Condolences for King Abdullah

This also goes back to the 1979 Siege of Mecca. Since then, the Saudis have attempted to reduce the threat of Islamist extremism at home by redirecting it abroad, turning jihad into a sort of quasi-official foreign policy.

That same year, the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan. The Saudi government, which hated the Soviets and saw them as a threat, sought to support Afghan rebels. Here was an opportunity: the Muslim world was outraged by the Soviet invasion. The Saudi government implicitly encouraged their country's Wahhabi clerical establishment, recently rich with oil money and dangerously idle, to fund extremist Afghan rebels, and rebel-training extremist madrassas in neighboring Pakistan. Many young Saudi Wahhabis went off themselves to fight, usually quite poorly.

For the Saudi rulers, this foreign policy of jihad was at first a great success. It strengthened Saudi Arabia's effort to fund Afghan rebels, it positioned the often-lecherous Saudi monarchs as leaders of the Muslim world against the Soviet atheists, and, crucially, it distracted the Wahhabis from causing trouble at home. But this strategy was destined to backfire, and disastrously. Those jihadists would inevitably turn their guns on the very Saudi government that had enabled their creation, just as the Ikhwan of the 1920s and the cultists of the 1970s had done. The most famous of those was Osama bin Laden.

In 1991, Saudi Arabia again faced much the same problem it had in 1979. Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait; the Saudis, fearing they could be next, invited the US military to station thousands of troops in the Kingdom. The Wahhabis were outraged, seeing this as a humiliation and a desecration of Muslim holy land, and openly hinted they might support a coup or violent uprising. Meanwhile, many Saudi jihadists had returned home from Afghanistan, giving the threats real teeth.

Fearing another 1979-style terror attack of worse, the Saudis once again co-opted and appeased the Wahhabis. They did this in part by shutting down some nascent reforms — some women had begun to drive in defiance of the female driving ban; initially tolerated, they were shut down. They also established the Ministry of Islamic Affairs, which ostensibly supported Islamic charities but also funded Wahhabi extremism and jihadism throughout the Muslim world. It worked; the Wahhabi establishment directed their energies toward causing trouble abroad, which the Saudis tolerated. At the same time, the Saudis also cracked down on Wahhabists who would not get in line, including by deporting a well-known veteran of the Afghan jihad named Osama bin Laden. copied VOX

http://www.vox.com/2015/1/26/7877619/saudi-arabia-questions
 
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In 1979, Saudi Arabia could have been an Islamic Revolution just like Iran. It did not. It made decisions to avoid that; decisions that could have merely slowed down inevitable actions and reactions by the Islamic radicals of the land. Saudi Arabia, like it or not, stood up against the fire sweeping the area. Saudi Arabia's future lies on the balancing weights and balances. The future of the Middle East could be greatly affected; the future of the world. The aging King went to great lengths to help insure the stability of the transition after his death: plans that could very well help to keep Islam from becoming so radicalized, as to help keep it from a very costly World War against it.
 
They're about money and stability. Not about ethics or equal human rights.
Stability is a good thing, but they create it at the cost of stability elsewhere. That's quite selfish.
 
They're about money and stability. Not about ethics or equal human rights.
Stability is a good thing, but they create it at the cost of stability elsewhere. That's quite selfish.

Should America take care of our poor before we help to care for the starving of the world, we come under fire from both directions. It might be more than difficult to deal with many different armed tribes who believe in Sharia Law because Islam was founded there...........not in Jerusalem, by the way. America cracks down on something at home and the police are blamed for being too hard on the people. Try dealing with rich groups with automatic Kalashnikovs and RPGs. Crack down on it, and figure you are the next target for the world to attack. Human rights violations from external sources, to being labeled an infidel locally. You may need allies one day, too, judging from looking around them. Theirs is a balancing act unlike most.
 
Theirs is a balancing act unlike most.

It is. And they're doing pretty good. I just heavily disagree with the ethics they balance towards. Stoning, cutting of hands, women can't drive, you don't want to be homosexual there, etc etc.
 
It is. And they're doing pretty good. I just heavily disagree with the ethics they balance towards. Stoning, cutting of hands, women can't drive, you don't want to be homosexual there, etc etc.

They don't have the budget America has for prisons, though. I was always amazed at how people would step away from something there, as they did not want to be accused of anything like stealing. It works. Here? Repeat offenders. Shootings every night. In jail and back out to rape someone's daughter. Human rights has its place, but one should not abuse the rights of others. A slap on the hand or the loss of a hand? Deterrent. None here. Here: let me give you a hand....

I believe stoning to be too much. I'll not get into all their beliefs.
 
They don't have the budget America has for prisons, though. I was always amazed at how people would step away from something there, as they did not want to be accused of anything like stealing. It works. Here? Repeat offenders. Shootings every night. In jail and back out to rape someone's daughter. Human rights has its place, but one should not abuse the rights of others. A slap on the hand or the loss of a hand? Deterrent. None here. Here: let me give you a hand....

I see your point. I fully agree that the American prison system is ridiculous. It costs a lot of money and when they get free they just repeat it. Luckily I'm from a country in Europe where our prisons are so emtpy that we rent out prison space to neighbouring countries.

Education, therapy etc etc is what works. It solves the problem long term, because they are much less likely to repeat. Also it means there's more money available for better purposes like general education (which I believe lowers crime even further).

The way America uses prisons is just dumb.
The way S-A threatens to cut of hands is unethical. And it works.
Just like if I hold a gun against your head and tell you to do something. That works too.
 
I see your point. I fully agree that the American prison system is ridiculous. It costs a lot of money and when they get free they just repeat it. Luckily I'm from a country in Europe where our prisons are so emtpy that we rent out prison space to neighbouring countries.

Education, therapy etc etc is what works. It solves the problem long term, because they are much less likely to repeat. Also it means there's more money available for better purposes like general education (which I believe lowers crime even further).

The way America uses prisons is just dumb.
The way S-A threatens to cut of hands is unethical. And it works.
Just like if I hold a gun against your head and tell you to do something. That works too.

You would be in trouble if you hadn't pulled the trigger.
I see you acknowledge something that might sound unethical to some folk works for others.
No way education and therapy would help empty America's prisons. Might work somewhere else.
 
Yeah, but just because it works for them doesn't mean I agree or would do it the same. Although obviously I have easy talking from a first world country.

No way education and therapy would help empty America's prisons. Might work somewhere else.
If it was that simple, they'd already done it.
I think it would work though. Start investing now. In 50 years you might see result.
Maybe it's more of a cultural thing though. Especially with tolerance.

Actually a few days ago I saw an article about understanding paedophiles.
That research indicated that they're born with it etc. How we can treat it.
Social isolation increases chances of misconduct etc.
I was quite surprised by the comments on the article. Most were anti paedophile-hating. Saying things that they're also human. Also deserve a social life. And agreed with the notion that if the entire world excluded them they'll look for their own social life with those that don't exclude them: children.

Ah I found a possible answer.
America is all about free will and making your own dream.
I think in Europe we're less about free will, but more about nature and nurture determining our behaviour. A possible line of thought would be: If someone is a criminal it's because he/she wasn't raised properly as a child. We need to "raise" the criminal and teach all future parents to be good parents.

And that's what I mean with education.
I don't live in the US, so I'll take your word over my ideal.
 
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Get used to it, because it's being forced down our throats next.
 
KING ABDULLAH CAN SUCK IT.
 
It's unamerican to recognize the title of king.
 
http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2015/03/08/400834/Riyadh-biggest-terror-exporter

[h=2]German official says Saudi Arabia top ‘terror exporter’ in Mideast[/h]
A senior German official has called for the reconsideration of Germany’s arms exports to Saudi Arabia, describing the monarchy as the leading exporter of terrorism in the Middle East.
Vice President of the German Parliament (Bundestag) Claudia Roth put forward the demand in an interview with German newspaper Welt am Sonntag printed on Sunday.
Roth (shown below) called Riyadh “the top terror exporter in the Middle East,” adding that “a large portion” of extremist militants in Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq hail from Saudi Arabia.
fbe53696-b3f3-431e-b668-c419452711a7.jpg

Germany’s guidelines on weapons exports make it “crystal clear that deliveries cannot be made to such countries,” she stressed.
The Green party's politician also called for the release of Saudi activist Raif Badawi who is sentenced to 10 years in prison and 1,000 lashes.
“Besides the weapons deals, Germany is also discussing other trade ties with Saudi Arabia,” she said. “Pressure could certainly be brought to bear using these.”
The comments came as German Vice Chancellor, Social Democrat leader and Economy and Energy Minister Sigmar Gabriel kicked off his tour of the Middle East in Riyadh on Saturday.
The oil-rich country is reported to be “one of the most important clients of Germany’s arms industry.”
Riyadh world’s biggest arms importer
A new report shows that Saudi Arabia has overtaken India to become the largest arms importer in the world over the last year.
The kingdom’s military spending jumped 54 percent to USD 6.5 billion in 2014, while New Delhi imported USD 5.8 billion worth of weapons, said a Sunday report by IHS Inc, a leading analyst of the global arms trade.
3689dca5-4e14-44e3-922f-7f75b26b020a.jpg

“Growth in Saudi Arabia has been dramatic and, based on previous orders, these numbers are not going to slow down,” said Ben Moores, the report's author.
Saudi Imports will rise 52 percent to reach USD 9.8 billion in the current year, which means one out of every seven dollars spent on arms imports worldwide will be spent by Saudi Arabia.
Riyadh is said to be one of the major supporters of Takfiri militants wreaking havoc in Iraq and Syria. Saudi Arabia also backs the Bahraini regime in its crackdown on pro-democracy protesters.
66becd48-3053-4126-950d-ec09470533d9.jpg

The results of a recent survey conducted for German daily Bild have shown that 78 percent of Germans believe Berlin should stop selling arms to Saudi Arabia, while a further 60 percent favor breaking off trade relations all together with the Persian Gulf monarchy due to its human rights violations.
MR/HSN/HMV
 
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