[PUG] All white people are racist and must confront their racism

Guys I'm gonna tell you a funny story about the last time I saw @slant in Tinychat.

Someone brought up the fact that I am part Asian, and slant protested furiously, saying, "No she isn't! She's white!"

LOL I'm not allowed to be what I am. So I told her that I am indeed half Chinese, and she ragequitted Tinychat. I have witnesses!

Anyway yeah that's the sort of person who made this thread. Not that I think the premise of this thread is too bad or that slant is dumb/bad, but she does have some funny ideas sometimes and ways of getting them across. Like just don't take everything word for word and super seriously. Honestly just don't worry about it.
 
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im racist. its really strange and i dont understand it. my choice of life partner is unaffected by this. id very happily spend my life with someone of any race. and this has no influence on my choice of friend or business contact or any other type of association. but im definitely still racist, absolutely.
 
WellNoWonder said:
This is the fucking shit that irritates me about so called progressives.

We can talk all day long about being progressive and liberal, and woot the fuck blah blah.... do we know our fellow human is suffering from the shit of yesteryear? Will you "march" 60s style for it? People were fucking killed for believing in human rights.

and I wonder, why are people afraid of black separatists? it's not like they all up in the SCOTUS, influencing decisions.

are you really afraid? They are loud and oh.... they're black. they don't run corporations. they're not CEOs. there's no military contracts. prison profits... no comment.

I will say it blatantly now, check the racism. there's no need or time for it

and this is not directed to yall in particular, just a rant cuz I'm annoyed with the bullshit
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I agree with you, and honestly I'm not entirely sure where you were responding to what I said?
 
@bamf sorry Idaho is known for it's backward people. lol It's changing slowly only cause new people are moving in....​
 
bamf said:
Racism is an institution of society,
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I am personally unable to see the similarities between racism and marriage, art, Military ,education, language, medicine, etc. I don't agree that they should even be in the same category as things society deems important.
 
the said:
I am personally unable to see the similarities between racism and marriage, art, Military ,education, language, medicine, etc. I don't agree that they should even be in the same category as things society deems important.
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They're all collective actions of the greater populace, but I would disagree that certain things you have listed are "institutions." From my learning, institution applies to, again, collective actions that a society takes as a whole. Marriage would be part of the institution of the family, military the institution of the government, with education, media, economics, and religion being others. When a group is denied protection or access to certain aspects of these larger group actions, they're denied access to the institutions. In this way, racism is institutionalized. Access to things such as government, education, media, and economics are hindered based off of race, and this is true in the United States.
 
bamf said:
They're all collective actions of the greater populace, but I would disagree that certain things you have listed are "institutions." From my learning, institution applies to, again, collective actions that a society takes as a whole. Marriage would be part of the institution of the family, military the institution of the government, with education, media, economics, and religion being others. When a group is denied protection or access to certain aspects of these larger group actions, they're denied access to the institutions. In this way, racism is institutionalized. Access to things such as government, education, media, and economics are hindered based off of race, and this is true in the United States.
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That is a kind of racism. It is not the ONLY kind.

By definitions, all racism takes is a thought. If one person even believes without even acting on it, they are a racist.

It could be argued that the topic here is not entirely racist by definitions, but not on this basis that you're presenting. The topic doesn't necessarily imply superiority of some other race, but it is close enough in my opinion in that if the premise were said by somebody of another race, it could be construed rather poorly. I think if you say something racist against your own race then it is still racist, because it has to do with the premise and not who is delivering it.
 
sprinkles said:
That is a kind of racism. It is not the ONLY kind.

By definitions, all racism takes is a thought. If one person even believes without even acting on it, they are a racist.

It could be argued that the topic here is not entirely racist by definitions, but not on this basis that you're presenting. The topic doesn't necessarily imply superiority of some other race, but it is close enough in my opinion in that if the premise were said by somebody of another race, it could be construed rather poorly. I think if you say something racist against your own race then it is still racist, because it has to do with the premise and not who is delivering it.
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Yeah.
@bamf

If someone was never exposed to society or any ideas like racism, and independently from the workings of their own mind decided that all the dark skinned people they saw were lazy and dirty, that would most certainly be racism. Racism exists as a concept independent of all of this, and you and I both know it. It may not fit the commonly understood "official" definition of what racism is "supposed to be", but no other description would fit it better; "hate" or "prejudice" works but also shies away from the prevailing nature of what it is. The institutionalized racism that exists now spawned from one thought like that, and the word "racism" came to be in order to describe this phenomena, and nothing else. What else, if not these sorts of matters, would have made the understood conception of it come to be?

And as I understand it, even academically, "institutionalized racism" is a concept all on its own that is just a subtype of racism. Here: http://www.ucalgary.ca/cared/formsofracism

edit: ^^^^^ why the fuck did I type this whole paragraph when I could've just linked that. Anyway ya bamf ur wrong on the internet.
 
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niffer said:
Yeah.
@bamf

If someone was never exposed to society or any ideas like racism, and independently from the workings of their own mind decided that all the dark skinned people they saw were lazy and dirty, that would most certainly be racism. Racism exists as a concept independent of all of this, and you and I both know it. It may not fit the commonly understood "official" definition of what racism is "supposed to be", but no other description would fit it better; "hate" or "prejudice" works but also shies away from the prevailing nature of what it is. The institutionalized racism that exists now spawned from one thought like that, and the word "racism" came to be in order to describe this phenomena, and nothing else. What else, if not these sorts of matters, would have made the understood conception of it come to be?

And as I understand it, even academically, "institutionalized racism" is a concept all on its own that is just a subtype of racism. Here: http://www.ucalgary.ca/cared/formsofracism

edit: ^^^^^ why the fuck did I type this whole paragraph when I could've just linked that. Anyway ya bamf ur wrong on the internet.
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Yes and moreover the argument that racism must be wholly institutional and that individuals cannot be racist can easily be used as a closet racist defense, where mysteriously all individuals manage to 'not be racist!' (when anyone is looking at least)

I won't make that accusation, I'm just noting that it does happen.
 
niffer said:
Yeah.
@bamf

If someone was never exposed to society or any ideas like racism, and independently from the workings of their own mind decided that all the dark skinned people they saw were lazy and dirty, that would most certainly be racism. Racism exists as a concept independent of all of this, and you and I both know it. It may not fit the commonly understood "official" definition of what racism is "supposed to be", but no other description would fit it better; "hate" or "prejudice" works but also shies away from the prevailing nature of what it is. The institutionalized racism that exists now spawned from one thought like that, and the word "racism" came to be in order to describe this phenomena, and nothing else. What else, if not these sorts of matters, would have made the understood conception of it come to be?

And as I understand it, even academically, "institutionalized racism" is a concept all on its own that is just a subtype of racism. Here: http://www.ucalgary.ca/cared/formsofracism

edit: ^^^^^ why the fuck did I type this whole paragraph when I could've just linked that. Anyway ya bamf ur wrong on the internet.
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Actually, your sources backs up what I've been saying if you read it.

"However, "individual" racism is not created in a vacuum but instead emerges from a society's foundational beliefs and ‘ways' of seeing/doing things, and is manifested in organizations, institutions, and systems (including education)."

"Individual Racism is connected to/learned from broader socio-economic histories and processes and is supported and reinforced by systemic racism."

"Because we live in such a culture of individualism (and with the privilege of freedom of speech), some people argue that their statements/ideas are not racist because they are just "personal opinion." Here, it is important to point out how individualism functions to erase hierarchies of power, and to connect unrecognized personal ideologies to larger racial or systemic ones. (That is, individualism can be used as a defensive reaction.) This is why it is crucial to understand systemic racism and how it operates."

Basically everything you said your source proved is opposite, and rather it reinforces what I've been saying all along.
 
sprinkles said:
Yes and moreover the argument that racism must be wholly institutional and that individuals cannot be racist can easily be used as a closet racist defense, where mysteriously all individuals manage to 'not be racist!' (when anyone is looking at least)

I won't make that accusation, I'm just noting that it does happen.
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I never said individuals cannot be racist, but I disagreed that a white kid getting jumped in an all-black school was an act of racism because racism is rooted in social institutions. Again, it doesn't make it any more or less "worse," but it can't be called something it isn't.
 
Its seems that noone wants to agree on which definition of racism to use.
 
bamf said:
I never said individuals cannot be racist, but I disagreed that a white kid getting jumped in an all-black school was an act of racism because racism is rooted in social institutions. Again, it doesn't make it any more or less "worse," but it can't be called something it isn't.
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LOL no and you know it too. That is so way off what you actually said that you're just making stuff up now.

If you don't mean something then don't fricking say it.

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Moreover, your above statement is a non-truth anyway so you're STILL wrong. Nothing necessarily implies in your example that the attackers cannot be racist. It is logically a non-answer and doesn't follow. Just give it up.
 
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[MENTION=3998]niffer[/MENTION]

It's not only 'possible' for racism to be created in a vacuum, it might also necessarily be created that way unless one wants to claim that it existed in perpetuity.
 
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