Do people realise the truth about power?

[David Nelson]

I'm not conflating anything, I think you are minimizing people's overall intelligence/learning ability.
And at the same time ignorant of people's overall inability to do a lot of complex things.

It's specifically elite interest at the expense of the rest of society. Not just elite interest in keeping their own countries wealth (which they benefit from). US foreign policy has always been that way, stifling democracy abroad to maintain sweatshops and keep labour cost down. Many believe the cold war was the fight for capitalism over communism. But it wasnt; it was the fear of an economic system which would threaten elite privileged interest. But most frame it as an argument for a better economic system. Elites don't believe in any economic theory, only their own interests., yet most capitalists say communism/socialism "doesn't work" etc. They fail to grasp that it's not the overal countries interest which is fought for, it's purely elite privilege. That's why you don't hear capitalists arguing for fascism, when in fact Hitler's ideology lives on in US foreign and some domestic policies. A retired US president said as much (that Hitler's ideology wasn't defeated)

 

[Wyote]

Elites don't believe in any economic theory, only their own interests

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

I think it happens naturally through people's common self interest (most people aren't INFJs lol). It's not like a widespread conspiracy. Much of it happens becuase people go along with the status quo and resist change. Many involved proably truly believe the lies themselves. I think that's why many cannot easily comprehend these ideas.

You missed the point by country miles but Moranga got it so keep trying.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

So everyone has read Chomsky? As someone else said, most people don't read books, and the books about this stuff are pretty niche. How else are people going to know this stuff? I am certain you are wrong.

The problem isn't that people don't read books or not but rather when the adhere to the idea/notion that the only truth is found there even to the point of becoming like the age old "Bible thumper" where such individuals are not only behind the times but are closed off to new ideas. The same can be said of the digital age with the Blue Check Mark generations only reading from approved sources and opinions.

 

[David Nelson]

You missed the point by country miles but Moranga got it so keep trying.

Moranga says 90% are stuck behind the veils, but you're saying the opposite, so please make sense. I think you failed to understand my point also, but keep posting sarcy comments.

 

[David Nelson]

The problem isn't that people don't read books or not but rather when the adhere to the idea/notion that the only truth is found there even to the point of becoming like the age old "Bible thumper" where such individuals are not only behind the times but are closed off to new ideas. The same can be said of the digital age with the Blue Check Mark generations only reading from approved sources and opinions.

So where do you get your information from? Is Chomsky wrong? If so, when and how? It makes no sense to junk all sources because they may not be perfect. That's literally throwing the baby out with the bathwater, just what elites want you to do. OR maybe you are an elite?

 

[David Nelson]

You missed the point by country miles but Moranga got it so keep trying.

This point is ridiculous and highly offensive to me. I notice you have a habit of talking rubbish, as you did soon after I joined the forum. You didn't win then either. Probably just sent loads of private comms to mates on this forum slaggin me.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

This point is ridiculous and highly offensive to me. I notice you have a habit of talking rubbish, as you did soon after I joined the forum. You didn't win then either. Probably just sent loads of private comms to mates on this forum slaggin me.

Again you need to keep trying, as for the accusation no not all and the mods here can prove that I haven't been conversed with anyone here with personal messages in days.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

So where do you get your information from? Is Chomsky wrong? If so, when and how? It makes no sense to junk all sources because they may not be perfect. That's literally throwing the baby out with the bathwater, just what elites want you to do. OR maybe you are an elite?

I prefer lots of sources preferably unrelated so that I can collect from as perspectives as I like especially when something good or even useful is had from reading between the lines.

This will get you a little more up to speed.

 

[David Nelson]

I won't communicate with people who throw general, vague insults without debating where they have other opinions. It's childish and disrespectful. It's probably a sign you either can't debate, know you are wrong or are trying to look superior without actually being it. I will always give my honest opinion. We might find a point of difference, but don't get all personal and superior.

 

[David Nelson]

'Up to speed'
More patronisation.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

I won't communicate with people who throw general, vague insults without debating where they have other opinions. It's childish and disrespectful. It's probably a sign you either can't debate, know you are wrong or are trying to look superior without actually being it. I will always give my honest opinion. We might find a point of difference, but don't get all personal and superior.

You should consider listening to William Cooper's programs from the 90s and you'll understand what I was trying to go with this. Those elites more or less belong to some strange cults and there one begins to understand their motives beyond just the usual greed.

 

[aeon]

The control system that blankets humanities ability to perceive the truth has been in place for a long time. They mastered the ability to rewrite history and control the core beliefs that humans base and create their understanding from. Its no ones fault that they cannot see it or are only now starting to see it. You will continue to follow the rails installed in your youth until you truly accept the possibility that everything you know is wrong. 90% will remain stuck behind those veils. Being ignorant to what is going on behind the veils doesn't make their experience any less real. It does not make the love and happiness shared in good times fake. They just lived their lives without understanding. That's why it is almost impossible to make it click.

Beautifully said.

Cheers,
Ian

 

[David Nelson]

You should consider listening to William Cooper's programs from the 90s and you'll understand what I was trying to go with this. Those elites more or less belong to some strange cults and there one begins to understand their motives beyond just the usual greed.

Conspiracy theories. Well the elites I am talking about are not just the very few at the top. The overclass can be as much as 10% of society, and these all benefit from the status quo and inequality. There are clearly real and false conspiracies. I've heard of the Bilderberg Group and Mont Pelerin Society etc. Sure some political idealogues have conspired since the 60s to take apart democratic pluralism, and largely succeeded. One of my points is that many in the overclass may be politically naive and ignorant, yet still benefit from what has happended over the last few decades. The whole overlass doesn't have meetings to discuss a plan, but there surely are also bad actors with influence and power who use it. A good way to shed light on these issues is to think logically. Is it likely those with power will act in their own self interest? Obviously yes. Is it likely some will overestimate the nature and number of conspiracies? Yes. The truth is usually between the extremes.

I hope you are not implying Noam Chomsky is spreading conspiracies. He's probably the most important academic/intellectual alive today. If there were more conspiracies, someone as controversial and critical of US policy as Noam would have been bumped off years ago.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

Conspiracy theories. Well the elites I am talking about are not just the very few at the top. The overclass can be as much as 10% of society, and these all benefit from the status quo and inequality. There are clearly real and false conspiracies. I've heard of the Bilderberg Group and Mont Pelerin Society etc. Sure some political idealogues have conspired since the 60s to take apart democratic pluralism, and largely succeeded. One of my points is that many in the overclass may be politically naive and ignorant, yet still benefit from what has happended over the last few decades. The whole overlass doesn't have meetings to discuss a plan, but there surely are also bad actors with influence and power who use it. A good way to shed light on these issues is to think logically. Is it likely those with power will act in their own self interest? Obviously yes. Is it likely some will overestimate the nature and number of conspiracies? Yes. The truth is usually between the extremes.

I hope you are not implying Noam Chomsky is spreading conspiracies. He's probably the most important academic/intellectual alive today. If there were more conspiracies, someone as controversial and critical of US policy as Noam would have been bumped off years ago.

There is your problem, you are limiting yourself from really getting to the root of this. If you are going to understand them at all you need to understand their motives and their belief systems beyond just their policies otherwise you'll only see what they want everyone to see after all the stuffed suits are only there as a distraction as always. 10% is a huge overstatement as everyone just refers them as the 1%ers which in reality is much smaller than that while the upper to comfortable middle class are just management to keep the whole thing going while the elites only need to bother themselves with policy without much concern for day to day management.

 

[David Nelson]

So what are their beliefs and motives? I can bet you most of them don't have anyhitng more important than economic entitlement. Sure some/most will have more money than they can spend so will be chasing other goals, but they have to have the finances as top priority.
10% is the overclass in a book I have. Yes people often talk about the 1% ers, and there are the even rarer top elites. I don't see why you can't just tell me what you know or think. Do you think they'll come after you if you do lol?

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

So what are their beliefs and motives? I can bet you most of them don't have anyhitng more important than economic entitlement. Sure some/most will have more money than they can spend so will be chasing other goals, but they have to have the finances as top priority.
10% is the overclass in a book I have. Yes people often talk about the 1% ers, and there are the even rarer top elites. I don't see why you can't just tell me what you know or think. Do you think they'll come after you if you do lol?

You already own everything money doesn't mean much, the game is about control and influence be it over society as well sometimes nations should one have gotten to that level.

 

[David Nelson]

There's a video on YT where Noam Chomsky is challenged with the idea that how could all the people in the media be biased without them all being in on a conspiracy. His answer was that those in the media would simply not have been chosen had they seen thigns differently. It's editing by selection/ommission. You are chosen if you are on the same page as them, if not, you won't be allowed in. Then, once in, you will be given the bias and influence required.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

 

[David Nelson]

Was thinking about Eyes Wide Shut before. Very appropriate!
Kill List has similar themes.