Television....the sin of all sins

[NeverAmI]

Every day I feel like I want to leave this country more and more.

I just have to make sure I would move somewhere that the grass actually IS greener.

 

[Pristinegirl]

Welcome to America. A lot of people have the ''buy now;be happ'' attitude, but there are those of us who don't fall for the commercialism/materialism.

I agree completely.

Fortunately, I don't shop at Wal-Mart.

I'm realising more and more that the Americans on here are not representative of the typical American in general, because you guys are so much smarter and aware! Stay genuine dears! :grouphug:

 

[randomsomeone]

It is interesting to study early discussion about the place of television in the U.S....to build culture and understanding and education. Noble...but it didn't last long, did it?

I had a wonderful first career (24 years) in television...I got started right at the time practical hand-held cameras allowed video to be more readily shot in the field. My area was short form documentaries. It was a very meaningful, very rich time in my life. I worked with some brilliant people...very committed to truth, to art.

Anyway, that gig (and the company I worked for) ended in the mid-90s. Rather than compromise by getting mixed up in the antics of "normal" TV, I left....finding a place to get involved in issues I felt I had previously only observed. It's been good (I still get to hire and work with producers and crews now and again)...while TV in general is just getting more and more bizarre.

Still, as a highly visual person, I confess I still get a big thrill out of a well-done documentary. I've been known to change my schedule to catch a good one!!!

 

[Pristinegirl]

I fully agree, well documentaries are great!!!

 

[acd]

You are all assuming that everything on television is shit. Real television shows ARE made by artists who want to create art. There is a lot of Television and film bashing here, but there are people who dedicate their lives to learning the craft of creating cinema or TV as a means of artistic expression, as a means of providing honesty and truth to their audience- well, to the ones who care to look.

I'm sure people go into the field meaning well... but realistically, it's an industry. The only art that is allowed to be created is the "art" that will draw in profits. If no one is watching your artsy shows and buying the stuff advertised in the comercials, then your artsy show goes off the air. Simple as that. Media is business, at the core.

Public or private broadcasting is different, indie films to an extent as well-- they don't need advertising revenue to stay on air.. so they have more freedom to be open-minded and such...

 

[Orion]

True. But like all real art, those shows tend to do poorly. And unlike other art, television that doesn't draw views dies. It's rare for real film to do well.

What does a show doing poorly have to do with artistic integrity? You can create a great show or film without it necessarily doing well. The implications of this of course are: Your validity as a producer on such content becomes under question and you may not being to proceed in making good things again and the people involved lose money. Depends what you're goal is. Most artists would say that they would want to achieve a balance. Unfortunately this balance is ruined by the screwed up economics of the Hollywood cinema. Inflated star salaries being one example.

I'm sure people go into the field meaning well... but realistically, it's an industry. The only art that is allowed to be created is the "art" that will draw in profits. If no one is watching your artsy shows and buying the stuff advertised in the comercials, then your artsy show goes off the air. Simple as that. Media is business, at the core.

Public or private broadcasting is different, indie films to an extent as well-- they don't need advertising revenue to stay on air.. so they have more freedom to be open-minded and such...

I disagree, most people don't go into the field meaning well! They want to make money! In my experience, talking to young film makers in colleges, uni, clubs and film festivals, prestige and money are the two main motivating factors in people who want to pursue making TV and film.

I guess the key to artistic integrity is the very fact that the industry tries to squander it in the first place. Like I said, there are people who want to create good content but they are the minority. It doesn't mean you can write off film & television as morally vacuous industries. It's all down to the viewer, if people watch good shows, they make good shows.

There are very important exceptions to the rules. Albeit, they are private broadcasting shows (HBO mainly) but DVD sales are a factor too (and they tend to do extremely well). The Wire, although ailing in viewers managed to squeeze out 5 seasons under constant threat of cancellation. It is one of greatest achievements of modern television. The reason for it was the unending integrity, honesty and perserverance of a few key crew members of that show, that made it what it was. They believed in the show and what they were saying.

So for all the junk, there is a gem, and those gems mean so much to the development of good content and artistic endeavours. The fact that no one has heard of them is the crime and, back to the point, part of the vicious cycle. But then again it's up to the viewers to find them... but most people don't care.

What channel do these shows play? Would you classify Salo' 120 Days of Sodom in this category of good art?

I'm not sure what you're trying to start? I have heard of Salo and read descriptions of it, personally I wouldn't watch it myself, the thought of it depresses me- not that I'm against extremes forms of cinema, I make it a point of my viewing habits to watch things that will make feel uncomfortable. Is it good art? Well now, is it art? Is the first question. It's art, if the creator was trying to communicate an idea or message through to his audience.

Is it good?

I think it's good in the sense that there are people in the world who will go to so such great lengths to present something that believe in, that would be considered very... abnormal. The fact that this director went through the process to make this film and that the actors involved were willing to do what they did to perform it, means there is something in it. It shows that the people involved were fearless and brave. Maybe the fact that it is absolutely repulsive, is the point?