Do you believe in Karma?

[Adymus]

So that's your argument then, because we don't understand how it might happen, we know it can't exist?

Let me ask you, do you think we know how an electron or photon while in quantum superposition happens to be at every possible location, yet as soon as it is observed it is only in one? Or how in our universe we are observing stars and galaxies farther away in light years than can be accounted for by its age? Or how the placebo effect works?

Either all of these represent some kind of massive conspiracy, or simply because we don't know how something works, doesn't mean that said thing cannot exist.

No, my argument is that it's existence is highly improbable and that it does not fit anywhere with what we do understand of the universe. Sure It's possible, but it is also possible that the universe was hand crafted by an ancient race of macaroni pictures, that doesn't mean we should actually start considering this as a probable cause.

Every example you gave are observable phenomena, something we can actually witness occurring and then examine how it works. Karma is at best a superstition. It just so happens that the allegedly "observed" Karma looks no different than random chance. So sure, you could speculate that there is some hand that is guiding these occurrences based on some form of cosmic justice, or I could just invoke Okham's Razor and say "Probably not."

 

[Jack]

No, my argument is that it's existence is highly improbable and that it does not fit anywhere with what we do understand of the universe. Sure It's possible, but it is also possible that the universe was hand crafted by an ancient race of macaroni pictures, that doesn't mean we should actually start considering this as a probable cause.

Every example you gave are observable phenomena, something we can actually witness occurring and then examine how it works. Karma is at best a superstition. It just so happens that the allegedly "observed" Karma looks no different than random chance. So sure, you could speculate that there is some hand that is guiding these occurrences based on some form of cosmic justice, or I could just invoke Okham's Razor and say "Probably not."

1 Improbable? What basis do you have for measuring its probability? What makes it improbable?

2 Of course I gave examples of observable phenomena, if I didn't you would find it easier to argue that indeed the examples I gave didn't exist.

3 Lastly, who is "we" when you say "it does not fit anywhere with what we do understand of the universe." I suspect you are trying to speak for all of humanity, but I would point out that not all of humanity adheres to strict empiricism, even many who see great value in the input of science.

 

[Adymus]

1 Improbable? What basis do you have for measuring its probability? What makes it improbable?

2 Of course I gave examples of observable phenomena, if I didn't you would find it easier to argue that indeed the examples I gave didn't exist.

3 Lastly, who is "we" when you say "it does not fit anywhere with what we do understand of the universe." I suspect you are trying to speak for all of humanity, but I would point out that not all of humanity adheres to strict empiricism, even many who see great value in the input of science.

1. Because it is a single possibility, not based on anything testable or observable. Just another possibility floating in the infinite sea other possibilities, if you were to bet on one of them being correct, you would essentially have a one out of infinity shot at being correct. In other words, highly unlikely.

2. Science is not a democracy.

 

[Jack]

1. Because it is a single possibility, not based on anything testable or observable. Just another possibility floating in the infinite sea other possibilities, if you were to bet on one of them being correct, you would essentially have a one out of infinity shot at being correct. In other words, highly unlikely.

2. Science is not a democracy.

1 Evidence comes in other forms than just empirical.
2 There is more to the world than science. As valuable and useful as it is, not everyone sees it as the only arbiter of truth.

 

[Ecton]

Having worked in science, I would say science at its best is a Reproduce-ocracy. At its average it is a Funding-ocracy. And at its worst it is an Ego-ocracy, But that's living, breathing science. The nice and settled bits are far less dirty.

 

[Adymus]

1 Evidence comes in other forms than just empirical.
2 There is more to the world than science. As valuable and useful as it is, not everyone sees it as the only arbiter of truth.

I don't disagree with that, but still, not all possibilities are created equal, we can and should be ranking their likelihood. Nor does it even matter that not everyone agrees that science holds all truths, believing in something does not effect the likelihood of it being real.

*Sigh* This is got old several posts ago, and it is getting no where. I am not going to change my opinion just because there is an infinitesimal possibility that Karma could be real.

 

[Jack]

I don't disagree with that, but still, not all possibilities are created equal, we can and should be ranking their likelihood. Nor does it even matter that not everyone agrees that science holds all truths, believing in something does not effect the likelihood of it being real.

*Sigh* This is got old several posts ago, and it is getting no where. I am not going to change my opinion just because there is an infinitesimal possibility that Karma could be real.

I definitely agree with you that not all possibilities are created equal (that sounds odd for some reason) I just like to keep in mind that science isn't the only thing to take into account in deciding what is real.

In any case, I don't believe in Karma either, (except maybe as a proverb) I wanted to make a point.

Although, I am kind of curious about your idea of balance with regard to life/death, and how it works with the second law and all that, but if you don't want to get into that now its fine.

 

[Jack]

Having worked in science, I would say science at its best is a Reproduce-ocracy. At its average it is a Funding-ocracy. And at its worst it is an Ego-ocracy, But that's living, breathing science. The nice and settled bits are far less dirty.

Oh yeah, I believe you. I have 3 cousins working in various fields, and they tell me aaaaalllll about it.

 

[under skies]

I believe that people who make an effort to do "good" things are more likely to notice when small but pleasant things happen to them. People who go out of their way to be cruel are more likely to be more pessimistic. I think it has more to do with perspective.

That said, I did once find a $100 bill in a Walmart parking lot just after buying someone a very expensive gift.