Homosexuality and Christianity II

[Flavus Aquila]

There's a big difference between something being illegal and being a criminal offence.

 

[IndigoSensor]

Similarly, sodomy (anal sex) should remain - as it currently is in most countries - illegal.

This is all I am going to say on the matter:

It does not harm you, the economy, or anyone else for that matter. Therefore it should not be illegal. To think otherwise is completely irrational, unfair, and only does the good of placing unreasonable restrictions on good people. Most would still do this anyway and get away with it so there is no point in trying to regulate it.

If you disagree then you seriously have to rethink your stance on these matters, and I am seriously thankful you have no political power.

*walks away*

 

[Flavus Aquila]

This is all I am going to say on the matter:

It does not harm you, the economy, or anyone else for that matter. Therefore it should not be illegal. To think otherwise is completely irrational, unfair, and only does the good of placing unreasonable restrictions on good people. Most would still do this anyway and get away with it so there is no point in trying to regulate it.

If you disagree then you seriously have to rethink your stance on these matters, and I am seriously thankful you have no political power.

*walks away*

@IndigoSensor: I'll let Satya's words answer:

...Let's cut to the chase. The primary means by which HIV spreads is through anal sex. Do homosexual men practice anal sex more than any other group? Yes. Do lesbians practice it is less of any group? Yes.

It is not homosexuality, but anal sex, that leads to the spread of HIV....

If tobacco should be banned, then anal sex should be likewise. Nothing is being said about homosexuals here:

Both heterosexuals and homosexuals have anal sex. When you argue that HIV is a "gay" problem, you are spreading ignorance that is very dangerous.

 

[IndigoSensor]

I'll let Satya's words answer:


If tobacco should be banned, then anal sex should be likewise.

I don't think tobacco should be banned. If people are too stupid to protect themselves from these matters, then they deserve what they get.

 

[Satya]

I don't think tobacco should be banned. If people are too stupid to protect themselves from these matters, then they deserve what they get.

God bless you and your rationality. Hallelujah!

 

[Flavus Aquila]

I don't think tobacco should be banned. If people are too stupid to protect themselves from these matters, then they deserve what they get.

@IndigoSensor: Aids is just as fitting a reward as cancer in you opinion then?

 

[Satya]

Well, looking at this thread now, I guess we can see exactly what Christianity is. Right? We have people distorting statistics to push a point that homosexuality is dangerous when it is actually risky sexual behaviors that is dangerous and we have people willing to lock up gays to push their religious dogma on others, even when homosexuality does nothing to harm them. What a fine religious example we see in this thread of the standards that exemplify good Christians.

 

[Wyote]

Hooray for progress!

 

[Skathac]

I just had a big ole laughing fit and I'll explain it out for you guys, ya'll might find it funny.

I'm seeing this thread title and attaching the answer for the recent topic being discussed.

What is Christianity? Smoking Cigarettes and Anal Sex.

I know I know serious discussion, just thought I'd share the humor.

 

[Satya]

I just had a big ole laughing fit and I'll explain it out for you guys, ya'll might find it funny.

I'm seeing this thread title and attaching the answer for the recent topic being discussed.

What is Christianity? Smoking Cigarettes and Anal Sex.

I know I know serious discussion, just thought I'd share the humor.

Brilliant!

 

[Flavus Aquila]

Well, looking at this thread now, I guess we can see exactly what Christianity is. Right? We have people distorting statistics to push a point that homosexuality is dangerous when it is actually risky sexual behaviors that is dangerous and we have people willing to lock up gays to push their religious dogma on others, even when homosexuality does nothing to harm them. What a fine religious example we see in this thread of the standards that exemplify good Christians.

Actually, I was going to ask that this thread be split. The discussion went wildly off topic at some point.

 

[lilpixieofterror]

Yes. Lesbians are at the lowest risk, no matter how promiscuous they are.

I would love to see the data for this, but I do not believe you can bring up the stats to prove this. I have shown it.

The same study your presented to me. That is why I said you should read it. And the fact that it is reasonable to assume that people who do not get checked out for a cancer are more likely to contract it, but it makes absolutely no sense that having lesbian sex causes cancer. Can you present any evidence that having homosexual sex causes cancer in lesbians? A correlation is not evidence.

I did read it and it seems that you didn't actually respond to what I said nor do you understand the biology beyond cancer as well as you think you do. Getting checked out for cancer has nothing to do with the ability to get cancer and if you really believe that, I'd suggest you read up on cancer and see the reasons doctors suggest regular exams. It is not because they reduce your risk for cancer, it is because surival rates for cancer are far greater if the cancer is caught early. Don't believe me? Take a look at this:

"In many cases, the sooner cancer is diagnosed and treated, the better a person's chance for a full recovery. If you develop cancer, you can improve the chance that it will be detected early if you have regular medical checkups and do certain self-exams. Often a doctor can find early cancer during a physical exam or with routine tests, even if a person has no symptoms. Some important medical exams, tests, and self- exams are discussed on the next pages. The doctor may suggest other exams for people who are at increased risk for cancer."
http://www.medicinenet.com/cancer_detection/article.htm

So nope, your argument here is not as strong as you think. As for your second part about correlation not being evidence, let me ask you this, do you believe that 'greater health risk' is wrong because after all... correlation isn't evidence is it? So sorry, it seems that lesbian sex is not as innocent as you seem to think.

So you agree that it is unprotected anal sex that leads to HIV transmission? Is it possible for two clean, monogamous homosexual men to give HIV to one another? Homosexuality has nothing to do with HIV, risky sexual behaviors are what lead to HIV transmission. Whether your are willing to admit it or not, a monogamous homosexual couple practicing unprotected anal sex will not get HIV over their entire lifetime. It is not their homosexuality that causes HIV, it is having promiscuous sex that causes it.

Sex period can lead to catching all sorts of STD's, not just anal. I also notice that you merely add in things to make your argument seem more valid than it really is. Did I say that monogamous homosexual couples are not less likely to get an STD? No I did not, that is known as a 'strawman' or attemping to stuff words down my throat. However; it's too bad that my argument is focused on groups as a whole and not just a few examples. Are you denying that homosexual's are more promiscuous than most other groups are? Are you denying that homosexual's have the highest rates of HIV compaired to other groups? These are not things I just made up off the top of my head, but facts that are well known and presented by gay and lesbian groups themselves. These are facts, not just made up crap off the top of my head.

If you had actually read the study instead of simply googling for anything that would support your beliefs you would have read this...

I did read it and it seems that you are the one that didn't read nearly as much as you think. You are aware that breast exams do not prevent cancer, right?

"there is evidence that lesbians smoke more and drink more. It is also more likely they are overweight, which adds significant health risks."

The fact of the matter is that racial groups also have higher risks of cancers...

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/36679.php
http://www.fccc.edu/cancer/minorities/index.html

Are you going to argue that the color of their skin makes them more likely to develop cancers? Or could it be other factors? Higher levels of poverty? Higher alcoholism and smoking rates? Higher levels of obesity? Higher levels of depression? All factors common among minority groups in America.

Actually, your race does play a role in your medical history and it is not 'racism' that causes this at all, it is a well known medical fact. So are you trying to make me sound like a racist now? Nice, it's too bad though that other groups and other people also smoke, drink, and are depressed and don't have higher level's of cancers. Why are you trying so hard to ignore medical facts? The gay and lesban group said:

4. Gynecological Cancer
Lesbians have higher risks for many of the gynecologic cancers. What they may not know is that having a yearly exam by a gynecologist can significantly facilitate early diagnosis and a better chance of cure.

I did not make this up, this is a medical fact.

Let's cut to the chase. The primary means by which HIV spreads is through anal sex. Do homosexual men practice anal sex more than any other group? Yes. Do lesbians practice it is less of any group? Yes.

No, the primary means in which HIV is spread is though the exchange of bodly fluids and nomay or may not be though sex. In fact, there was a case in which a women caught aids because her and your BF (who was HIV positive) contracted HIV because they both had bleeding gums and loved to have passinate kisses. Anyway, my argument specifically said STD's and not HIV because HIV is actually among the hardest STD to get, some are far eaiser to get.

It is not homosexuality, but anal sex, that leads to the spread of HIV.

That is sort of like saying that it is not the person that kills, but the weapon they use to do it with. It is a fact that sex can give you an STD (including HIV). It is also a fact that

For your formula to be correct it should be, Anal Sex + Promiscuity = increased risk. Both heterosexuals and homosexuals have anal sex. When you argue that HIV is a "gay" problem, you are spreading ignorance that is very dangerous.

Ummm no I'm not spreading any ignorance around, it seems though that you are simply accusing me of spreading ignorance because you do not want to deal with the facts at hand. Is it not a fact that homosexual's are the most likely to be promiscuous? Yes or no? Please answer the question already.

You are suggesting that heterosexuals who practice anal sex are not at risk, when in reality they are the second highest risk group to gay men when it comes to sexual behavior. The rampant spread of HIV in Africa is the result of the cultural practice of anal sex as birth control among heterosexuals on that continent.

And yet again, you just love to stuff words down my throat and make me say things I did not say. I did not say that hetrosexual couples were somehow magically above not getting an STD. Anybody who takes part in sex, no matter what, can put themselves at risk for a STD. That is a fact. It is also a fact that homosexuals, are among the least likely to pratice 'safe sex'. Do you deny all of this? Yes or no? It's a very simple question, why don't you want to answer it?

And yet... who is the group that has more cases of HIV

Actually I have presented several arguments.

1. They are minority group that faces societal stigma which leads to greater depression rates. Depression leads to consumption of alcohol, tobacco, and excessive food, which in turn puts them at a greater risk for certain cancers.

Some cancers, yes, but not all.

2. Not getting checked out by a physician can lead to not catching health factors that increase their risk of certain cancers.

Your ability to get checked out by a doctor has nothing to do with your ability to get cancer. It has to do with early detection.

And I'll get to your lying argument as soon as you present a decent rational argument that homosexuality is immoral. So far you have made a good argument that promiscuity and unprotected sex is immoral. Of course, arguing that homoesxuality is immoral because homosexuals may be more likely to practice promiscuity and unprotected sex, is not very rational.

I have and you haven't addressed it. Is not not a fact that homosexuals are among the most promiscuous group around? Yes or no? Please answer the question already, I'd love to hear your answer.

 

[lilpixieofterror]

FA and I have history. He has made it clear in the past that he feels that anyone who practices homosexuality is stupid. I felt a great deal of respect until he made that comment, and to this day he has not changed that stance. I do not respect those who choose to disrespect others.

If that is the case... that is pretty silly since there is zero link between homosexuality and intelligence.

 

[lilpixieofterror]

Well, looking at this thread now, I guess we can see exactly what Christianity is. Right? We have people distorting statistics to push a point that homosexuality is dangerous when it is actually risky sexual behaviors that is dangerous and we have people willing to lock up gays to push their religious dogma on others, even when homosexuality does nothing to harm them. What a fine religious example we see in this thread of the standards that exemplify good Christians.

I did not say that homosexuality is dangerous, I said that it seems to lead to some higher health risk. Do you deny that it doesn't? Yes or no?

 

[Satya]

I did not say that homosexuality is dangerous, I said that it seems to lead to some higher health risk. Do you deny that it doesn't? Yes or no?

I deny that it causes any health risk. Unprotected anal sex and promiscuity cause higher health risk. A homosexual person can choose or not choose to engage in those behaviors. If they choose not to do so, then they are at no greater health risk than anyone else. Do you deny that this is so? Yes or no?

 

[lilpixieofterror]

I deny that it causes any health risk. Unprotected anal sex and promiscuity cause higher health risk. A homosexual person can choose or not choose to engage in those behaviors. If they choose not to do so, then they are at no greater health risk than anyone else. Do you deny that this is so? Yes or no?

And what group is the most likely to pratice promiscuity and unprotected sex?

 

[Kavalan]

And what group is the most likely to pratice promiscuity and unprotected sex?

anyone who would be oppressed by others

 

[lilpixieofterror]

anyone who would be oppressed by others

Where did I say anything about being oppressed?

 

[Satya]

I would love to see the data for this, but I do not believe you can bring up the stats to prove this. I have shown it.



I did read it and it seems that you didn't actually respond to what I said nor do you understand the biology beyond cancer as well as you think you do. Getting checked out for cancer has nothing to do with the ability to get cancer and if you really believe that, I'd suggest you read up on cancer and see the reasons doctors suggest regular exams. It is not because they reduce your risk for cancer, it is because surival rates for cancer are far greater if the cancer is caught early. Don't believe me? Take a look at this:

"In many cases, the sooner cancer is diagnosed and treated, the better a person's chance for a full recovery. If you develop cancer, you can improve the chance that it will be detected early if you have regular medical checkups and do certain self-exams. Often a doctor can find early cancer during a physical exam or with routine tests, even if a person has no symptoms. Some important medical exams, tests, and self- exams are discussed on the next pages. The doctor may suggest other exams for people who are at increased risk for cancer."
http://www.medicinenet.com/cancer_detection/article.htm

So nope, your argument here is not as strong as you think. As for your second part about correlation not being evidence, let me ask you this, do you believe that 'greater health risk' is wrong because after all... correlation isn't evidence is it? So sorry, it seems that lesbian sex is not as innocent as you seem to think.



Sex period can lead to catching all sorts of STD's, not just anal. I also notice that you merely add in things to make your argument seem more valid than it really is. Did I say that monogamous homosexual couples are not less likely to get an STD? No I did not, that is known as a 'strawman' or attemping to stuff words down my throat. However; it's too bad that my argument is focused on groups as a whole and not just a few examples. Are you denying that homosexual's are more promiscuous than most other groups are? Are you denying that homosexual's have the highest rates of HIV compaired to other groups? These are not things I just made up off the top of my head, but facts that are well known and presented by gay and lesbian groups themselves. These are facts, not just made up crap off the top of my head.



I did read it and it seems that you are the one that didn't read nearly as much as you think. You are aware that breast exams do not prevent cancer, right?




Actually, your race does play a role in your medical history and it is not 'racism' that causes this at all, it is a well known medical fact. So are you trying to make me sound like a racist now? Nice, it's too bad though that other groups and other people also smoke, drink, and are depressed and don't have higher level's of cancers. Why are you trying so hard to ignore medical facts? The gay and lesban group said:

4. Gynecological Cancer
Lesbians have higher risks for many of the gynecologic cancers. What they may not know is that having a yearly exam by a gynecologist can significantly facilitate early diagnosis and a better chance of cure.

I did not make this up, this is a medical fact.



No, the primary means in which HIV is spread is though the exchange of bodly fluids and nomay or may not be though sex. In fact, there was a case in which a women caught aids because her and your BF (who was HIV positive) contracted HIV because they both had bleeding gums and loved to have passinate kisses. Anyway, my argument specifically said STD's and not HIV because HIV is actually among the hardest STD to get, some are far eaiser to get.



That is sort of like saying that it is not the person that kills, but the weapon they use to do it with. It is a fact that sex can give you an STD (including HIV). It is also a fact that



Ummm no I'm not spreading any ignorance around, it seems though that you are simply accusing me of spreading ignorance because you do not want to deal with the facts at hand. Is it not a fact that homosexual's are the most likely to be promiscuous? Yes or no? Please answer the question already.



And yet again, you just love to stuff words down my throat and make me say things I did not say. I did not say that hetrosexual couples were somehow magically above not getting an STD. Anybody who takes part in sex, no matter what, can put themselves at risk for a STD. That is a fact. It is also a fact that homosexuals, are among the least likely to pratice 'safe sex'. Do you deny all of this? Yes or no? It's a very simple question, why don't you want to answer it?

And yet... who is the group that has more cases of HIV



Some cancers, yes, but not all.



Your ability to get checked out by a doctor has nothing to do with your ability to get cancer. It has to do with early detection.



I have and you haven't addressed it. Is not not a fact that homosexuals are among the most promiscuous group around? Yes or no? Please answer the question already, I'd love to hear your answer.

Let's talk just facts, and leave the alleged motivations out of this.

1. HIV is primarily spread through unprotected anal sex followed by recreational drug use.
2. MSM (Men who have sex with men) represent the highest risk group for contracting HIV.
3. MSM are the most likely to practice unprotected anal sex.
4. Men are more likely to practice promiscuity than women.
3. Blacks and Hispanics represent the racial group most affected by HIV.

Do you dispute any of these facts?

 

[Kavalan]

Where did I say anything about being oppressed?

You didn't yet you fail to recognize that homosexual lifestyle and people are treated poorly and cannot go out in most places as a heterosexual couple does. This oppressive nature allows for an underground nature to form. This isn't unique to homosexuals but rather can be attributed to anyone who's sexual life is dictated by others and enforced harshly.