Evolution vs. Creationism

If a person were to travel to Africa and bring light and heat with them to help them administer surgery to the needy and/or dying, I guess we would have to consider those deeds and deeds alone; nothing good or nothing bad: just deeds. We are amusing ourselves, are we not? Tell me, is this good?
 
Our minds were designed to want to help others through natural selection.

Helping others is "good" because it improves survival rates.
 
just me said:
I will tell it to a woman feeding her child opium because it is starving to death while everyone is fighting over a small piece of land.
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I don't see the relevance.
 
You mention happiness and compassion; I will add love to that. Characteristics of the human being, are they not? We can call these characteristics the substance of the soul of man.....what the soul is made of or what it consists of. Maybe there is only darkness in some souls. Maybe there is light. Maybe some souls are cold. Maybe some bring forth warmth to others. They are a part of man. Nephesh.
 
But happiness and compassion can be explained in purely organic, non spiritual ways.
 
...but now we are splitting hairs. When we send a neutron into U235, it causes the splitting of atoms. The new substance is called U236. The mass remains the same. My God, what have we created? It is neither good nor evil except for the way or ways it is used. We agree on a lot of things. Yet, the scientific mind must know. Nothing wrong with knowing. Nothing wrong with intuition, either.
 
It takes all kinds to make a world. I accept you as you are. I ask you do not try to disprove those that have such emotion on things they know are true.
The infj has a way with these things, as do others. I would love to share some things shown to me others have not seen, but it may take a lot of time for that to happen. I pray some day it will. I must retire for the night. Enjoyed the talks.
 
The rights and wrongs of spiritual and non spiritual people are equally arbitrary (unless that person has a direct link to god).
 
IndigoSensor said:
Yes, but there is more then one way to do it.
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More than one way to explain it? Yes, but why not accept the simpliest explanation, rather than jumping to grandious conclusions.
 
Quinlan said:
More than one way to explain it? Yes, but why not accept the simpliest explanation, rather than jumping to grandious conclusions.
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The simplist does not always make the most sense.
 
Quinlan said:
GO said we need spirituality because we have souls, I'm just curious about the link.

Is a soul without spirituality unhealthy?
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BACK ON TOPIC.

In my personal experience (read: in what I myself have gone through, and what I know of others that have gone through similar experiences), a truly healthy state of mind and "soul," if that be the nature of your beliefs (as it is in mine), requires a certain amount of emotional fulfillment.

Spirituality, as I have come to know it through personal experience and education, connects to a sort of "primal knowledge" so to speak, which is a theme that runs through all (or almost all) organized religion. This primal knowledge is a feeling of oneness, of being whole and content regardless of external circumstances. In its strongest forms, it's a feeling that wells up inside, almost as if it's joy and sorrow combined.
Spirituality is a shard of that primal knowledge.

A soul without spirituality would not be "unhealthy;" it just wouldn't be very meaningful. Discontent, contempt, a critical point of view, and getting lost in cold logic do sometimes occur much more frequently in someone who hasn't unlocked and cultivated a true spirituality (I say "true spirituality" because some {read: many} people in organized religion blindly follow rather than freely seek) (however, that is not to say people in organized religion cannot or are less likely to find that true spirituality; often times, they are the ones that start seeking in the first place, if they do, and organized religion can be a wonderful tool to prompt the search and further encourage it).

Wisdom and higher understanding do not stem from logic alone; they stem from a balance between logic and spirituality; the understanding of facts and science, or the concrete, along with the understanding of people and the universe, or the abstract.
 
IndigoSensor said:
The simplist does not always make the most sense.
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So if you are walking down the street and see a noodle on the ground instead of assuming someone dropped their lunch you assume it fell off the invisible flying spaghetti monster?


gloomy-optimist said:
BACK ON TOPIC.

In my personal experience (read: in what I myself have gone through, and what I know of others that have gone through similar experiences), a truly healthy state of mind and "soul," if that be the nature of your beliefs (as it is in mine), requires a certain amount of emotional fulfillment.

Spirituality, as I have come to know it through personal experience and education, connects to a sort of "primal knowledge" so to speak, which is a theme that runs through all (or almost all) organized religion. This primal knowledge is a feeling of oneness, of being whole and content regardless of external circumstances. In its strongest forms, it's a feeling that wells up inside, almost as if it's joy and sorrow combined.
Spirituality is a shard of that primal knowledge.

A soul without spirituality would not be "unhealthy;" it just wouldn't be very meaningful. Discontent, contempt, a critical point of view, and getting lost in cold logic do sometimes occur much more frequently in someone who hasn't unlocked and cultivated a true spirituality (I say "true spirituality" because some {read: many} people in organized religion blindly follow rather than freely seek) (however, that is not to say people in organized religion cannot or are less likely to find that true spirituality; often times, they are the ones that start seeking in the first place, if they do, and organized religion can be a wonderful tool to prompt the search and further encourage it).

Wisdom and higher understanding do not stem from logic alone; they stem from a balance between logic and spirituality; the understanding of facts and science, or the concrete, along with the understanding of people and the universe, or the abstract.
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GO this sounds very much like you are projecting from an INFJ point of view, "primal knowledge" sounds a lot like Ni so I can see why an INFJ would find it attractive. What about those of us who are content with simply experiencing the natural world, with no need for supernatural meaning or explanations, are we soulless? I'm very content, have a love for the natural world and don't think I'm overly critical or logical, infact non-spiritual people often have the most zest for life and love of nature, because we see this life as the only chance we've got.
 
Quinlan said:
GO this sounds very much like you are projecting from an INFJ point of view, "primal knowledge" sounds a lot like Ni so I can see why an INFJ would find it attractive. What about those of us who are content with simply experiencing the natural world, with no need for supernatural meaning or explanations, are we soulless? I'm very content, have a love for the natural world and don't think I'm overly critical or logical, infact non-spiritual people often have the most zest for life and love of nature, because we see this life as the only chance we've got.
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A spirit is not necessarily a supernatural entity. In fact, I would say it is highly unlikely that it is. It could be understood as the energy of a living thing; the spark of life so to speak. Religion may be concerned with transcendence in death and the supernatural, but spirituality is typically more akin to growth in life and the natural force that drives it.
 
Quinlan said:
So if you are walking down the street and see a noodle on the ground instead of assuming someone dropped their lunch you assume it fell off the invisible flying spaghetti monster?
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He didn't say that the simplest answer is never the right answer. Things can be extremely complex.




GO this sounds very much like you are projecting from an INFJ point of view, "primal knowledge" sounds a lot like Ni so I can see why an INFJ would find it attractive. What about those of us who are content with simply experiencing the natural world, with no need for supernatural meaning or explanations, are we soulless? I'm very content, have a love for the natural world and don't think I'm overly critical or logical, infact non-spiritual people often have the most zest for life and love of nature, because we see this life as the only chance we've got.
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Nobody said a critical and logical person can't be happy. Nobody said they can't have a love for nature.

Satya said:
A spirit is not necessarily a supernatural entity. In fact, I would say it is highly unlikely that it is. It could be understood as the energy of a living thing; the spark of life so to speak. Religion may be concerned with transcendence in death and the supernatural, but spirituality is typically more akin to growth in life and the natural force that drives it.
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You said that a lot more eloquently and simple than I did.
 
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Satya said:
A spirit is not necessarily a supernatural entity.
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A "spirit" doesn't necessarily exist either.

Satya said:
In fact, I would say it is highly unlikely that it is. It could be understood as the energy of a living thing; the spark of life so to speak.
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And what if that "spark" is just the chemical mixtures of our brains?

Seems we need evidence one way or another to account for this "spark." Since I personally have none, I reserve judgment and ignore the question of a "spirit." Those that say that they know such a thing as a "spirit" exists I then ask to provide the evidence they have for knowing such a thing exists.

Satya said:
spirituality is typically more akin to growth in life and the natural force that drives it.
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Isn't that just called psychology and self improvement? Why must we introduce superstition and untruth in order to "improve ourselves?"
 
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