Why not just legalize all drugs?

Are you kidding, it's nearly impossible for me to get a hold of weed here too.

Mostly because I won't just give a friend money. I demand to be the person dealing with the person who has the weed, and I want seeds in my lot.
 
bear. shut up.

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[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cWyu2kytgQ"]YouTube- I smell Bear[/ame]
 
i'd bet money it's more about money and the impact on the economy than it is about social welfare =P
 
If cannabis was legalised they would make more money because they could tax it and would need to spend less on enforcing the law.

Governments would make billions in tax from cannabis alone
 
Personally I currently favour decriminalising drugs with low or no physical addictiveness (so that's stuff like cannabis, LSD, ecstasy, etc.) and making drugs with high physical addictiveness (heroin, cocaine, meth, etc.) freely available on prescription.

The evidence gathered on the subject clearly shows that this would result in significantly reduced drug addiction and drug related crime rates, and would pretty much cripple the black market trade in these drugs practically overnight.
 
I've always been against the legalization of drugs, because I genuinely dislike them. I even used to support banning alcohol and cigarettes.

Now that I've done more research, I'm forced to conclude that it's in our best interests to legalize the drugs. Ultimately, the harm in keeping them illegal is greater than the harm in legalizing them.

It creates such a large black market that it puts people in danger, especially since guns are so easy to obtain. Look at Mexico... if we don't stop this war on drugs, it's only a matter of time until we're headed the same way. Martial law, random killings... the drug cartels have too much power, and legalization is the only way to take it away from them.

Drugs hurt people and destroy families, yes. But the black market we create by prohibiting them is even worse. On top of that, we spend so much money on enforcement, and only stop a small amount of the drug trade. It makes people afraid to find help for their drug addiction because it's so stigmatized and illegal. It's far past the point of diminishing returns.

It would be far more effective to legalize drugs and put the money that was being used for enforcement towards support programs to help people quit them. That would help more people than our current laws do.

If you ask me, we would be better off banning guns and having legal drugs, than the other way around. Guns cause far more social problems than drugs do, I promise.
 
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I've always been against the legalization of drugs, because I genuinely dislike them. I even used to support banning alcohol and cigarettes.

Now that I've done more research, I'm forced to conclude that it's in our best interests to legalize the drugs. Ultimately, the harm in keeping them illegal is greater than the harm in legalizing them.

It creates such a large black market that it puts people in danger, especially since guns are so easy to obtain. Look at Mexico... if we don't stop this war on drugs, it's only a matter of time until we're headed the same way. Martial law, random killings... the drug cartels have too much power, and legalization is the only way to take it away from them.

Drugs hurt people and destroy families, yes. But the black market we create by prohibiting them is even worse. On top of that, we spend so much money on enforcement, and only stop a small amount of the drug trade. It makes people afraid to find help for their drug addiction because it's so stigmatized and illegal. It's far past the point of diminishing returns.

It would be far more effective to legalize drugs and put the money that was being used for enforcement towards support programs to help people quit them. That would help more people than our current laws do.

If you ask me, we would be better off banning guns and having legal drugs, than the other way around. Guns cause far more social problems than drugs do, I promise.
1. By banning guns, won't you create another black market for them? People want guns, just like people want drugs, and they will get them regardless of legality.

2. Many addicts don't seek help not because of fear of stigmatization. A crack head looks like a crack head. It's because they are underfunded for public use. There are 3 methadone clinics in my city with a population of about 500,000 where about 15% live below the poverty line, and only about 20% have some sort of college education. The access for potential abusers is extremely low.

3. If you legalize drugs, you don't put the drug cartels out of business. It's what they want. They have the world's drugs, they have the supply, they are the ones who are going to sell it when it is legal. If the goal is to destroy the cartels, legalizing won't.

4. More access=more abusers. Addiction to the big four is a terrible terrible thing to see. The people who are addicts now are going to be addicts regardless of legality. Creating more access allows those who have considered but are too "lazy" to get it the ability to become addicts. What we need are more resources for those afflicted by addiction (especially their families), not a larger population of possible abusers.
 
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If drugs were legalized, I'd be FUCKED. The fact that they're illegal is the only thing keeping me from being a serious abuser.
 
3. If you legalize drugs, you don't put the drug cartels out of business. It's what they want. They have the world's drugs, they have the supply, they are the ones who are going to sell it when it is legal. If the goal is to destroy the cartels, legalizing won't.

To the contrary. Making it legal creates new markets and allows for regulation. Legalizing drugs is exactly what cartels do not want. The inflated price of drugs would fall considerably with the abundant increase in supply and it would just become another crop like tobacco.

4. More access=more abusers. Addiction to the big four is a terrible terrible thing to see. The people who are addicts now are going to be addicts regardless of legality. Creating more access allows those who have considered but are too "lazy" to get it the ability to become addicts. What we need are more resources for those afflicted by addiction (especially their families), not a larger population of possible abusers.
This is also false. Countries which have legalized drugs have shown, in studies, to have lower rates of drug abuse. More access does not equal more abusers.
 
If drugs were legalized, I'd be FUCKED. The fact that they're illegal is the only thing keeping me from being a serious abuser.

I would say then you have greater problems. There should be a lot more in the way of your abusing drugs than their legality. Your health, occupation, family, finances, goals and aspirations, safety, reputation, etc. are just a few things that should have a higher priority in how you live your life than the legality of a substance.
 
This is also false. Countries which have legalized drugs have shown, in studies, to have lower rates of drug abuse. More access does not equal more abusers.
I'd like to see some of these studies. Not because I'm doubting they are there, but because I'd like to educate myself further on this matter.
 
1. By banning guns, won't you create another black market for them? People want guns, just like people want drugs, and they will get them regardless of legality.

Yes, but people don't want guns as badly as drugs, nor do they need as many. It wouldn't be as lucrative. Also, guns enable far more crimes. Being able to arrest someone for possession of a gun rather than waiting until they commit a crime with it would probably reduce crime substantially. There are few reasons to carry a gun that don't involve murder or the threat of it.

2. Many addicts don't seek help not because of fear of stigmatization. A crack head looks like a crack head. It's because they are underfunded for public use. There are 3 methadone clinics in my city with a population of about 500,000 where about 15% live below the poverty line, and only about 20% have some sort of college education. The access for potential abusers is extremely low.
Well, yes. But legalizing drugs would stop money from being wasted on enforcement, which could be used to fund the clinics.

3. If you legalize drugs, you don't put the drug cartels out of business. It's what they want. They have the world's drugs, they have the supply, they are the ones who are going to sell it when it is legal. If the goal is to destroy the cartels, legalizing won't.
That doesn't seem very logical. Just because it's legal doesn't mean there would be no regulations on it, or that they'd be able to sell it exactly the way they always have. It would be easy to set the market up in such a way as to hurt the existing cartels, and benefit new businesses that market them.

Think about it... farmers would be able to grow it, it would probably be held to standards (possibly arbitrary ones) that the illegal marajuana wasn't held to, and end up costing far less than they wanted to sell it for.
4. More access=more abusers. Addiction to the big four is a terrible terrible thing to see. The people who are addicts now are going to be addicts regardless of legality. Creating more access allows those who have considered but are too "lazy" to get it the ability to become addicts. What we need are more resources for those afflicted by addiction (especially their families), not a larger population of possible abusers.
And the reason we aren't paying for more resources for those afflicted by addiction, is because we're spending so much on largely ineffective enforcement programs.

If it didn't cost so much in resources to keep them illegal, I would agree with you. But it seems like people have a natural tendency to ignore the cost of enforcing a law, and only look at the benefits.

Also, the majority of drug money is made from marajuana and such. Not the big four. Let's just say that not enough people who get addicted to those live long enough for it to be consistently profitable for the drug dealers.

I'm not sure what we can do about the big four. Perhaps we could start off by legalizing marajuana, and do so in a way which would hurt the cartels.

Besides, think about our economy. Think about how much drug money is being pumped through it without tax. Even regular sales tax on it would yield a significant amount of money.
 
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There are so many government agencies that rely on the drug war for funding, that to legalize drugs, even weed would put the bureaucrats that work in those agencies out of work.
They fight any talk of legalization to save their asses.

That's what it really comes down to.

Are you kidding, it's nearly impossible for me to get a hold of weed here too.

Mostly because I won't just give a friend money. I demand to be the person dealing with the person who has the weed, and I want seeds in my lot.

You want seeds?
I've never heard anyone say that in my 34 years of marijuana use.
(Would be 35, but I've been out of the loop for about a year after my last contact moved out of state.)
A lot of what we get here comes from British Columbia, if it is not grown here locally in a grow house.
BC Bud rules.
 
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I'd like to see some of these studies. Not because I'm doubting they are there, but because I'd like to educate myself further on this matter.

I'll see what I can do.

http://www.cedro-uva.org/lib/reinarman.dutch.html
http://skeptically.org/recdrugs/id16.html

This is a difficult thing to find studies on, given the political nature of the debate and the fact that you have to pay to see a lot of the best studies. However, typically studies of the most liberal drug states show that they have approximately the same usage as those that criminalize it. They just don't have all the negative effects of a black market to go with it, such as the homicide rates and criminal justice costs.
 
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Yeah... seeds... back in the 70s -- erm, there's got to be a statute of limitations on these things, right? Anyway, back then my brothers rigged up a little illicit greenhouse using grow-lights in our crawl space, which our parents knew nothing about, and I thought they were houseplants, so naturally, I brought one up to show my parents. (I was SIX. Six year olds cannot keep secrets, nor would I have understood the need to... the plants looked pretty. And I played in the crawlspace all the time, and my brothers KNEW this. This is the kind of poor thinking marijuana can lead to, people. Take it as a warning.)

Anyway. That was traumatic for all parties concerned, but surely if a couple of idiot teenagers in the 70s in the bible belt could do it, they are not that hard to get?
 
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Yes, but people don't want guns as badly as drugs, nor do they need as many. It wouldn't be as lucrative. Also, guns enable far more crimes. Being able to arrest someone for possession of a gun rather than waiting until they commit a crime with it would probably reduce crime substantially. There are few reasons to carry a gun that don't involve murder or the threat of it.
Well hunting is a big deal in the United States. People will want their hunting rifles and hunting pistols, for all the crazy...er...adventurous, who hunt bear with pistols. Hunters will never want to give up their guns. Semi-automatics, and the such? I'm with you on that. There simply is no need for them in my opinion. People will argue that by making guns illegal only the bad guys will have them. I'm not saying I agree with them, but making guns illegal in the United States would be a huge hurdle to cross.

Well, yes. But legalizing drugs would stop money from being wasted on enforcement, which could be used to fund the clinics.
I'm all for legalizing marijuana, shrooms, and the sort. We would save a great deal in enforcement by legalizing marijuana that could be used to fund clinics

That doesn't seem very logical. Just because it's legal doesn't mean there would be no regulations on it, or that they'd be able to sell it exactly the way they always have. It would be easy to set the market up in such a way as to hurt the existing cartels, and benefit new businesses that market them.
I cede. You are probably right. Legalizing would probably hurt cartels.

Think about it... farmers would be able to grow it, it would probably be held to standards (possibly arbitrary ones) that the illegal marajuana wasn't held to, and end up costing far less than they wanted to sell it for.
And the reason we aren't paying for more resources for those afflicted by addiction, is because we're spending so much on largely ineffective enforcement programs.
Again, I'm all for legalizing bud. The quality of the product would go up, and fewer people would want to buy weed from south of the boarder. The best weed is hydroponically grown, and that is usually already grown in the US. We would save enforcement money and we would be able to spend money fighting pot to help those addicted by the big four.

If it didn't cost so much in resources to keep them illegal, I would agree with you. But it seems like people have a natural tendency to ignore the cost of enforcing a law, and only look at the benefits.

Also, the majority of drug money is made from marajuana and such. Not the big four. Let's just say that not enough people who get addicted to those live long enough for it to be consistently profitable for the drug dealers.
Pot makes a great deal of money, and so does enforcing it's illegality. It also isn't nearly as harmful as the big four (some people would argue with me and say it isn't at all harmful) If it is true that pot makes up the majority of drug money, and we spend so much to enforce its legal status, why would we legalize the big four if they are so small scale?

Also, heroin, crack, and meth addicts are extremely profitable to dealers because of their addictive qualities. It is an unbelievably expensive habit. I've known people who would spend $400 a week on cocaine. People get their money in all sorts of ways, but few abusers are dealers. The dealers don't use because it's so addictive that they'd use a good deal of their product without making bank.

I'm not sure what we can do about the big four. Perhaps we could start off by legalizing marajuana, and do so in a way which would hurt the cartels.

Besides, think about our economy. Think about how much drug money is being pumped through it without tax. Even regular sales tax on it would yield a significant amount of money.
I'm all for legalizing marijuana, LSD, shrooms, E, and the such. I am against the legalization of heroin, meth, crack, and cocaine.
 
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