Clinton vs Trump, Trump vs Clinton

James said:
I don't know if either of you have seen the Adam Curtis documentary HyperNormalisation ? It's on BBC IPlayer at present if you have anyway to access that. It wasn't shown on any bbc mainstream TV channel and never will be. Whilst I won't endorse the views he puts forward, it's a very interesting piece if you have almost 3 hours to spare. He goes to great lengths to show, the world presented to us, not just on TV, but also very skilfully via the internet is maybe not all it seems. I'll take a wild guess you both believe that already anyway.

One of his main points is the near constant seed of doubt and disagreement that is sown between people. A very planned propaganda of how to divide people on a near industrial scale. Whenever someone disagrees with my "politics" I alway want to ask them how many yachts they have. If it's less than 3 we probably have more in common than either of us may think. Some of us believe in democracy, and some plutocracy. To me it's far more than just about traditional left/right wing party political politics any more.

Instead of allowing those 'who pull the strings' to control and manipulate us, I think it's worth taking a pause. This election maybe very genuine in many respects, but I think there is also an element of the 'men behind the curtain' having a drink together afterwards. Someone once said cynically, if voting could change anything it'd be illegal. I don't subscribe to that view, but there is probably a grain of truth in it. You know what I think would really worry 'the men behind the curtain?'

If two people with such seemingly different views, decided to talk to each other, maybe respect each other a little. Who knows huh ? Just a crazy thought. Now you both hate me ? I'll try to keep it down from here on in.
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I agree. The ability to discuss your view, the thought process behind it etc is highly important. My issue...the one I cant get past are peoples "this is just the way I feel about it." Now, that is a valid way to go through life because all you really have so to get through life is to live it. But, for someone's whose mind works the way it does, it will drive me insane if I let it.
Anyway, if I get the chance and remember I may watch it. Is it on netflix by any chance?

Also, @Stu may not realize it but even though I do not feel he has explained his position well I still respect him. Which is why he remains off ignore. Though there have been times...
 
Hillary... oh Hillary. .. wake up. Its your email investigation. ..its baaaack.
Rot in jail.
 
CindyLou said:
Well. I guess I won't state the obvious tonight. I'm happy but I'm embarrassed the world has to watch.
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"Happy/Embarrassed" - I like what you wrote here - felt like such a gut level response and really resonated with me. You just described (for me) so succinctly the stark polarisation that is the US election. Definitely food for thought - there's so much for me to digest/think about in those two words. Thank you!

PS: I'm no being sarcastic. :wink:
 
Sorry, I liked your post so much that I posted twice! stupid pc froze and not sure how to delete it?
 
I feel like my words of advice to Trump are, shut up. Just keep your trap closed for when you are President.

For Hillary. ..just do what your prison wife says.
 
Eventhorizon said:
Hillary... oh Hillary. .. wake up. Its your email investigation. ..its baaaack.
Rot in jail.
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Lol. EH...no matter how much you hate her, she is not going to jail. You need to accept this and move on.
 
To me, the timing of all this stinks. It stinks even more than Hillarys original emails did. Why now ?

I am not blaming Trump, I think this is above his pay grade. It reminded me of two things, the first was our UK election in 2010. The then prime minister Gordon Brown had a "microphone" moment when he was a bit rude about a voter, not realizing the audio was still being recorded. It was later broadcast on all the channels. Sounds fair right ? After all he did say it. From what I understand though, this sort of thing happens routinely. The previous conservative Prime Minister John Major once called some of his cabinet colleagues 'b@strds' and that was on video as well as audio. It was just never broadcast. They very rarely are, when this sort of thing happens. Gordon Brown's was broadcast. It pretty much finished him and the election.

The second thing this kinda reminded me of, was that clip of Ronald Reagan (when he was already President) being told to 'speed it up' as he gave a speech. If Hillary Clinton has broken the law, whether she wins the election or not, then I hope she is caught and dealt with accordingly. However my radar tells me, this is maybe just another power play from the 'men behind the curtain'. I think what happens on Nov 8th matters, but what happens on Nov 9th and onwards matters a lot more, whoever gets elected.

I've included the clip of Reagan here. It's narrated by Michael Moore, and I know some people hate him. Personally whoever you do or don't vote for I think it's a revealing little glimpse about how power really operates, not just in America, but right across the world. I like to be honest as far as I can be in life, but I am quite aware that when Dostoyevsky wrote about an honest character, he entitled the novel 'The Idiot'. To me that's a bit of a bleak way to see the world, but it does make you think.

 
Anywhere But Here said:
Lol. EH...no matter how much you hate her, she is not going to jail. You need to accept this and move on.
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Probably. Corruption at this level may be impossible to fight. But if true, I think I can safely say no one wants the outcome. Pandoras box once open, can never be closed. I think its in everyone's best interest this plays out in exactly the way ever one knows that it should. Even if thats deep down.
 
James said:
To me, the timing of all this stinks. It stinks even more than Hillarys original emails did. Why now ?

I am not blaming Trump, I think this is above his pay grade. It reminded me of two things, the first was our UK election in 2010. The then prime minister Gordon Brown had a "microphone" moment when he was a bit rude about a voter, not realizing the audio was still being recorded. It was later broadcast on all the channels. Sounds fair right ? After all he did say it. From what I understand though, this sort of thing happens routinely. The previous conservative Prime Minister John Major once called some of his cabinet colleagues 'b@strds' and that was on video as well as audio. It was just never broadcast. They very rarely are, when this sort of thing happens. Gordon Brown's was broadcast. It pretty much finished him and the election.

The second thing this kinda reminded me of, was that clip of Ronald Reagan (when he was already President) being told to 'speed it up' as he gave a speech. If Hillary Clinton has broken the law, whether she wins the election or not, then I hope she is caught and dealt with accordingly. However my radar tells me, this is maybe just another power play from the 'men behind the curtain'. I think what happens on Nov 8th matters, but what happens on Nov 9th and onwards matters a lot more, whoever gets elected.

I've included the clip of Reagan here. It's narrated by Michael Moore, and I know some people hate him. Personally whoever you do or don't vote for I think it's a revealing little glimpse about how power really operates, not just in America, but right across the world. I like to be honest as far as I can be in life, but I am quite aware that when Dostoyevsky wrote about an honest character, he entitled the novel 'The Idiot'. To me that's a bit of a bleak way to see the world, but it does make you think.

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Moore calling someone else an idiot is both sad and funny. Its like the village idot walking around telling people how to live their lives when those same people are the only reason he remains alive. Without their generosity he would have died long ago.
Reagan was the best President this country has had in almost a century. However, he became afflicted with alzheimers in his second Presidency, a fact that was kept from the public. Keeping that from the public was wrong but no one was ever held accountable because by the time people knew he was already out of office so what difference did it make at that point.
Anyway, Moore? No sane thinking person pays ANY mind to what he says.
 
@Eventhorizon it wasn't Michael Moore calling anyone an idiot, it was Dostoyevsky's choice of title for his novel. I don't think the elites worry about Moore too much, or he wouldn't be allowed to get his films made or released.

I wasn't trying to critique Reagan either, I'm sure everyone who has ever been President, has had to contend with similar or worse. It's just a little more obvious in that clip, than I think we'd normally get to see.
 
James said:
@Eventhorizon it wasn't Michael Moore calling anyone an idiot, it was Dostoyevsky's choice of title for his novel. I don't think the elites worry about Moore too much, or he wouldn't be allowed to get his films made or released.

I wasn't trying to critique Reagan either, I'm sure everyone who has ever been President, has had to contend with similar or worse. It's just a little more obvious in that clip, than I think we'd normally get to see.
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I was giving my opinion. Doesnt make it right but of course I feel that it is.
 
Regardless of who wins, Nov. 8-9 is going to be an interesting night for the country, and the world. Either we'll have the first female president of the US or we'll have the first reality star to become President.
 
Gist said:
Regardless of who wins, Nov. 8-9 is going to be an interesting night for the country, and the world. Either we'll have the first female president of the US or we'll have the first reality star to become President.
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Ronald Reagan was a movie star...so.
I cant help but think how poor of a choice Hillary is for the first female President. Is that really who people want to represent that? I would be sickened a5 the prospect if it was something I cared about.
 
Eventhorizon said:
Ronald Reagan was a movie star...so.
I cant help but think how poor of a choice Hillary is for the first female President. Is that really who people want to represent that? I would be sickened a5 the prospect if it was something I cared about.
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I said reality star, not movie star.

Also, everyone has a right to vote for who they think is the best president. You don't have to like or support that choice. At the end of the day, it's theirs. Everyone has their choice, and reasons.
 
Gist said:
I said reality star, not movie star.

Also, everyone has a right to vote for who they think is the best president. You don't have to like or support that choice. At the end of the day, it's theirs. Everyone has their choice, and reasons.
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Absolutely people have a right to vote for whoever they want. My post said nothing about voting for one candidate over the other. I have attempted to only point out aspects that I think are worth considering when making that choice. So...I stand by my statement that it is hard for me to believe anyone would want Hillary to be the first move forward in this regard.
Reality star is less than movie star in my opinion. I just dont think its note worthy. But this is my opinion and as such is easily ignored if needed.
 
Eventhorizon said:
Ronald Reagan was a movie star...so.
I cant help but think how poor of a choice Hillary is for the first female President. Is that really who people want to represent that? I would be sickened a5 the prospect if it was something I cared about.
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Just me personally, as a woman - I don't give two shits about the fact that she's a woman. Whether a candidate has a penis or a vagina is meaningless - I know it isn't for some, like the gaggle of vapid women I recall watching clips of during the 2008 election who said proudly that the sole reason they supported Palin was because she was a woman. *shudders violently*

I know it'll be "a thing," the first female president, but like I said, that holds no importance to me. Hillary Clinton is a poor choice because she's a terrible human being irrespective of her anatomy. She could have six tits and a void where her no-no bits should be (which isn't something I really want to contemplate...) and she'd still just be a terrible human being. If she gets into office, it wouldn't a poor choice as first female president she'd be representing for me, it would be a poor choice as president at all, and I wouldn't be ashamed as a woman, because she does not represent me, the same as a male president doesn't represent you just because you're a man - I would be ashamed as a US citizen. It's a damn shame that she's gotten as far in the election she has, especially with her being an extreme example of everything that's wrong in politics. Nothing she says is worth anything because her primary, and really, sole impetus is power and spinning out convenient lies to get whomever her audience is to support her, and then coming up with the complete opposite views when she moves on to the next audience. Empty words that hold no value - how can you support someone when they truly don't have any solid views to support?

Here we are, so close to the election. It's nerve-wracking.
 
We had a tv show here in the UK called The West Wing. You're mainly Americans, so you probably never saw it. I loved that show. Martin Sheen was president and every week, he did the right thing. He argued with his wife, she forgave him, it was basically a documentary.

We have prime minister's questions in Britain but it's nowhere near as good or entertaining. Everyone argues with everyone, there's terrible violence and no one ever wins anything.It's a bit like cricket. Only even more boring..

Someone is letting off premature fireworks ahead of bonfire night. Either that or we're under attack again, probably from the Germans. They've never forgiven us for that dubious goal in 1966...
 
@hush six tits ? Jeepers, that's a lot. I'm still laughing now. Worse still I think that could actually get more votes from certain people. You're judging me, I can tell, but nothing less than seven would influence me lol...
 
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