If the government's healthcare insurance is so good...

yeah i mean, why should they bother with the poor

yay guys you won

(or to be exact all the anti propaganda like the shitty adverts telling lies about the nhs)
 
I'm with the american people on this.

Saving american lives is a shitty idea.
 
UPDATE:

It looks like the White House is dropping the 'public option' of the healthcare overhaul:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_health_care_overhaul

facepalm.jpg
 
I think that there are measures other than a UHC system that could be put in place to save lives in the American healthcare system. I also think that it is still important to learn from UHC systems to see what ideas do and do not work for healthcare in a general sense. If anything, I think that a long term study should be conducted on all of the world's developed/developing healthcare systems.

Just because the public option of healthcare is not being pursued by the White House does not mean that there is nothing left to be done in terms of healthcare reform.

yeah i mean, why should they bother with the poor

You could argue it along the lines of a moral issue.

yay guys you won

I'm not sure if I would call it winning. I still see an American HC system that is in need of reform.

(or to be exact all the anti propaganda like the shitty adverts telling lies about the nhs)

One of the things that I noticed during this entire debate was a war of information by both sides. Misinformation was used by both Republicans and Democrats, and I found trouble finding sources that were reputable in many cases. The issue is a very personal and emotional one, and will still continue to be. But I think it is imperative to provide good information in any policy debate; it irritates me that the public was provided with misinformation. I think that information is one of the most important commodities in a technological society, and that this debate over UHC provides an example over how people can be manipulated by dishonest practices in public policy making.

I'm with the american people on this.

Saving american lives is a shitty idea.

UHC comes with it's own set of unique costs (both tangible and intangible). While I don't think that government UHC is in the best interests of a majority of this country, I do think that healthcare reform is necessary. There are many medical errors that could be prevented if certain steps were taken.
 
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If anything, I think that a long term study should be conducted on all of the world's developed/developing healthcare systems.
Yes, just long term enough to vote out that pansy liberal Obama who actually wants to do something to save americans. Once he's out the study can be concluded that a healthcare system is a good idea, but dropped anyway by the next health insurance backed republican president.
 
Yes, just long term enough to vote out that pansy liberal Obama who actually wants to do something to save americans. Once he's out the study can be concluded that a healthcare system is a good idea, but dropped anyway by the next health insurance backed republican president.

Special interests were at work on both sides of the debate. Having those long term studies over multiple UHC's and HCS (healthcare systems) and dropping the issue is different from not having the studies at all. To my knowledge, Presidents are still democratically elected in this country.

To note:
Obama's spokesman refused to say a public option was a make-or-break choice.
"What I am saying is the bottom line for this for the president is, what we have to have is choice and competition in the insurance market," White House press secretary Robert Gibbs said Sunday.
A day before, Obama appeared to hedge his bets.
"All I'm saying is, though, that the public option, whether we have it or we don't have it, is not the entirety of health care reform," Obama said at a town hall meeting in Grand Junction, Colo. "This is just one sliver of it, one aspect of it."
(this comes from the first of those two articles in my update post).

I think the timing of a political push for UHC was bad because of the recession that we are facing now.

A question: how exactly did Mr. Obama want to save Americans? Could you be more specific please?
 
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By providing a health care system that actually pays out, rather than leaving it to the health "insurance" companies who notoriously DON'T pay out.
 
By providing a health care system that actually pays out, rather than leaving it to the health "insurance" companies who notoriously DON'T pay out.

The system that would have been created put people at risk though. It would have also had the same monentary problems that some of the other UHC's are facing.
 
No no, see I agree with you. We should let americans die.

I see. So now the discussion has gone back to ad hominem statements. Unfortunately, they do not dispel or negate or minimize the points that I have already brought up against UHC.
 
I see. So now the discussion has gone back to ad hominem statements. Unfortunately, they do not dispel or negate or minimize the points that I have already brought up against UHC.

Not an ad hominem. I actually agree. I'm not being sarcastic. America just doesn't Deserve a socialist healthcare system. While it's forcing the rest of the world into Pro-American trade agreements that destroy economies, it ought to be stuck with its capitalistic unregulated "insurance" system with no government sponsored alternatives.

It might deserve such a system later, but at the moment I really don't see the point in saving american lives. They're just not intelligent enough. After all, in god they trust.
 
Not an ad hominem. I actually agree. I'm not being sarcastic. America just doesn't Deserve a socialist healthcare system. While it's forcing the rest of the world into Pro-American trade agreements that destroy economies, it ought to be stuck with its capitalistic unregulated "insurance" system with no government sponsored alternatives.

It might deserve such a system later, but at the moment I really don't see the point in saving american lives. They're just not intelligent enough. After all, in god they trust.

Yes, more than half the population drinks fluoride water. No wonder their dumb (generally speaking ofc)
 
Yes, more than half the population drinks fluoride water. No wonder their dumb (generally speaking ofc)
And yet you're the one with the spelling error.

It should be they're dumb, not their dumb.

Granted, if you're from Norway, English is probably a second language.
 
Third more than likely, after German, or more likely Danish. Denmark is where they buy their booze before smuggling it home on the ferries.
 
And yet you're the one with the spelling error.

It should be they're dumb, not their dumb.

Granted, if you're from Norway, English is probably a second language.

Ah yes, but that's a grammatical error not a spelling error. You're an american you say?

J/k ofc, but yeah americans are ignorant on a general basis, but so are most people in this day and age.
 
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Ah yes, but that's a grammatical error not a spelling error. You're an american you say?
Yeah, I'm American. I wasn't offended by your comment either, I just thought it was an ironic mistake given the context of the comment.
 
Yeah, I'm American. I wasn't offended by your comment either, I just thought it was an ironic mistake given the context of the comment.

Yes, the effect would have been more profound if you had actually managed to seperate grammar from spelling.

But don't mind me, I'm just kidding around :P
 
Which, sadly, I might add explains why I said. "Why America can't have nice things." We can't agree on what "nice" means.
 
And yet you're the one with the spelling error.

It should be they're dumb, not their dumb.

Granted, if you're from Norway, English is probably a second language.

i see a lot of americans make that same mistake on a daily basis.
 
You should have done it decades ago when everyone did it.

the problem is to have something new, it'll take a long time of fixing and adapting until it begins working properly.

and until then the people against it will be whining so much...

I agree we are playing catch up it seems. :m197:
 
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