[INFJ] ESFP

@jonjairo I don't know what this means, myself. Do you want to have a marriage where you're doing more enjoyable things together than you're doing? Or where there's less of this "filth" (whatever that means)? Or something else?
 
Sloe Djinn said:
Filthy is what the F in INFJ stands for. They’re all just a bunch of dirty, dirty birds.
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jonjairo said:
I expected to see a lot less filth on this forum from INFJ but apparently i was wrong in that. Not sure if its the other types on here or if even INFJs are like that too.

Im married to an ESFP and i hate how i always feel like she cant understand or appreciate my feelings and what not, not sure how to explain it. Like im too sentimental and im wasting it all with someone who doesnt even care, i expect that from everyone else but was hoping she would be different

my question is, are other INFJs any different or are all human beings selfish and unable to appreciate this
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Just read Jung when it comes to contemporary psychology and types -- read the classics.
Expect everyone here to be intelligent, but don't expect more than introspection and reflection.
 
jonjairo said:
I expected to see a lot less filth on this forum from INFJ but apparently i was wrong in that. Not sure if its the other types on here or if even INFJs are like that too.

Im married to an ESFP and i hate how i always feel like she cant understand or appreciate my feelings and what not, not sure how to explain it. Like im too sentimental and im wasting it all with someone who doesnt even care, i expect that from everyone else but was hoping she would be different

my question is, are other INFJs any different or are all human beings selfish and unable to appreciate this
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You are each other’s inferior type so your marriage is bound to be filled with mystery. She will overwhelm you and you will baffle her. An inferior Ni/Se relationship is always going to be chaotic to some extent because your natural way of behaving can easily trigger grippy behaviour in the other. But when you get it right you can share a magic relationship - it’s just not so easy to do this consciously. As the INFJ it’s mainly your job to find a way of making it happen because Ni is better at understanding what is going on here and feeling what will work for the other. The key is in what you can do for your wife on her territory - she’s unlikely to come onto yours unless you do this first. I’m assuming you have typed yourselves accurately.
 
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jonjairo said:
well obviously its a problem for us thats why,
phil so you never could resolve it?
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No .. it got worse as time went by. I wanted her to see this bright inner world that I have and she just couldn't understand.

In the end it affected me negatively that she didn't want to share her feelings, share her thoughts. I don't know why I need this from a partner but I just do! I felt more and more alone as time went by and we became more distant. In the end we parted ways, well she parted ways with me :)

To me there was a basic incompatibility. That is not to blame her for what happened .. it takes two to tango of course.

I tried communicating. I tried to get her to put her ideas across on how we could connect more deeply. She just wasn't an open book and didn't want to try. From my own side I didn't want to discard a vibrant inner world to be more like her.

I think we were truly at two opposite ends of the spectrum. I'm truly surprised it lasted fifteen years.
 
jonjairo said:
I expected to see a lot less filth on this forum from INFJ but apparently i was wrong in that.
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As a means to clarity, who and what exactly is meant by filth?

Perhaps a more serious room other than the forum lounge would produce less filthy advice? This is one reasoning behind categorizing threads according to content. So that the more sensitive members know where not to tread to avoid offense.

Please, take a moment to reflect that we are all a motley crew of personality here in the INFJ forum. :)
 
I can't help but feel like this thread is a another example of people letting MBTI types get entirely too much into their heads. On both sides in this instance. Some are personally being offended by a statement that was clearly targeted to people as a whole as a man was disappointed in what he saw. He thought too highly of INFJs and got a large reality smack with whatever he read here. Forget filth, how many egos are here? Some are hypocrites who don't take own advice or views and enjoy over extending their charisma or self-proclaimed confidence for selfish boosts or attention. Often paired with very careful, Passive-Aggressiveness.

I didn't know a single paragraph from someone tells you everything about them in an instant and justifies and fortifies any intuition you may have. Do some even ponder they could be wrong? And can't a person just be hurting and/or having a bad day? As if you never said things you didn't necessarily mean before. I wouldn't dare call anyone filth nor am I backing him up, but yes, at times I get where OP is actually coming from. Hence why I'm even posting this. Another serious topic and person looking for guidance being turned into a playground for kudos and jokes at someelse's expense. Good job on out-casting people who think differently than you or are just hurting and misunderstood. Don't become what you hate because you feel you're suddenly on the right side of it and will get backed up. That's not a "welcoming" attitude either.

Prove them wrong by showing them they're wrong. Don't enable them or cast them out. And just a fyi, this is broadened to the forum as a hole Not just this thread.

/endrant
 
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Siku said:
I can't help but feel like this thread is a another example of people letting MBTI types get entirely too much into their heads. On both sides in this instance. Some are personally being offended by a statement that was clearly targeted to people as a whole as a man was disappointed in what he saw. He thought too highly of INFJs and got a large reality smack with whatever he read here. Forget filth, how many egos are here? Some are hypocrites who don't take own advice or views and enjoy over extending their charisma or self-proclaimed confidence for selfish boosts or attention. Often paired with very careful, Passive-Aggressiveness.

I didn't know a single paragraph from someone tells you everything about them in an instant and justifies and fortifies any intuition you may have. Do some even ponder they could be wrong? And can't a person just be hurting and/or having a bad day? As if you never said things you didn't necessarily mean before. I wouldn't dare call anyone filth nor am I backing him up, but yes, at times I get where OP is actually coming from. Hence why I'm even posting this. Another serious topic and person looking for guidance being turned into a playground for kudos and jokes at someelse's expense. Good job on out-casting people who think differently than you or are just hurting and misunderstood. Don't become what you hate because you feel you're suddenly on the right side of it and will get backed up. That's not a "welcoming" attitude either.

Prove them wrong by showing them they're wrong. Don't enable them or cast them out. And just a fyi, this is broadened to the forum as a hole Not just this thread.

/endrant
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Hmm.. I saw at least 3 members trying to provide OP with kind, intellectually sound advice. From John K, to Sandie, to Ifur - who even stated clearly people do not act simply according to "type".

But wether you like it or not, types do have similar means of thinking due to our like cognitive stacks. Of course things like trauma, faith, childhood, different life experiences and morals will set us all apart, but as a whole we connect in our weirdness as infj and I find it hilarious how people bash each other most in mbti forums for even acknowledging such a notion. :tearsofjoy:

Maybe read the responses again, and all over the forum and you will see a community of yes, morbid humor.. but also a place full of caring members trying to help others on a daily basis.
 
Misty said:
Hmm.. I saw at least 3 members trying to provide OP with kind, intellectually sound advice. From John K, to Sandie, to Ifur - who even stated clearly people do not act simply according to "type".

But wether you like it or not, types do have similar means of thinking due to our like cognitive stacks. Of course things like trauma, faith, childhood, different life experiences and morals will set us all apart, but as a whole we connect in our weirdness as infj and I find it hilarious how people bash each other most in mbti forums for even acknowledging such a notion. :tearsofjoy:

Maybe read the responses again, and all over the forum and you will see a community of yes, morbid humor.. but also a place full of caring members trying to help others on a daily basis.
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You're absolutely right! There's pretty much a bit of everything here, I see it. But we also cannot rule out the fact that INFJs are capable of misunderstanding each other as well. We project quite often and if we see a difference, we see a "problem". That infact is a problem. Contradicting too, no? I'm very much guilty of the same. I am learning and trying to grow from everything I experienced here. It was definitely an eye-opener and I am no longer here to prove who is right or wrong or play any blame games.

I did infact see the sincerity and I'm very much aware of how amazing people are here. I think everyone is amazing in their own way. I really do egret how all of that was said, I could have said it much better. But I also don't, I got a positive experience out of it. Negative experiences has just as much potential for growth as positive ones.

My point was being, us INFJs have a bad habit of turning cold once things become more personal and it attacks any insecurities or doubts about ourselves. I think we'd have faaaarrrr more potential if we self-reflected more. That's all I've been about here, so much so I lost my own reflection along the way. Personally, I feel INFJs need to forcibly spend considerable time around other types in order to grow as a person and not give in to our insecurities or bad traits by ignoring they don't exist rather than facing them head on. It will make us even more loving people who turn cold less with more overall compassion rather than ; people who are easily offended and defensive that turn judg-y in an instant. So much so, we unknowingly become what we hate. Selfish and feed ourselves one-sided views of an argument just to keep us from feeling even more worthless or wrong. We hate ourselves easily.... I'm just being entirely honest, even about myself here.

What I've been mostly about here is, the betterment of everyone, so much that I forgot to even look at myself for awhile. But sometimes text can't explain it all correctly as not everyone will read and absorb it all correctly because feelings start to get in the way instead.

I very much appreciate you all trying to get through to me. I really do. Thank you!! Just please, understand I was simply doing the same as well. :)
 
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Siku said:
You're absolutely right! There's pretty much a bit of everything here, I see it. But we also cannot rule out the fact that INFJs are capable of misunderstanding each other as well. We project quite often and if we see a difference, we see a "problem". That infact is a problem. Contradicting too, no? I'm very much guilty of the same. I am learning and trying to grow from everything I experienced here. It was definitely an eye-opener and I am no longer here to prove who is right or wrong or play any blame games.

I did infact see the sincerity and I'm very much aware of how amazing people are here. I think everyone is amazing in their own way. I really do egret how all of that was said, I could have said it much better. But I also don't, I got a positive experience out of it. Negative experiences has just as much potential for growth as positive ones.

My point was being, us INFJs have a bad habit of turning cold once things become more personal and it attacks any insecurities or doubts about ourselves. I think we'd have faaaarrrr more potential if we self-reflected more. That's all I've been about here, so much so I lost my own reflection along the way. Personally, I feel INFJs need to forcibly spend considerable time around other types in order to grow as a person and not give in to our insecurities or bad traits by ignoring they don't exist rather than facing them head on. It will make us even more loving people who turn cold less with more overall compassion rather than ; people who are easily offended and defensive that turn judg-y in an instant. So much so, we unknowingly become what we hate. Selfish and feed ourselves one-sided views of an argument just to keep us from feeling even more worthless or wrong. We hate ourselves easily.... I'm just being entirely honest, even about myself here.

What I've been mostly about here is, the betterment of everyone, so much that I forgot to even look at myself for awhile. But sometimes text can't explain it all correctly as not everyone will read and absorb it all correctly because feelings start to get in the way instead.

I very much appreciate you all trying to get through to me. I really do. Thank you!! Just please, understand I was simply doing the same as well. :)
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Well said! :)
 
Siku said:
I think we'd have faaaarrrr more potential if we self-reflected more.
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This is the first time I've seen someone say INFJs don't self-reflect enough :smile:. May be true though, as ruminating on our issues all the time isn't the same as self-reflection.

Seeing others behave the way you do is a great catalyst for self-reflection, in particular recognising yourself in someone being inconsiderate.
 
Fidicen said:
This is the first time I've seen someone say INFJs don't self-reflect enough :smile:. May be true though, as ruminating on our issues all the time isn't the same as self-reflection.

Seeing others behave the way you do is a great catalyst for self-reflection, in particular recognising yourself in someone being inconsiderate.
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We're deep feelers. So deep that we have to acknowledge that we're capable of getting stuck on ourselves without realizing it. Not because we are instinctively or purposely, selfish. It's the opposite. But we have to accept the morality of being utterly wrong even if it applies more to our current hurt and most importantly, all our past hurt.

I've recently been talking to a ESTP a great deal and I can't help but feel like I'm constantly growing around her. Which is supposedly, the opposite of us. It's made me more extroverted, open-minded, and not keeping my love to myself like I used to. It takes me out of my shell. It's quite refreshing actually. Hence, my previous advice.
 
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jonjairo said:
I expected to see a lot less filth on this forum from INFJ but apparently i was wrong in that. Not sure if its the other types on here or if even INFJs are like that too.

Im married to an ESFP and i hate how i always feel like she cant understand or appreciate my feelings and what not, not sure how to explain it. Like im too sentimental and im wasting it all with someone who doesnt even care, i expect that from everyone else but was hoping she would be different

my question is, are other INFJs any different or are all human beings selfish and unable to appreciate this
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As a INFJ that loves to make people uncomfortable with "filth" I'd say I like it within reason.

My fiance is an ENTP and I'd say the first yr of our dating we completely immersed ourselves in understanding and communicating with each other, all our needs and desires. Now almost 4 yrs in and we both sometimes don't really put too much into deeply understanding each other, be it a new endeavor or a new feeling or idea. If we don't say "I need help" or "can I talk to you about how I'm feeling" we generally know each other is okay-ish at the very least. We still pick up on each other's moods and I can usually tell when he's had a hard day and vice versa, but our spouses sometimes need to be told "hey I need some undivided attention" and there is no shame in saying it. I do it all the time. I needs attention, not from all the other people in my life. From him, so I tell him. And he tells me.

I also bite the hell out of him if he is on his phone too much and it's not work related. Which turns into sex which usually leads to us laying in bed talking.

I definitely understand feeling like your feelings are unappreciated, my ENTP gets so into his new endeavors or other "new shinny thing" that he goes on and on about things not letting me get a word in... So I sit there and I wait, sometimes it's so long I forget to listen and start wondering how he can talk so much? Like is he gunna run out of air eventually?... But he does stop and I try to remember what I was going to say weather it is actually of use or not. Other times I just let him ramble. He's started to catch himself when he keeps interrupting me trying to contribute and tries to slow down, but that only started because I told him how I was feeling unheard. It's all about communication. If you're have a hard time look into counseling or a couples retreat with not tv or cellphones.
 
Cookie said:
As a INFJ that loves to make people uncomfortable with "filth" I'd say I like it within reason.

My fiance is an ENTP and I'd say the first yr of our dating we completely immersed ourselves in understanding and communicating with each other, all our needs and desires. Now almost 4 yrs in and we both sometimes don't really put too much into deeply understanding each other, be it a new endeavor or a new feeling or idea. If we don't say "I need help" or "can I talk to you about how I'm feeling" we generally know each other is okay-ish at the very least. We still pick up on each other's moods and I can usually tell when he's had a hard day and vice versa, but our spouses sometimes need to be told "hey I need some undivided attention" and there is no shame in saying it. I do it all the time. I needs attention, not from all the other people in my life. From him, so I tell him. And he tells me.

I also bite the hell out of him if he is on his phone too much and it's not work related. Which turns into sex which usually leads to us laying in bed talking.

I definitely understand feeling like your feelings are unappreciated, my ENTP gets so into his new endeavors or other "new shinny thing" that he goes on and on about things not letting me get a word in... So I sit there and I wait, sometimes it's so long I forget to listen and start wondering how he can talk so much? Like is he gunna run out of air eventually?... But he does stop and I try to remember what I was going to say weather it is actually of use or not. Other times I just let him ramble. He's started to catch himself when he keeps interrupting me trying to contribute and tries to slow down, but that only started because I told him how I was feeling unheard. It's all about communication. If you're have a hard time look into counseling or a couples retreat with not tv or cellphones.
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Sidenote: sorry if this made zero sense I'm half asleep.
 
WELL,
I do think, from experience, morals and ethics have taken a downward swing over the past thirty years. What one knows as filth, another lives that way all the time. It does not mean everyone is changing. I surely am not.
People like to get funny and like being noticed. Peer pressure even on a forum can extract something from someone who normally would never have said such a thing. Lots of times, it takes just too much energy to share how someone feels about an issue, especially when knowing everyone does not feel that way. The brave and noble take the time, and the tired do not.

Same with a relationship: most of the time one person has to work harder than the other to stay together. How do I feel married to an extroverted person with absolutely no filters? Run over. Psychologically assaulted. It hurts. I really don't think anyone else would stay with her, so I am doing my best to keep us together, and I don't cheat on her. Heck, I feel bad talking to a beautiful woman sometimes; yet, she wouldn't have a problem talking to a hunk. So, she calls me jealous. Hurt again. My advice? Move on or deal with it if you really love her. It may even get worse.

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If a person knows what to expect, it makes dealing with it easier. I've been used to being used a long time now. Anyone need a rug to wipe their feet on, or a spittoon? Love them, pray for them, and lick your wounds like an animal run over by a truck. It surely does not bother them. Get used to it, or get out. Think about it: you could have a much easier life. Just try to forget someone you love first and see how that works out.
 
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