Then the moment God begat His Son, there were two, there was relationship, and time naturally spawned into existence. Not because God created it, but because it is a natural consequence of relationship itself.
I am an arch-heretic. I am not Trinitarian. I do not believe the atonement was finished at the cross. And I believe Christ took upon Himself sinful flesh.
So, I am out of the club! Lost for sure!
Well, the way I understand it, Christ was begotten of His Father. Uncreated divine essence of the Father proceeded forth from Him and somehow is the Son. So, to me, the Son of God had a beginning. When He was begotten.Since the Son is not a created being, he is not temporal in that relationship. He becomes temporal with the Immaculate Conception.
So I don't think time is a consequence of that primordial relationship. It is an eternal relationship (i.e. timeless).
Well, the way I understand it, Christ was begotten of His Father. Uncreated divine essence of the Father proceeded forth from Him and somehow is the Son. So, to me, the Son of God had a beginning. When He was begotten.
Yes, Ren. Post #56.Do you believe in Christ's two natures, 'fully man and fully God'?
I think it is orthodox to consider that Christ, as fully man, was capable of sin. But that he did not, in fact, sin.
Only by being capable of sin, but being pure of it in fact, was he able to redeem mankind.
Yes, Ren, Post #48.I struggle to reconcile the idea of having a temporal beginning and being God.
I'd tend to opt for the idea that non-physical causation can be intelligible outside of temporality.
But this might be fluff, I don't know lol. It's all quite mysterious, after all.
I'm also not all that convinced it was actually immaculate. I accept that Christ is important and was therefore conceived importantly and even with the announcements of angels, but I'm thinking it's more of the deeper meaning of it rather than the actual "immaculateness" of it. It's like miracles which I believe truly happen everyday but just not as grandiose or not with as much magic realism. However, the meaning and even its minute occurrence remains equally magical to me in as much as Christ remains supremely Godly to me because damn, sin is a weird thing.Immaculate Conception
So yeah, I am also a heretic. Welcome to the club!
It causes me severe distress that I can't contribute to this topic while being juxtaposed with the feeling that this will be immensely important to me in retaining telos henceforth.
I'm also not all that convinced it was actually immaculate. I accept that Christ is important and was therefore conceived importantly and even with the announcements of angels, but I'm thinking it's more of the deeper meaning of it rather than the actual "immaculateness" of it. It's like miracles which I believe truly happen everyday but just not as grandiose or not with as much magic realism. However, the meaning and even its minute occurrence remains equally magical to me in as much as Christ remains supremely Godly to me because damn, sin is a weird thing.
It causes me severe distress that I can't contribute to this topic while being juxtaposed with the feeling that this will be immensely important to me in retaining telos henceforth.
More like still God the Son but through Joseph's sperm.Unless you think God the Son decided to temporarily dwell in the body of Jesus the man. But then, it's not "two natures in one person", but two natures in two persons.
More like still God the Son but through Joseph's sperm.
Why can't you, though?
Well, essentially in my book God is a father to all of us. I'm a single person too but although not of the same precise likeness as Christ, I am also a child of God. I see it as this.So Joseph would be Jesus's human father, and God the Father would be his divine father.
Hence, two persons. No? Wouldn't a single person have a single father?
Good point. She as a vessel that is pure and has never been defiled.By the way, the Immaculate Conception is the view that Mary was conceived immaculately in order to be a suitable vessel for Christ. It does not refer to Christ's conception.
How can we categorically decide that Christ is not divine if God is alpha and omega, among us and within us?But if Christ has a human mommy and daddy, then he's human but not divine.
Hey!! I tried for once!!! Hahaha.