[PUG] RANT: Reality has a Liberal bias...

Billy said:
Wait, you are saying the adults you know actually believe in those stories? Where the hell did you grow up? Certainly wasn't around here where the majority of the people actually don't believe in any of that crap. No wonder you are so insanely offensive towards Christianity, if you actually grew up around adults believing in this stuff, I think it would have bent me in a weird way too.
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Have you not met Biblical literalists? They're really not that uncommon.
 
Satya said:
It's interesting that is the seat of all persuasion. No logical, rational argument is ever going to change a person's mind no matter how well supported it is by evidence and reason, the only way to influence others is to understand their feelings. Propaganda and advertisement is considerably more effective than any degree of education or debate simply because of this fact.
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I don't think there is a black and white line between feelings and reasoning.
 
myst said:
I don't think there is a black and white line between feelings and reasoning.
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Oddly enough, neuroscience supports this. Both functions happen quite a bit in the orbitofrontal cortex. There are other parts that deal with one or the other much more (the amygdala and hypothalamus, for example, deal with emotions but not much reasoning).
 
Blind Bandit said:
There is no box. We are just waiting for the rest of the world to figure that out.
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Expand your horizons and you will see the inside walls of the box. Then keep going outward.
 
Satya said:
Level of education and field of study is the only difference I have perceived within individuals that would lead them to challenge this aspect of human nature. Based on what I have seen, I estimate that maybe 10% of the general public has critical thinking ability, and of that 10% I estimate that only 1% of those make a concerted effort to shape their own metacognition by challenging their cognitive and emotional biases. The number of individuals who seem to have any degree of awareness of their own patterns of thinking is incredibly small. Even I have trouble considering myself a member of that group because I often give into my passion despite knowing it is a fruitless endeavor and usually the equivalant of ego masturbation.
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This is what I have decided. Critical thinking is developed. This is what teachers try to do in school. People do not develope this on their own. There is a concept in education called Blooms taxonomy. It is what is used extensively in education and research. It levels the types of questions and learning in order of difficulty.

For example summarizing is considered on the lower level. Rote memory is aslo a lower level way of demonstrating what was learned. Synthesizing (integrating what was learned), evaluating are considered higher levels of mastery of what was learned. I think it is interesting.
 
sookie said:
This is what I have decided. Critical thinking is developed. This is what teachers try to do in school. People do not develope this on their own. There is a concept in education called Blooms taxonomy. It is what is used extensively in education and research. It levels the types of questions and learning in order of difficulty.

For example summarizing is considered on the lower level. Rote memory is aslo a lower level way of demonstrating what was learned. Synthesizing (integrating what was learned), evaluating are considered higher levels of mastery of what was learned. I think it is interesting.
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Really? Do I come off as an idiot or an individual who doesn't think rationally then? I have never been to college. Perhaps I am simply suffering from a delusion of intelligence.
 
Billy said:
Very very few. The hard vast majority of people around here are pretty rational.
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Smart, generally rational people can be Biblical literalists, just as "liberal Christians" and atheists can be stupid and irrational. People simply tend not to question those beliefs much, so they usually stick with what they learned growing up. I'd wager your acquaintances are no smarter than mine, and I know a number of Biblical literalists.
 
Solar Empath said:
Really? Do I come off as an idiot or an individual who doesn't think rationally then? I have never been to college. Perhaps I am simply suffering from a delusion of intelligence.
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I am completely sorry that you felt that I was making that kind of statement.

I am an elementary school teacher. So I was thinking about elementary school children when I said this. I believe that this is developed in and out of school.. My family was where I learned about thinking critically. My father was an SOB but one thing he did teach me was to evaluate what other people say and ideas that were put out there.

This was not meant as an offront to anyone. Critical thinking is developed in or out of school. Mine developed in my family. I grew up when rote schooling was how you learned. So I dont credit school with any bit of critical thinking that I have.

I am sorry to have offended you. Your assessment of your intelligence and confidence in it- I will leave it up to you. It is not for me to assess it. I am not your teacher. I am a peer.
 
sookie said:
I am completely sorry that you felt that I was making that kind of statement.

I am an elementary school teacher. So I was thinking about elementary school children when I said this. I believe that this is developed in and out of school.. My family was where I learned about thinking critically. My father was an SOB but one thing he did teach me was to evaluate what other people say and ideas that were put out there.

This was not meant as an offront to anyone. Critical thinking is developed in or out of school. Mine developed in my family. I grew up when rote schooling was how you learned. So I dont credit school with any bit of critical thinking that I have.

I am sorry to have offended you. Your assessment of your intelligence and confidence in it- I will leave it up to you. It is not for me to assess it. I am not your teacher. I am a peer.
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Only mildly annoyed for a moment. :) I wasn't really taking it personally, I simply disagree with the idea of level of education being an 'absolute' measure of a person's intelligence or reasoning ability.

I will concede that there is likely a correlation.
 
TheLastMohican said:
Smart, generally rational people can be Biblical literalists, just as "liberal Christians" and atheists can be stupid and irrational. People simply tend not to question those beliefs much, so they usually stick with what they learned growing up. I'd wager your acquaintances are no smarter than mine, and I know a number of Biblical literalists.
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It's probably related to which denominations are numerically dominant in the location.
 
Not a measure but a means. But there are more than one way to do it. Some of the most intelligent and successful people were not formally educated. Thomas Edison- who was a genious. He invented, I believe it was the filiment in light bulbs that allow for light. Was self taught. He was getting completely trashed by the teachers in school. One teacher told his mother that he was "addled" which was meant to say that he was crazy.
 
Solar Empath said:
It's probably related to which denominations are numerically dominant in the location.
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Of course. That, or we have a very interesting geographical distribution of intelligence:


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Last Mohican- I think I know what you are saying. You are saying it clearly with the map (It is clear). Can you elaborate a little more.
 
I also want to add that I credit my father with teaching critical thinking. I did not add that he was a bluecolor worker that did not go to college.
 
I get it Last Mohican. I was a little slow on the uptake. You are saying that the South would be the intellectual hub of the country.:m160:
 
sookie said:
Last Mohican- I think I know what you are saying. You are saying it clearly with the map (It is clear). Can you elaborate a little more.
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If Biblical literalism is closely correlated with irrationality, then the map shows that some parts of the country are much more irrational than others. Statistically, that seems quite unlikely.

sookie said:
I get it Last Mohican. I was a little slow on the uptake. You are saying that the South would be the intellectual hub of the country.:m160:
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The converse, actually. The southeast would supposedly have many more irrational people, because the Baptist majority is generally YEC, while Catholics are not Biblical literalists, instead accepting the standard age of the earth and evolution theory.
 
FLUSH.........BLUB,BLUB,BLUB,BLUB, blub.

That was my confidence in my critical thinking skills going down the toilet, LOL!
I was not sure if you were being literal or sarcastic or both.

I just rendered all of my previous posts as obselete in not following you!!

sookie slinks off.....lauging and slinking at the same time, LOL
 
Solar Empath said:
Only mildly annoyed for a moment. :) I wasn't really taking it personally, I simply disagree with the idea of level of education being an 'absolute' measure of a person's intelligence or reasoning ability.

I will concede that there is likely a correlation.
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The highest levels of education are often obtained outside of school. That is where you have to integrate what you have learned in theory into actual practice.
 
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