[PUG] why i hate twilight
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invisible
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i think that while these products are being consumed by certain groups at high volume now, historically comparable demographics may actually have been illiterate. i think that more complex literatures continue to be produced and to sell.
i think the political issues were true in the past now, or even more true than they are now. for example women could not be published at times in the past, or could not gain admission to the formal education that would enable them to write at a level of highest literacy that was acceptable to art circles of their time, or if they were privately educated, even just to circulate their artistic works through those literary circles.
however having thought about what you have said i agree that there is truth to it. but if this worst case scenario is actually the way things are, i think that by its nature art can't remain stagnant, there will be a reaction which may already be beginning to bring things back into focus, as with postmodernism or beat literature. this is my belief though.
invisible
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the other day a customer at work asked me if i ever feel cold because of my shaven scalp. i said yes sometimes i do actually. and he said well why do you wear it that way? and i said because i like it this way. and he said but you don't even see it, i have to see it. and i said, well actually i do see it, a lot more than you do, and i like it this way, sorry.
so yeah sorry but i would find it impossible to exist as an individual if i were to submit to everyone's petty irrational hangups. maybe i do have a voice like a two year old, what's it to you? sorry again.
invisible
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yes, it's like fly spray.
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Invisible, who knew Melkor could be such a meanie gut? *gives Melkor coffee*
Anyway to the thread. I usually stay away from tween crap because in more modern times it seems to commercial driven rather than literature driven. I still gravitate toward stuff like The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe when I want to read lighthearted stuff.
Anyway to the thread. I usually stay away from tween crap because in more modern times it seems to commercial driven rather than literature driven. I still gravitate toward stuff like The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe when I want to read lighthearted stuff.
Peppermint
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I just wanted to point out that there's probably several dozen similar novels out there.
I don't get why everyone insists on having strong opinions on Twilight in particular.
I admit to having read the first book. I wanted to see what the hype was about. My question is still not fully answered. What did Meyer do to hit the nerve like that?
Why are there fans out there willing to use violence on people who bash Twilight?
I must say though, as much as the series sucks, a twitard is a formidable beast indeed. So much worse.
I don't get why everyone insists on having strong opinions on Twilight in particular.
I admit to having read the first book. I wanted to see what the hype was about. My question is still not fully answered. What did Meyer do to hit the nerve like that?
Why are there fans out there willing to use violence on people who bash Twilight?
I must say though, as much as the series sucks, a twitard is a formidable beast indeed. So much worse.
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So we agree on their arrangement. My point was just that there may be a tendency for people to get excited about a (random) piece of work, which in its own time would even seem unworthy of publishing, for various reasons.
This may sound now way too far-fetched, but there was also an air of excitement and resentment surrounding the works of Bront
sassafras
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I wouldn't go so far as to press any judgment upon level of intelligence or maturity in Twilight fans, nor do I think the quality of writing, plot and characters are the merits on which the books appeal. Psychologically, they address the common want of unconditional love, intrigue and "specialness." The fact that Bella and Edward are bland, two-dimensional characters with a two-dimensional relationship is essentially the biggest hook. Readers are able to project themselves and their desired relationships upon these two protagonists. The fact that these books are written in simple literary language and in first-person point-of-view just makes that aspect of projection all that easier. If anything, I would dare say that the mass popularity of Twilight is a measure of what most people feel is lacking in their daily lives. Adventure, excitement, true love, devotion, acceptance, meaning, a unique place in their world, etc.
It just saddens me that instead of attending to the details of their daily lives, a lot of these people are spending a large portion of their precious time identifying and being "Twihards," and in doing so, are acknowledging their belief that the things that they so desperately desire can only be found between the pages of a novel, amidst vampires, werewolves, and other creatures/males of pure fantasy.
I dislike Twilight because I'm neither interested in vampires or romance, and because the thinly disguised 'damsel in distress' motif is hardly my cup of tea. Oh, and yeah... because the sheer insanity of this ridiculous fandom scares the living bejeesus out of me. The almost cult mentality behind this phenomenon is enough to give me pause. Does anyone else agree?
It just saddens me that instead of attending to the details of their daily lives, a lot of these people are spending a large portion of their precious time identifying and being "Twihards," and in doing so, are acknowledging their belief that the things that they so desperately desire can only be found between the pages of a novel, amidst vampires, werewolves, and other creatures/males of pure fantasy.
I dislike Twilight because I'm neither interested in vampires or romance, and because the thinly disguised 'damsel in distress' motif is hardly my cup of tea. Oh, and yeah... because the sheer insanity of this ridiculous fandom scares the living bejeesus out of me. The almost cult mentality behind this phenomenon is enough to give me pause. Does anyone else agree?
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Melkor
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DevilDoll
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I think it does show emotional immaturity for a reason you listed."Readers are able to project themselves and their desired relationships upon these two protagonists." Living in such a fantasy to avoid what one is lacking in their own life is far from healthy. If they feel they are lacking love and emotion then they should find a way to achieve it, and Twilight is not the guide. Real life is not a fairy tale. There comes a time in life when you have to learn to separate fantasy and real life. We learn Santa isn't real and we can't grow up to be a princess, however some people don't out grow the idea of a fantasy relationship where the "perfect" man comes and sweeps them off their feet. It doesn't work that way. Relationships aren't fairy tales and couples don't live happily ever after. There are ups and downs. Sadly, I have met many women who are still looking for "prince charming" and are in their 30s. There is no Edward and you are not Bella. Just like I'm not Arwen and Aragorn isn't real. It's a wonderful story (Lord of the Rings, not Twilight), but it is fantasy and nothing more.
sassafras
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For the most part, you're right; it may speak to the emotional maturity of certain fans, but I wouldn't go so far as to paint all Twilight readers with the same brush. Because there are people who also happen to enjoy the series who are also well-adjusted adults/teens living in by society's standards of a well-adjusted adult/teen world, and Twilight is a nice, light, escape for them. Their enjoyment is moderate and they've gotten into it because it's a pop-culture phenomenon and it's been recommended to them by a few folks. And at that point, it's not different from someone who reads Tolkien, King, J.K. Rowling, or S.S. Gowda for leisure. At that point, it just comes down to a matter of taste.
I'm just concerned for anyone who proclaims themselves to be a die-hard fan to the point that their fan-ishness taints every aspect of their daily lives. That's when it becomes extremely disconcerting. It wouldn't at all surprise me if much of the frustration with Twilight stems from the generally unsolved mystery of how such a sub-standard set of books and movies could have achieve such appeal that it hinges on mass obsession. And it's precisely why I feel a stronger aversion to it than I would otherwise. If it weren't a pop culture phenomenon, I probably wouldn't have even read past the first few pages of it in the bookstore.
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Only with this part I disagree. It shouldn't matter whether a crowd of leprous zombies likes something. In theory, it still could have merit. Otherwise you're right, though this is only the female reader perspective. As a male reader, I just found the thoughts of the Bella character growingly amusing (she's so silly, yet so integral). If there's anything that I respect about Twilight - it's unpretentious and pure. It's very honestly bad, as in "i wrote this piece of (poor) fanart between cooking and washing". The average reader can easily imagine their sister writing it. That's kind of surprisingly appealing.
sassafras
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No, you're right, my choice of reading material shouldn't really factor what the crowd thinks; you like it, you like it, you don't, you don't. That should be it. And to be fair, I did give Twilight a fair shot. I read half of the first book and saw the first movie. It wasn't my cup of tea, so I moved on to other things.
Still, you can't help but watch from the side lines sometimes. I find it rather interesting that this series has had such a polarized effect on pop-culture. You're either a massive fan of the series and camping out in the rain, wearing Team Edward t-shirts and crying at the mere mention of Robert Patterson or you hate it all with a riveting passion. I'm speaking in generalizations here, of course, but from what I observed, very few people seem to have a neutral opinion on the Twilight phenomenon.
I personally tend to shy away from things that have such an effect on mass psychology. I find any kind of obsessiveness rather uncomfortable, especially if I personally cannot see what the big friggin' deal is. In all honesty, I don't look down on anyone who reads Twilight, nor am I about to make any scathing judgments on a person's level of intelligence and/or maturity just because they enjoy a certain genre or novel series. You'll probably only see my eyebrows rise if your appreciation for the series happens to go way beyond watching a couple of movies and reading the books... and it'll be out of concern rather than derision. Because there seems to be a very high number of Twilight fans that fall into the obsessive camp. Kind of freaks me out that something like a book about vampires could have such a potentially maladaptive effect on so many lives. It makes me wonder whether it's something about the books themselves or the mental/emotional state of our society right now that lends itself to such behavior. More likely, the latter... which is twice as worrisome.
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jyrffw54
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i've read everyone's posts on this thread.
I am not offended by anything anyone has said.
I like the series alot. I don't judge people for not liking it, so you shouldn't judge people for liking it, nor belittle their intelligence.
I am also well aware that there are people who have taken their fandom to the point of insanity (ie, the woman stealing the Edward cut-out), and look to them with concern.
I don't think the wriiting itself is of the best quality, but I do indeed find it a nice escape.
The only thing that really annoys me is people not reading the novel and judging it.
To each his/her own
Good day
I am not offended by anything anyone has said.
I like the series alot. I don't judge people for not liking it, so you shouldn't judge people for liking it, nor belittle their intelligence.
I am also well aware that there are people who have taken their fandom to the point of insanity (ie, the woman stealing the Edward cut-out), and look to them with concern.
I don't think the wriiting itself is of the best quality, but I do indeed find it a nice escape.
The only thing that really annoys me is people not reading the novel and judging it.
To each his/her own
Good day
Detective Conan
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I am not offended by anything anyone has said.
I like the series alot. I don't judge people for not liking it, so you shouldn't judge people for liking it, nor belittle their intelligence.
I am also well aware that there are people who have taken their fandom to the point of insanity (ie, the woman stealing the Edward cut-out), and look to them with concern.
I don't think the wriiting itself is of the best quality, but I do indeed find it a nice escape.
The only thing that really annoys me is people not reading the novel and judging it.
To each his/her own
Good day
+1, if all Twilight fans were this civil, I wouldn't mind the series so much and could ignore it like a mild itch.
I personally gave the book a try. As a bibliophile, I'm somewhat obligated to give all books a chance. This was before it obtained its current following. I didn't like the book after the first 25 pages, it didn't have me hooked at all, and I stopped reading there. The writing was tolerable, but the story wasn't. I could say a lot more on my dislikes, but at this point of this discussion, I'd be regurgitating what others have already said.
I will leave everyone with a one-sentence summary of the overall plot of the Twilight saga: "A girl struggles to choose between Necrophilia and Bestiality."
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Twilight doesn't suck.
Crazy fangirls do.
Crazy haters do.
It's overrated, but its suckyness is even more.
I don't personally like Twilight, but it doesn't mean it suck.
Might as well create a a thousand threads called "Why I hate the adventures of bobo the clown", "why I hate Sad Tears Falling From A Sad Woman", "Why I hate Blood On The Kitchen Table", ect. (Not directed at you TS, but to anyone who seem to live only to hate twilight)
Crazy fangirls do.
Crazy haters do.
It's overrated, but its suckyness is even more.
I don't personally like Twilight, but it doesn't mean it suck.
Might as well create a a thousand threads called "Why I hate the adventures of bobo the clown", "why I hate Sad Tears Falling From A Sad Woman", "Why I hate Blood On The Kitchen Table", ect. (Not directed at you TS, but to anyone who seem to live only to hate twilight)
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i've read everyone's posts on this thread.
I am not offended by anything anyone has said.
I like the series alot. I don't judge people for not liking it, so you shouldn't judge people for liking it, nor belittle their intelligence.
I am also well aware that there are people who have taken their fandom to the point of insanity (ie, the woman stealing the Edward cut-out), and look to them with concern.
I don't think the wriiting itself is of the best quality, but I do indeed find it a nice escape.
The only thing that really annoys me is people not reading the novel and judging it.
To each his/her own
Good day
+1
Comparing Twilight to intelligence is rather ridiculous, they are both entirely on a different scale. I know plenty of people who use it as an escape and are rather bright. People assume that certain things are intellectually degrading, such as specific types of music, television shows and novels. The truth is that they have little to no correlation. I can see why people might also related to immaturity and lack of emotional intelligence but even then the connection is very loosely correlated, and it is subjective to each specific person. I remember there was a thread once on typing individuals by musical preference, in the end we were all surprised by the great musical diversity shown. Personally, I believe this demonstrates that personality and intelligence have little or no connection to this sort of ''escapes'' people use.