason even if the attempt to aid isn’t successful or the enemy’s goal isn’t achieved.
Overt Acts
In order to prove treason, the prosecution needs a either a confession or two witnesses testifying to the same “overt act” by the defendant. An overt act is an act that shows criminal intent and furthers the accomplishment of a crime. But, the overt act doesn’t have to be a crime itself. A wide range of actions can qualify as overt treasonous acts, from making online posts to providing weapons and ammunition. The key consideration is whether the defendant took the action with the intention of carrying out or furthering treason.
Treason charges must specify the relevant overt acts, including where they took place. It isn’t necessary that all the participants commit the same overt act; different participants can commit different overt acts as part of one treasonous plan. If the government alleges multiple overt acts, it need prove only one of them by two witnesses.
While testimony from two witnesses is required to prove the overt act, the intent to betray can be proved in the same way as intent for any other crime.
The First Amendment Defense
The First Amendment is the primary limitation on treason prosecutions. Freedom of speech allows people to express anger toward the government—even a desire to overthrow it—but it doesn’t protect speech that is likely to incite others to violence. (See Can I be arrested for yelling or swearing at a cop?) But, although words usually can’t constitute treason by themselves, they can serve as proof the speaker’s treasonous intent.
Related Crimes
Treason is related and similar to several crimes. More than one criminal statute can apply to the same conduct, meaning that something falling short of treason may constitute another offense.
Misprision of Treason. This crime involves someone knowing a person has committed an act of treason, failing to report it to a proper authority, and taking some action to conceal it. (For a detailed discussion of a related topic, see Misprision of Felony.)
Espionage. Espionage is obtaining classified information pertaining to national defense for use by a foreign nation. If the defendant aids a U.S. ally, treason can’t be the charge, but espionage can. For instance, Ethel and Julius Rosenberg were charged with espionage rather than treason for trying to pass atomic secrets to the Soviet Union during World War II.
Seditious Conspiracy. This offense consists of conspiring to overthrow or destroy the government by force. Unlike treason, seditious conspiracy doesn’t require that the defendant owe allegiance to the United States. (For more on conspiracy generally, see Conspiracy: Laws and Penalties.)
Terrorism. One of the differences between treason and terrorism is that terrorism statutes apply to any kind of foreign national and don’t ever require that the U.S. be at war. (There are, however, similarities between treason and terrorism-related offenses—for instance, statutes criminalize providing material support to and harboring terrorists, among other actions.) To learn more, see Terrorist Threats.
Conspiracy to Levy War. This precursor to treason doesn’t require that people be assembled and ready to use force.
http://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/resources/treason.htm
Two Types of Treason
There are two ways to commit treason: levying war against the government, and providing aid or comfort to the enemy.
Levying war isn’t limited to formally declaring war. It includes any forcible opposition to the execution of a public law. Such “forcible opposition” ordinarily requires actual use of force by multiple people with the common purpose of preventing some law from being enforced. Weapons aren’t always required; sheer numbers can be enough.
Merely conspiring to overthrow the government isn’t levying war—there must be an actual assemblage of people who are ready and intend to use force. (But see “Related Crimes,” below.) So, no person acting alone can be guilty of levying war.
Providing Aid or Comfort
Providing aid or comfort to the enemy covers a variety of actions, from providing financial assistance to harboring an enemy soldier. Any intentional act that furthers the enemy’s hostile designs or weakens the United States gives aid and comfort to, and “adheres to,” the enemy.
Sympathy alone.
Sympathy for the enemy by itself doesn’t constitute aiding or comforting. Rather, the actor must take some kind of action to provide aid or comfort.
Time of war.
Treason by aiding the enemy can’t be committed during peacetime; there must be an actual enemy for the traitor to aid. The requisite enemy designation typically requires a formal declaration of war.
Attempt.
Someone can be convicted of treason even if the attempt to aid isn’t successful or the enemy’s goal isn’t achieved.
Overt Acts
In order to prove treason, the prosecution needs a either a confession or two witnesses testifying to the same “overt act” by the defendant. An overt act is an act that shows criminal intent and furthers the accomplishment of a crime. But, the overt act doesn’t have to be a crime itself. A wide range of actions can qualify as overt treasonous acts, from making online posts to providing weapons and ammunition. The key consideration is whether the defendant took the action with the intention of carrying out or furthering treason.
Treason charges must specify the relevant overt acts, including where they took place. It isn’t necessary that all the participants commit the same overt act; different participants can commit different overt acts as part of one treasonous plan. If the government alleges multiple overt acts, it need prove only one of them by two witnesses.
While testimony from two witnesses is required to prove the overt act, the intent to betray can be proved in the same way as intent for any other crime.
The First Amendment Defense
The First Amendment is the primary limitation on treason prosecutions. Freedom of speech allows people to express anger toward the government—even a desire to overthrow it—but it doesn’t protect speech that is likely to incite others to violence. (See Can I be arrested for yelling or swearing at a cop?) But, although words usually can’t constitute treason by themselves, they can serve as proof the speaker’s treasonous intent.
Related Crimes
Treason is related and similar to several crimes. More than one criminal statute can apply to the same conduct, meaning that something falling short of treason may constitute another offense.
Misprision of Treason. This crime involves someone knowing a person has committed an act of treason, failing to report it to a proper authority, and taking some action to conceal it. (For a detailed discussion of a related topic, see Misprision of Felony.)
Espionage. Espionage is obtaining classified information pertaining to national defense for use by a foreign nation. If the defendant aids a U.S. ally, treason can’t be the charge, but espionage can. For instance, Ethel and Julius Rosenberg were charged with espionage rather than treason for trying to pass atomic secrets to the Soviet Union during World War II.
Seditious Conspiracy. This offense consists of conspiring to overthrow or destroy the government by force. Unlike treason, seditious conspiracy doesn’t require that the defendant owe allegiance to the United States. (For more on conspiracy generally, see Conspiracy: Laws and Penalties.)
Terrorism. One of the differences between treason and terrorism is that terrorism statutes apply to any kind of foreign national and don’t ever require that the U.S. be at war. (There are, however, similarities between treason and terrorism-related offenses—for instance, statutes criminalize providing material support to and harboring terrorists, among other actions.) To learn more, see Terrorist Threats.
Conspiracy to Levy War. This precursor to treason doesn’t require that people be assembled and ready to use force.
http://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/resources/treason.htm
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I wonder if deliberately taking it easy on an enemy who has sworn war with America constitutes treason.
PintoBean
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As in an immigration officer letting them into the country on purpose? Yes, it would be an act of collusion.
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I was thinking more like not making a decisive plan or not making any plan at all to deal with them.
sprinkles
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It is broad. For example being a janitor for the enemy is a hell of a lot different than being a soldier for the enemy and killing people.
sprinkles
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If that were treason it would make a large portion of the population complicit.
sprinkles
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[MENTION=8603]Eventhorizon[/MENTION]
Actually it's not treason when the government does it, because they can avoid it through the loophole of not declaring an enemy. No enemy, no treason. However this could apply to military some times. For example you are ordered to do something about the enemy and you passive aggressively fail that order on purpose.
Actually it's not treason when the government does it, because they can avoid it through the loophole of not declaring an enemy. No enemy, no treason. However this could apply to military some times. For example you are ordered to do something about the enemy and you passive aggressively fail that order on purpose.
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Excellent point.