INFJ and Autism

[Enso]

I'll see what I can do. I have this test at hand that's a bit unorthodox but I've seen linked in a highly recommended doctor's website before:

http://www.rdos.net/eng/Aspie-quiz.php

Sweet jesus have they made a shorter version? The IPIP for big5 went from like 240ish questions down to like 15 for a quick version that correlates highly. I find myself losing attention over about 80 on this test.

 

[niar]

Sweet jesus have they made a shorter version? They IPIP for big5 went from like 240ish questions down to like 15 for a quick version that correlates highly. I find myself losing attention over about 80 on this test.

Oh boy

 

[Asa]

Thank you for posting the test, niar.
That test does the repeating questions thing. I usually leave repeats blank, but I tried to be patient this time.

 

[Asa]

 

[slant]

There is a definite correlation in the sense that mbti is a self assessment and many of the characteristics of not feeling understood, being interested in deeper topics, etc can all be autism related. I'm beginning to understand now why a lot of the people on this forum either have trauma, mental illness or autism. They share the core characteristics of feeling different, ostracized and misunderstood. It is not really a personality, it's an experience, and I think the mbti tests especially free ones do not do a good job of separating that experience from actual personality.

 

[AutisticArtistic]

Autism is a disorder of empathy development. People who are autistic have an aberration of the brain that messes with their socialisation instinct. They are unable to empathise and mix with others (depending on the severity of the autism). High-functioning autistic people learn how to socialise in a patterned way (if their brain is not too damaged this is very possible). They learn by observation of other people that when a joke is told they should laugh, when others smile they should too. Etc. There is a misconception that autistic people don't feel. I can't see any reason why they wouldn't, their disorder is not one of emotional development, it is of empathy, which is very different. As such, a high-functioning autistic could test as an INFJ or ISFJ because they learn rules such as politeness = importance. But the part of development they are lacking in is the ability to understand others, feel as they do, understand how they must feel - anything to do with empathy. As such, they may not use Fi as such (my values) because they do need to be taught social rules. But they also do not use Fe (the rules) because their motive to use it is entirely conscious. They think about it and do it because they know the answer. So it may test like Fe but really it's just that someone has taught them socially acceptable rules that Fe bases itself on. Because these are cognitive processes and autistic people's brains and minds work in a very different way, they kind of use cognitive function x - it's a different cognitive function to the rest of us.

If any researchers bothered to check with actual autistic people (especially women on the spectrum as women tend to have a higher EQ anyways) more research would show that autistics are just as prone to hyperempathy as we are to hypoempathy). In fact, there's even a difference between affective empathy and cognitive empathy which can also show up differently for autistic people. I am both autistic and an INFJ. I feel deeply and I empathize intensly and to the point that it can negatively impact my daily functioning. I am not just autistic, but I also studied autism in an educational and professional capacity as well (I have a Master’s in Psychotherapy and wrote my research paper on autism). I see no discrepancy between being INFJ and autistic. Those with ASD also typically struggle with emotional overwhelm due to the intensity of our feelings (which is a common contributor to meltdowns or shutdowns). Please feel free to look up autism research by Bargiela or Attwood if you'd like more information (great studies done by these two!)

 

[Fudgee]

I was wondering how an INFJ autist would function considering that Autism, especially high functionning autism, is often associated with an extreme thinking preference due to a different developmental pattern.

However, my guess would be that while Autists would tend score as thinkers, many of them could actually be feelers and not know it because they would look more like someone in a loop than the usual person of one type.

What do you think ? Does anyone have Autism here to help me understand ? Or just an opinion.

I have to quote that Carl Jung was on the autistic spectrum, there are records proving towards this, and this maybe why he could use active imagination naturally, I have read many stories no one could do this, only certain people, and I explored this myself. I hate anyone who refers to Autism as brain damage, in the world we live in now, parents are traumatised by their children being diagnosed, and this is because of the lack of knowledge, yes they are different, they get overwhelmed, sensory issues, perception difficulties, rigid behaviour, etc but they can see and feel, and gave an extraordinary imagination! I will give an example - The sally Anne test, this is done through the perspective of the outside world, which everyone focuses on, sally did this and Anne did that, using their processors, but for a person with Autism, they don't process the outer only the inner, tell me if I am wrong but similar strengths with INFS, we can look inwards, but with Autism there are many other things like perception, body awareness, rigid behaviour like stimming, overload etc, I do believe its overlooked. I have noticed this from my two children and myself, always pointing out a stain on a curtain, or something a typical person does not see. otherwise known as supervision, like super hearing, its been proven with the black and white dots, typical people see the dots separating colours, yet people with. autism see a pattern. Another thing that troubled me the most with my son's fecal smearing, it was like primal instinct, he had to leave his mark, and he didn't care for hygiene, I had to direct him and help him, but to him it was natural, and he didn't understand what all the fuss was about. I sense our ancestors incorporated within our unconscious. Referring to our DNA and ancestors, and through spiritual awakening which has been documented every 100 yrs since the 1700's and now we are in the 5th awakening due to the pandemic. I see human evolution we are evolving. I honestly feel spiritual awakening and connecting with one self is a discovery we all should venture on, and it's a definite for adults with Autism with support and the right guidance.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

Kinda amazing that society still fails to realize that demographics exist when it comes to cognition just like with everything else yet still pile on the pressure for everyone to conform and think exactly the same as whatever happens to be the most common in a given area etc.

 

[Asa]

Kinda amazing that society still fails to realize that demographics exist when it comes to cognition just like with everything else yet still pile on the pressure for everyone to conform and think exactly the same as whatever happens to be the most common in a given area etc.

I read that 60% of the population is neurodivergent, but because there are many ways people can be neurodivergent, neurotypicals still dominate at a homogenized 40%.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

I read that 60% of the population is neurodivergent, but because there are many ways people can be neurodivergent, neurotypicals still dominate at a homogenized 40%.

Yea noticed as much on the job, NDs often end with some of the very worst jobs with the lowest pay while NTs get the high paying corporate jobs doing very little or in some cases nothing. The same is true in education as everyone is forcibly standardized for which much of the potential is just simply wasted at an early age never mind funnel into low paying jobs later in life.

 

[Asa]

Yea noticed as much on the job, NDs often end with some of the very worst jobs with the lowest pay while NTs get the high paying corporate jobs doing very little or in some cases nothing. The same is true in education as everyone is forcibly standardized for which much of the potential is just simply wasted at an early age never mind funnel into low paying jobs later in life.

Yes, you're correct. Even being introverted is a handicap in many careers. NDs have high burn-out, too.

And, of course you know, the original purpose of the US education system was to prepare people for jobs in factories, so that isn't surprising.

Something really scary to think about that I learned from watching my FIL's experience (my FIL had ASD) is that nursing homes have no accommodations for NDs and these homes are all a nightmare of triggers.

 

[Cait Takara]

I was wondering how an INFJ autist would function considering that Autism, especially high functionning autism, is often associated with an extreme thinking preference due to a different developmental pattern.

However, my guess would be that while Autists would tend score as thinkers, many of them could actually be feelers and not know it because they would look more like someone in a loop than the usual person of one type.

What do you think ? Does anyone have Autism here to help me understand ? Or just an opinion.

I know I feel. However, that thinker side can analyze and shut them down if it will be more costly in the long run though.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

Yes, you're correct. Even being introverted is a handicap in many careers. NDs have high burn-out, too.

And, of course you know, the original purpose of the US education system was to prepare people for jobs in factories, so that isn't surprising.

Something really scary to think about that I learned from watching my FIL's experience (my FIL had ASD) is that nursing homes have no accommodations for NDs and these homes are all a nightmare of triggers.

That was one of my grandmother's old jobs and in her final years did everything possible to avoid ending up there. It is better to kick the bucket at home in peace and dignity than to suffer for months/years in one of those very costly hell holes. As for burn out it is real and have been struggling with my six day work week.

 

[Asa]

That was one of my grandmother's old jobs and in her final years did everything possible to avoid ending up there. It is better to kick the bucket at home in peace and dignity than to suffer for months/years in one of those very costly hell holes. As for burn out it is real and have been struggling with my six day work week.

Agree. Those places are nightmares. The facilities for wealthy people are posh, and anyone with the money goes to those.

I'm really sorry you have burnout. I see all your posts in the job thread.
I hate how this meat grinder world operated.

A lot of my jobs have been low-paying jobs working with the public. Customers like me and my bosses always think I'm made for the role, but it takes heavy masking and I get burn-out. It's funny how in this role, my ND traits are an asset because I was perceived as calm, honest, unbothered by crises, etc, yet in other social situations people typically have issues with any ND traits I let show.

My friend with ADHD keeps getting fired from office jobs, which he needs to support his family. His ND traits meshed well with his music career and when he worked for a gaming dev, though.

 

[Fluffyhamster]

This is the thread for me