For OLDER nf's

GracieRuth

GracieRuth

Permanent Fixture
MBTI
INFJ
Enneagram
7
I'm wondering if the idealistic nature of our temperament sets us us for a harder fall when we age and find we didn't save the world the way we aspired to as young people. My brother-in-law is INFP, and had great ideas of being a real leader -- now in his sixties he is seriously depressed that he didn't turn out to be what he wanted to be.

Sometimes I feel like my brother-in-law, since my career is pretty much toast. But I think I'm a little buffered from it since as a woman I look at myself primarily through my relationships rather than my career, and I have wonderful family and friends, even my first grandbaby.

And then OTHER days I feel quite different, almost like the calm before the storm, get ready for round two. I've spent my whole life gathering and gathering and gathering... Gathering facts. Gathering relationships. Gathering stories. Gathering assundry skills. And they are all perculating inside me. Sometimes I think that I'm almost ... this is really hard to put into words. but it's like the cake has been baking, and is almost ready to take out and eat. I think sometimes I'm in a cacoon, and it seems like I'm dead and life is over, but really a beautiful transformation is taking place, and I'm just about ready to come out. But I'm scared too. Is this all just wishful thinking?

I'd like to know how some of you other older NF's are fairing, and what your thoughts are now.
 
I gave up trying to save the world a long time ago. . realized it was beyond me to do that . . but I"m not done yet either. . so maybe there is more to be done. .I still have no clue what my purpose is . . but I will discover it one day. . I still am looking for that one true, perfect love. .she is out there. . somewhere. . I still dont know what I want to do when I grow up. . I still am an idealist. . always will be. .
I am ready to go to the oterh side when it's my time and I think it will be a hoot when I do. .
not sure if I've really offered any sage wisdom or even addressed the question . .
 
I think I can be more balanced, but I'm also more jaded - and I'm far less patient with young folks who act up and think they're "cute" when they ain't. :/ I also see young folks headed for a fall, and sometimes I'll intervene and sometimes I won't. Sometimes I know it's for their own good because they'll understand the lesson; while if I intervene, they might not get it and forego an opportunity to mature and change.

I confess that I'm lonely at times, because it really is just me and my pup, and when I remember family I miss them. And yet, I'm constantly curious and I love learning new things. I love learning for learning's sake. I'm still inventing myself too; still learning new things about who I am. But I also wish I were a stronger person, and I wish nothing bugged me. I keep thinking that if I really didn't care, I could do so much more.

Anyway.

I don't think you can ever quite growing and learning as an NF. I think we can see younger folk and wince sometimes, but then we have to point that mirror back and ourselves and say we've not made it, either. I know I can say I see myself as more mature than the person I was in my 20s and 30s, but I can also say I've not nearly arrived and become my ultimate self.

Besides, I still love comic books and action movies - and I can't wait for the Avengers movie and Iron Man 3. So I'm still too young to be old. :D
 
Besides, I still love comic books and action movies - and I can't wait for the Avengers movie and Iron Man 3. So I'm still too young to be old.
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Speaking of saving the world...

Alfred Nobel, the inventor of dynamite and an armaments manufacturer, established the Nobel Prizes in his last will due in part to reading his own obituary (a mistaken publication caused by the death of his brother) that stated 'The merchant of death is dead' as an attempt to change his legacy.

Sound like a familiar story?
 
One thing I remember my mom saying is that you never really 'grow up.' You'll always feel like you were when you were younger, but you just know how to behave more maturely in situations. You never stop learning, you never stop meeting new people, and you never stop gaining new experiences.

That's about all I can add to this thread, but would enjoy reading more wisdom older people have to offer.
 
Matt3737 said:
Speaking of saving the world...

Alfred Nobel, the inventor of dynamite and an armaments manufacturer, established the Nobel Prizes in his last will due in part to reading his own obituary (a mistaken publication caused by the death of his brother) that stated 'The merchant of death is dead' as an attempt to change his legacy.

Sound like a familiar story?
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:D

[video=youtube;qvwHppI95K0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvwHppI95K0[/video]
 
Wow!
I can really relate to what has been posted!
Looking back. Looking ahead.

I sometimes lament the things I didn't do when younger. Shoulda, coulda, woulda. And feel regret.
On the other hand, I don't believe in stewing over what happened or didn't happen in the past. I am the sum of my experiences and wouldn't be who I am, or where I am now. Content, accepting of myself, stable, in a great relationship. Perhaps the building blocks for the foundation of great things to come.

Many people never realize their full potential, or find their life's calling until they are well beyond 50.
I still don't know what I want to be when I grow up.

Less patient at times. Other times more forgiving.
I see and read what some younger people are doing, and can see the folly in their ways or the cliff they are about to drive off of.
"Yeah, I thought that too you poor naive one. But if I intervene, (A) you won't heed my warning. (B) You need to learn that lesson the hard way like I did."

My phone just rang as I was typing this. Ironically, my ring tone is Michael Bubles' rendition of
"The best is yet to come."
Yes, indeed. The best is yet to come. And won't it be fine.
 
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Me? I never had any ideals of saving the whole world, just a very tiny corner of it. I succeeded in a career most of the people who knew me at the time said I would not be able to do. I learned not to listen to those people and use my naivete and intuition to succeed. On the basis of that, I learned to trust my thinking more. I like who I am today. My children are grown up now and still keep in contact with me. I am still evolving and growing.
 
I feel it is up to us just to dare to share and not to actually make things happen. I feel others must take action if action is taken. We cannot be judge and jury; maybe consultants of a sort. It bothers me far more when I keep silent than when I don't see results; I must at least say something or it will bother me for a long time at times.

I have lost so many things; friends and family, pets, relationships, drive: my momentum is starting to go away. I look forward to a long dry spell away from negative things. Maybe then I can charge my batteries and get going again. I have noticed things hurt me much deeper at my new age. I don't necessarily hate that, but it is consuming my happiness. Am I to be truly happy? Can I be?

"Sorrow is better than laughter; for by the sadness of the countenance, the heart is made stronger." There must surely be a climax to this. At what point does the stronger heart start to weaken and break so easily? At what point can one say, "It is enough"? Am I made strong in my weakness? When I hear something said that tears my heart in two, shall I do anything more than turn my head, look down, and slowly walk away to my solitude? Is holding one's tongue so wise as to bear the brunt of the storm within? Is this strength? Why? So we won't hurt another? Should they not be corrected? Can they not see the damage done? Do they not care? Would our correcting be a way to try and change someone? Who are we to do so?


So in reading about the infj, I see about the messy desk. To internalize all these things makes for a messy heart. Can we save the world one person at a time? Surely not. Should we try to save that one person? From what; themself? We care for them, but where do we draw the line?


I personally question things more and more nowadays......to myself. There was a time I was listened to. Change could be seen, but all it took was for one person to throw their own twist into things to make things disrupt and look bad. We cannot micromanage what we wish to see happen to make things better. I accepted that many years ago. People may listen to wht we have to say, but in the end they will have their own way. They will place limits on what they listen to. One may every now and then mean well, but they are but one. If any form of power is needed to implement change of any kind on a grand scale, that power must be given us. I feel we would never just take it if we could. I would guess it will make my older years less of a feeling of failure and more of a feeling of accomplishments. I have learned to live with myself and am still here; that alone is quite an accomplishment. My only advice is to do what you can to help others. Maybe I need to go fishing....
 
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I think that, regardless of temperament, many of us are unrealistic about what constitutes a life worth living. When we judge ourselves according to the extreme few who dominate headlines and the media, we are looking at the exceptions. A good person does good. Doing good can be as seemingly "small" as bringing up your kids well and treating others kindly, thereby setting a good example. But this is not small. It's essential. Good actions weave a strong ethical fabric that augurs a better future.

It's never too late to do something good, useful, and important. But, it needs to be doable within the context of your circumstances. Just like politics, doing good is always local. There's always something do be done.

And, sixty is not old. My doctor says that, even if you're in your nineties, you should be planning at least ten years into the future. I think this is a healthy practice.

Finally, improving the world and making it better do not mean "saving the world." There is no such thing as "saving the world."
 
Norton said:
I think that, regardless of temperament, many of us are unrealistic about what constitutes a life worth living. When we judge ourselves according to the extreme few who dominate headlines and the media, we are looking at the exceptions. A good person does good. Doing good can be as seemingly "small" as bringing up your kids well and treating others kindly, thereby setting a good example. But this is not small. It's essential. Good actions weave a strong ethical fabric that augurs a better future.

It's never too late to do something good, useful, and important. But, it needs to be doable within the context of your circumstances. Just like politics, doing good is always local. There's always something do be done.

And, sixty is not old. My doctor says that, even if you're in your nineties, you should be planning at least ten years into the future. I think this is a healthy practice.

Finally, improving the world and making it better do not mean "saving the world." There is no such thing as "saving the world."
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Great post! Lots of food for thought here.
It's the seemingly small things we do that mean the most, and can have the biggest impact on our world as a whole.
 
I know [MENTION=1355]MindYourHead[/MENTION]. I think [MENTION=1678]Norton[/MENTION]'s name in my head will be Yoda.
 
I’m an idealist, yes, but I also live in the world; to that end, I am also a pragmatist. At times my head is in the clouds, but I will not float away, for my feet walk a path that is earthly.

My sense is the world will do just fine regardless—it needs no saving.

I’ve only ever been constant in focus as it concerns saving my self, and the work of redemption through grace is labor enough, nevermind the whole of the world.

At 42 I think I have figured out a better way to live, and the road will get rocky and steep should I choose to travel it.


cheers,
Ian
 
Norton said:
I think that, regardless of temperament, many of us are unrealistic about what constitutes a life worth living. When we judge ourselves according to the extreme few who dominate headlines and the media, we are looking at the exceptions. A good person does good. Doing good can be as seemingly "small" as bringing up your kids well and treating others kindly, thereby setting a good example. But this is not small. It's essential. Good actions weave a strong ethical fabric that augurs a better future.

It's never too late to do something good, useful, and important. But, it needs to be doable within the context of your circumstances. Just like politics, doing good is always local. There's always something do be done.

Finally, improving the world and making it better do not mean "saving the world." There is no such thing as "saving the world."
Click to expand...

As we get older I think its natural for us to reflect on our time, and no doubt as idealists we are liable to be self critical and wonder if we could have done better. I think Nortons post is excellent. If we reflect on our errors and learn from them we benefit, and if we're practical about what we can do then we can make more of a difference. Even the greatest symphony is a collection of individual notes, good, bad and the inbetween. The overall impression, what counts is what the overall result was, or is.
 
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at 51 years old i am finally peeking out from behind the wall i built so many years ago. did i have plans to save the world? no, sadly i was busy trying to keep my own ass out of the frying pan!
throughout my life people have come to me with their problems, etc. and even though much of the time they didn't heed my advice they would rave on about how wise i was, what a godsend i was, blah blah.
that false idea that i was such a pillar of strength got old quick. fact is, it drained me emotionally, physically, mentally and spiritually to have so many people demand so much of me.
as i typed that just now i thought, gee that sounds so selfish. it was more self-preservation than selfishness, though.
i found a way to cope by learning to shut off my emotional reactions. learning to flee when things got too much. then before i knew it i was spending most of my time alone.
so, now i'm getting to the point where i need to be out there. i need to start living out loud. what do i do?
 
Sonya said:
Yes [MENTION=947]aeon[/MENTION] but is 42 old?
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The question wasn‘t whether one was old, but older.

Given my point of comparison and contrast, I am.


cheers,
Ian
 
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