How to debate.

[TheLastMohican]

Humor or making light of a situation in a serious debate is not recommended. Sometimes it can make you look like a jackass.

What do you mean by a "serious" debate? I think humor can be very effective in a debate (more for the entertainment value of the audience than the strength of the points, granted, but humor does not necessarily make an argument weaker). It makes one look like a jackass when the humor is used to evade points and distract the opponent, but when it is on-target, say in a funny and accurate analogy, it livens up what could otherwise be a very dry discussion.

 

[sookie]

Well I dont use it to distract. I use it to diffuse. We all have our different opinions and styles. Again if anyone thinks that I am a jackass it is fine with me. I do things because I trust my intuition and not the judgement of others.

 

[sassafras]

I actually think the opposite. I will try to remember not to do that with you. I think that we can agree to disagree.

Things are so serious that I think using humor makes it possible for people to debate while realizing that we have to be able to talk to each other. If we cant talk to each other that creates so much more toxicity. We HAVE to be able to talk to each other for our sides to be heard.

So I will use monkeys and you dont have to.

We can agree to disagree.

Hmm, I think you misunderstood what I was trying to getting at, so allow me the liberty to restate my point. I'm not saying to completely disregard humor (there is a time and place for it) but sometimes it can actually work against you.

Yes, humor can be used as a psychological tool that can help you better relate to your opponent and bring the whole thing down to earth... but for the same reasons that it underscores that this is an issue between two people, each opposing point of debate becomes personal, rather than objective.

Psychologically, if you're trying to get someone to "feel" one particular way about something, that person is going to assign an emotional state (positive or negative) to that argument and it's going to make it difficult to remain detached and objective about what is 'their own'. And that automatically ups the potential volatile factor... especially since humor is one of those things that can be varied and easily misinterpreted (particularly when someone feels 'backed into a corner' with regards to their argument).

 

[sassafras]

What do you mean by a "serious" debate? I think humor can be very effective in a debate (more for the entertainment value of the audience than the strength of the points, granted, but humor does not necessarily make an argument weaker). It makes one look like a jackass when the humor is used to evade points and distract the opponent, but when it is on-target, say in a funny and accurate analogy, it livens up what could otherwise be a very dry discussion.

I meant if it is made at the expense of the opponent. I should have clarified.

 

[sassafras]

Honestly Daring Hat Trick I dont care what you think. It does not matter that you respect me less.

I am saying this withoug rancor. I am who I am. You can like me or not. I am not going to change for someone else

Er. Okay. You took this point of discussion way too personally.I wasn't attacking you or dismissing your point. I think you need to take a moment to re-read and cool off.

 

[sookie]

Hmm, I think you misunderstood what I was trying to getting at, so allow me the liberty to restate my point. I'm not saying to completely disregard humor (there is a time and place for it) but sometimes it can actually work against you.

Yes, humor can be used as a psychological tool that can help you better relate to your opponent and bring the whole thing down to earth... but for the same reasons that it underscores that this is an issue between two people, each opposing point of debate becomes personal, rather than objective.

Psychologically, if you're trying to get someone to "feel" one particular way about something, that person is going to assign an emotional state (positive or negative) to that argument and it's going to make it difficult to remain detached and objective about what is 'their own'. And that automatically ups the potential volatile factor... especially since humor is one of those things that can be varied and easily misinterpreted (particularly when someone feels 'backed into a corner' with regards to their argument).

I think that it is important to think about who is the person and what their style is. You are studying to be a Lawyer. I am an Elementary Teacher. I would hazard a guess that we may have different reasons behind why we debate.

Not all of the reasons but some. I use humor in work to help diffuse situations and get everyone working together. I find that this is a good thing . I also find that it creates value, which is consistant with my Buddhist Beliefs.

I think that from what I read that you are trying to change someones mind.

Some people see it more as adversarial. This is not how I choose to approach it.

 

[sookie]

Er. Okay. You took this point of discussion way too personally.I wasn't attacking you or dismissing your point. I think you need to take a moment to re-read and cool off.

I was not angry when I said this. I wanted to use a smiley face to convey that buy I wanted to respect your monkey ban.

If I was able to use the monkey like I wanted you would have realized that I was not in the least bit mad.

I said that "I say this without rancor"

 

[sookie]

Honestly Daring Hat Trick I dont care what you think. It does not matter that you respect me less.

I am saying this withoug rancor. I am who I am. You can like me or not. I am not going to change for someone else

Perhaps it would have helped if I spelled without correctly.

 

[sassafras]

True, you do need to know whether there is a time and place for it, and better yet, know your opponent. That's why I think humor is difficult to place, especially if you're just shooting in the dark.

I think that from what I read that you are trying to change someones mind.

I putting forth a point of argument, so yes, that means I am challenging a view-point. I can only clarify and put forth what I think. Whether you choose to accept it or not is your choice. I'm sorry if you feel that this is somehow "adversarial," but I think I conducted myself rather tactfully and politely here.

 

[Quinlan]

Put your fingers in your ears and loudly go "LalalalaLALALAlala".

That works the best.

 

[sookie]

You are completely misunderstanding me

What I am saying that in Law school the debate can be more adversarial

We are having small communication problems today. That is o.k it will get worked out.

 

[sassafras]

I was not angry when I said this. I wanted to use a smiley face to convey that buy I wanted to respect your monkey ban.

If I was able to use the monkey like I wanted you would have realized that I was not in the least bit mad.

I said that "I say this without rancor"

You implied that I you think I do not respect you, and stated that you are who you are and that you don't care what I think. People only put themselves forward like that if they feel that their person has been seriously challenged. Monkey or no monkey (and I appreciate the chagrin here) I fail to see how that could be without rancor. In those two sentences, you've conveyed a very serious point of defense... implying that I had attacked you in some way.

And if you feel that I have, I'd like to point out, that it was not my intention.

 

[sookie]

I was debating about debate, lol

 

[sassafras]

You are completely misunderstanding me

What I am saying that in Law school the debate can be more adversarial

We are having small communication problems today. That is o.k it will get worked out.

Between two lawyers, a court date is anything but personal or adversarial. It's business.

But that's all right. I can see that we're just dancing around some sort of miscommunication here. I'll let it be.

 

[sookie]

I did not apply no such thing. I was telling you that your respect does not matter to me. Said with respect, and calm.
My point was that people can agree, disagree...Respect not respect...You had said something about "respecting less" I did not take it personally. I wanted you to know that people can love me, hate me, respect me or not. I really dont have any control over that. Unless I bend completely to other peoples ideas and then I would not respect myself

I was just communicating that. If people respect me fine. If they dont fine. It does not impact me on who I am.

 

[sassafras]

I did not apply no such thing. I was telling you that your respect does not matter to me. Said with respect, and calm.
My point was that people can agree, disagree...Respect not respect...You had said something about "respecting less" I did not take it personally. I wanted you to know that people can love me, hate me, respect me or not. I really dont have any control over that. Unless I bend completely to other peoples ideas and then I would not respect myself

I was just communicating that. If people respect me fine. If they dont fine. It does not impact me on who I am.

*headdesk*

But why even bring a defensive like that into a conversation? You just personalized it and said that you didn't care what I thought (you could've said "I don't care what anyone thinks" instead of saying "Honestly, TDHT, I don't care what you think"). I wasn't even directing my post at you nor did I even have you in mind. I only used your quote as a point of departure.

There's our misunderstanding!

 

[sookie]

Our misunderstanding is that you think i was saying it out of defensiveness.
When I said it I actually felt very liberated. I had an aha moment for myself.

 

[sookie]

Thank-you for that. I do regret that you misunderstood it. It is all patched up now

 

[sassafras]

Our misunderstanding is that you think i was saying it out of defensiveness.
When I said it I actually felt very liberated. I had an aha moment for myself.

Hmm. You certainly picked an interesting time to have a general, self-liberating 'a-ha' moment... after communicating to me that you thought I specifically disrespected you...and telling me that you specifically didn't care what I thought...

I apologize for misunderstanding that to be defensive behaviour.

Let's agree to disagree.

 

[sookie]

No sweat!