Do kids change you?

[Satya]

Sorry, I can't agree with you there. Were you incapable of loving before you started carrying a human being inside you? I don't think so. With some people parenthood changes nothing about the way they love.

Are you a parent too chirtmas? What is your perspective?

 

[BenW]

Incorrect. My question was one of knowledge. Does a person know what it is like to truly be an adult before they have kids. Even if some parents choose not act like adults, it doesn't mean that they don't know what it means to be an adult.

There is no way you could possibly answer that question.

Sounds like stupid word semantics, if you ask me.

But, since I clearly lack the necessary qualifications, I wont post here any more.

 

[WellNoWonder]

Sorry, I can't agree with you there. Were you incapable of loving before you started carrying a human being inside you? I don't think so. With some people parenthood changes nothing about the way they love.

I can respect that. Just from my perspective, and should have stated that. I didn't love as hard as I do now, though, I can tell ya that.

And I also agree with you. Sometimes I wonder if parents are afraid of the power of the love they have for their children, the abusive parents anyway.. Or is that they just do not have love at all...

 

[slant]

Uh.....

er.....


Possibly?

 

[Krumplenump]

I'm looking forward to having kids. Then I have a green light to muck around myself again getting covered in mud and whatnot.

 

[WellNoWonder]

Uh.....

er.....


Possibly?

Could be any number of things, but I don't know truly what makes abusive parents behave that way.

I think my father is emotionally abusive, but I'm not sure if it's lack of love on his behalf or other factors that play into his behavior.

 

[Norton]

I was talking to a friend lately about how I'm in my mid 20s and how I still feel like a kid. She then made a comment that has really struck me. She said that you are always a kid until you are responsible for one. In essence, she explained that people don't know what it truly means to be an adult until they have had kids. Relationships, occupations, financial responsilbities, etc. are all just child's play compared to the immensity of creating and raising a child.

Do you parents agree with that idea? Did having kids change who you were? Did it make you feel less like a kid yourself and more like an adult? Do you think that people who don't have kids are not truly adults in some sense?

Your friend is correct and wise. I think that becoming a parent is the final step in growing up. It changes your life forever. Where once you came first, now you're last and your kids come first. And that's okay, because it's a good and useful thing to learn to care about someone else first. Unfortunately, children grow up too fast. But, it's really a lot of fun to see them change and grow. Now my sons are in their twenties and it's still interesting to watch them progress through life.

 

[Billy]

My younger brother has 2 6 month olf daughters, its changed him profoundly... in as much as he is still the same fuck up as always he doesn't cheat and womanize anymore because he is too focused on caring for his girls. Its a good thing.

 

[christmas]

I can respect that. Just from my perspective, and should have stated that. I didn't love as hard as I do now, though, I can tell ya that.

I really don't mean to offend, but this is going to sound offensive anyway so I give up...

If you aren't loving "as hard" before you have kids that is just kind of fail on your part. I really think we are supposed to love everyone with as much care and respect as we possibly can. I don't think it should change just because you reproduced. I kinda feel like I'm spouting my hippie bullshit again, but I guess I really do feel that.

Aaaaand no Satya I don't have kids.

 

[TheLastMohican]

She said that you are always a kid until you are responsible for one. In essence, she explained that people don't know what it truly means to be an adult until they have had kids. Relationships, occupations, financial responsilbities, etc. are all just child's play compared to the immensity of creating and raising a child.

That sounds to me like an unfounded claim that just sounds plausible and intimidating enough to facilitate repetition. Precisely what part of such responsibility does the trick? Many kids hire themselves out as babysitters, yet they remain kids. Many of those same kids have sex, yet they remain kids. A few of those kids get pregnant and give birth before reaching adulthood... yet they can remain immature as ever. So if relationships, financial responsibilties and occupations are not enough, then what makes the difference?

 

[Satya]

I really don't mean to offend, but this is going to sound offensive anyway so I give up...

If you aren't loving "as hard" before you have kids that is just kind of fail on your part. I really think we are supposed to love everyone with as much care and respect as we possibly can. I don't think it should change just because you reproduced. I kinda feel like I'm spouting my hippie bullshit again, but I guess I really do feel that.

Frankly, not everyone shares the same experiences. I will never love my mother like a child would normally love their parent. She is more like an annoying older sibling than my mother.

People are not perfect, so you cannot expect them to always love their family or friends, especially when those people have been neglectful or abusive to them in the past.

A parent has no reason not to love a child with all their heart. So there is no reason to expect that a person couldn't love their child more than anyone else in their lives.

 

[WellNoWonder]

I really don't mean to offend, but this is going to sound offensive anyway so I give up...

If you aren't loving "as hard" before you have kids that is just kind of fail on your part. I really think we are supposed to love everyone with as much care and respect as we possibly can. I don't think it should change just because you reproduced. I kinda feel like I'm spouting my hippie bullshit again, but I guess I really do feel that.

Aaaaand no Satya I don't have kids.

no offense taken.

I wish I could turn around and say I loved people equally, but I didn't. That would be a huge lie. I did care for the world and all, but I don't know if I would have called it love.

I held lots of grudges. LOTS.

Perhaps is a big ole fail on my behalf, but I'm glad the experience opened my mind.

 

[Satya]

That sounds to me like an unfounded claim that just sounds plausible and intimidating enough to facilitate repetition. Precisely what part of such responsibility does the trick? Many kids hire themselves out as babysitters, yet they remain kids. Many of those same kids have sex, yet they remain kids. A few of those kids get pregnant and give birth before reaching adulthood... yet they can remain immature as ever. So if relationships, financial responsibilties and occupations are not enough, then what makes the difference?

As I was saying to BenW, it seems to have more to do with the knowledge than maturity. Even a parent who is too immature to be an adult or simply chooses not to be, seems to possess the knowledge of what it truly means to be an adult. I'm trying to understand that knowledge by discussing it with the parents, and I think I'm starting to understand that it has to do with the emotional experience, ultimately loving another human being to the extent that you put their well being and happiness above your own. Honestly, aside form having a kid, I'm not sure how you could come across that kind of knowledge.

 

[christmas]

LOL, I don't expect anyone to do anything. I just want them to. I really can't help that. I can understand not wanting to love abusive parents as you would a child, but I'm capable of loving people who are---to put it bluntly--pretty shitty to me. I think we all are.

 

[Satya]

LOL, I don't expect anyone to do anything. I just want them to. I really can't help that. I can understand not wanting to love abusive parents as you would a child, but I'm capable of loving people who are---to put it bluntly--pretty shitty to me. I think we all are.

You love people as much as you can, but sometimes you can only love people so much before you start loving yourself less. It's one of those hard lessons that people who bend over backwards for others need to learn.

Even Jesus Christ only expected people to love others as much as they can love themselves.

 

[christmas]

You love people as much as you can, but sometimes you can only love people so much before you start loving yourself less. It's one of those hard lessons that people who bend over backwards for others need to learn.

Even Jesus Christ only expected people to love others as much as they can love themselves.

I totally agree with you except I don't equate bending over backwards for someone with loving them. This is hard to explain!

 

[Satya]

I totally agree with you except I don't equate bending over backwards for someone with loving them. This is hard to explain!

It shouldn't be. Perhaps it is something you need to reflect on. If there is anything I am learning in this thread, it is what makes the love for a child unique and beatiful is that it is a love that often seems to supersede the love a person has for himself or herself. Whereas the love you have for other people should almost never supersede the love you have for yourself and you should never lower the love you have for yourself just so you can love others more. It is pretty clear.

 

[christmas]

But what's so special about a kid? Like as opposed to another person?

 

[Satya]

But what's so special about a kid? Like as opposed to another person?

That is kind of what this thread is exploring. It seems to be a very special type of knowledge. Maybe even instinctual. Something that only people who become parents seem to come to understand. But from what I have heard do far, it seems to be the key difference between a good parent and a bad parent.

If you go by what WellNoWonder had to say, it has something to do with actually having a living human being that was a part of her and everything she did, now as a part of her day to day life.

 

[Norton]

If you aren't loving "as hard" before you have kids that is just kind of fail on your part. I really think we are supposed to love everyone with as much care and respect as we possibly can. I don't think it should change just because you reproduced...

It could be that having kids makes you grow up more and, because you're necessarily less self-centered and self-absorbed, maybe you actually do get better at loving. It's hard to be a parent and it's harder to be a good parent. You learn a lot about people and yourself, stuff you might not know otherwise. You also feel things that you never felt before. Why is it surprising that people can get better at loving the more they have experience at loving?