I'm starting to think I might be an ENFJ

[slant]

Never met one. I think that my 9th grade english teacher could have been one, but he could have just been an ENTP. Although, thinking about it, that is unlikely since he asked me if I had any friends ( likely because I was eerily quiet, didn't do the work in the class, but every time I did I received an A, never got in groups during projects and was pretty much the least social person there) and when I proceeded to saying "No, I have none." ( despite the fact that I had some, just none in his class), one of my loudmouthed ENFP friends was transferred into one of his classes and mentioned that she was friends with me. Next day, he comes into class with a big grin on his face.
"I know something that you don't know that I know."
I sat there and stared. Finally, "What?"
"You're friend Janessa is in my 3rd period, and she says she misses you and wishes you were in her class period."
I blinked a few times, thought, DAMN, WHY'D YOU TELL HIM JANESSA?!
"Oh."

ENFJ?

 

[gloomy-optimist]

Possibly

 

[slant]

YEW DUN KNOW!!

I'm thinking he's a P because he was really anti-rules and would play the radio during tests, etc. He tried to play it during the Iowa tests but somebody walked in... He also made use of the infamous peanut butter an jelly exercise. The student told him to put the peanut butter of the knife, but failed to tell him to open the lid to the peanut butter. The kid was behind a curtain so she couldn't see what he was doing. Anyway, he ended up stabbing a hole into the plastic lid--when the girl heard the loud banging noises she knew she'd screwed up somehow. All in all, he was a nice teacher but wayy too nosy. Must be an ENFJ.

 

[Tamagochi]

YEW DUN KNOW!!

I'm thinking he's a P because he was really anti-rules and would play the radio during tests, etc. He tried to play it during the Iowa tests but somebody walked in...

P/J is not about following the rules. It's more about the intention to move and get things done. So far he sounds J-ish to me.

 

[slant]

D:

Probably was.

What P would be a teacher? P is for Proffesor

 

[gloomy-optimist]

I know some ENFJs like that. Very intelligent ENFJs tend to like to test the rules...but they also tend to generally want to help other people.

 

[VH]

I know some ENFJs like that. Very intelligent ENFJs tend to like to test the rules...but they also tend to generally want to help other people.

Okay, back to ambiguous.

I think my Ni and Fe have matched each other, and now vie for control.

I think I'm going to call myself an ANFJ - Ambiverted iNtuitive Feeling Judging. (Ni=Fe, Ti=Se)

 

[gloomy-optimist]

With really intelligent or really developed people, it begins to get really hard to tell. If it makes you feel better, I'm still confused with my J/P

 

[VH]

With really intelligent or really developed people, it begins to get really hard to tell. If it makes you feel better, I'm still confused with my J/P

If it makes YOU feel any better, I'M still confused as to your J/P. Hehe.

There's a funny episode of INFJ vs ENFJ fight - very amusing

Hehe, that is so cute! I love the Japanese (or at least Anime/Manga) inclination toward NFJ-hood. But sadly, I've distinctly been both of those archetypes, depending on who I'm arguing with and what phase of my life I was in. It is interesting to see how the INFJ drops into a pseudo-ENFJ mode at various points to lead once stress is resolved, and how the ENFJ drops into a pseudo-INFJ to reassure once stress is resolved. Perhaps these are another set of distinguishers.

If I had to choose one right now, I'd have to say I behave and react much more like the ENFJ character.

As a random note that may bear some light... I'm an 8w9 on the Enneagram.

 

[VH]

There's something about them that makes me feel safe.

Now that's very telling. I can't count the number of friends I have who remark on how safe they feel with me.

My best INTJ friend recently asked, "Why do I feel safer at your feet than standing next to anyone else?"

I am inclined to think that's not a common occurrence for INFJs, due to their reflex to stop and consider everything when something unexpected happens.

Well poo... I might actually have become an ENFJ.

 

[gloomy-optimist]

I dunno -- I've been told that I make people comfortable around me too. And I don't think I'm confused about my I/E...now, anyways.
I tend to feel comfortable around ENFJs, but they tend to feel comfortable around me too. There's something that clicks between us, especially if they're intelligent and well-developed as well. Maybe if you tried finding other ENFJs and INFJs -- around INFJs, I actually don't have much immediate pull, but I'm drawn to ENFJs like a fly. I tend to notice that with I/E pairs -- you'll find more of a pull to your mirror than to your identity

It might be that you're a true ANFJ. I mean, at this point, I think it will become progressively harder to tell, rather than easier; you'll most likely develop your functions further to equality. The answer probably lies more to the past, maybe early 20s and before, when you were in one of the earlier stages of development and focused more on your true primary function.

If it makes YOU feel any better, I'M still confused as to your J/P. Hehe.

That does make me feel better, but it doesn't help much lol

 

[Tamagochi]

Well poo... I might actually have become an ENFJ.

Or maybe you've been one all the time
We are much more complicated than just 4 letters.

 

[VH]

The answer probably lies more to the past, maybe early 20s and before, when you were in one of the earlier stages of development and focused more on your true primary function.

I've been talking to my parents about my behaviors as a child, and I'm not meeting with much success. They're a pair of S types, and don't have much capacity to grasp specifically what I am asking about. From my own memories, although I was chatty as a kid, I was a textbook INFJ. I had to learn a lot of the traits I now have that I associate with ENFJ, mostly out of necessity.

If I had to guess at this point, I was always an INFJ type that grew into developing a very strong secondary set due to stress over my many years... so now that I am almost constantly stressed, I stay at least at ENFJ, if not ISTP, or ESTP modes.

However, with NFJ types, there is something to consider. Our primary and secondary functions combine to make us ambihemisphered. We're the MBTI that is the most balanced with respect to left and right brained dominance. We have left brained intuition and right brained reasoning, but since both of these functions are inherently the role of the opposite side of the brain, we incorporate a fair amount of capacity from them as well. The end result is a double ambihemisphered reasoning process for NFJs, especially INFJs (most likely why we are so rare, and why Jung said we couldn't actually exist when he developed these theories).

I'm starting to think my ambiguity stems from this balance, as it would imply that we NFJs (especially INFJs) are also prone to developing balanced cognitive functions, given time and stressors.

Or maybe you've been one all the time
We are much more complicated than just 4 letters.

Very true. No one will fit any of these molds perfectly. I'm just trying to figure out which one I fit the closest.

I loved your polar examples of INFJs and ENFJs in that Anime link. I'm somewhere in between them. All of my online tests agree. So, at least I have no doubt about my fitting the NFJ archetype closest.

 

[IndigoSensor]

Concidering that you use Se and Ti so heavily for an ENFJ or an INFJ, I would be inclined to agree that you transcend the type a little bit.

 

[gloomy-optimist]

I've been talking to my parents about my behaviors as a child, and I'm not meeting with much success. They're a pair of S types, and don't have much capacity to grasp specifically what I am asking about. From my own memories, although I was chatty as a kid, I was a textbook INFJ. I had to learn a lot of the traits I now have that I associate with ENFJ, mostly out of necessity.

If I had to guess at this point, I was always an INFJ type that grew into developing a very strong secondary set due to stress over my many years... so now that I am almost constantly stressed, I stay at least at ENFJ, if not ISTP, or ESTP modes.

However, with NFJ types, there is something to consider. Our primary and secondary functions combine to make us ambihemisphered. We're the MBTI that is the most balanced with respect to left and right brained dominance. We have left brained intuition and right brained reasoning, but since both of these functions are inherently the role of the opposite side of the brain, we incorporate a fair amount of capacity from them as well. The end result is a double ambihemisphered reasoning process for NFJs, especially INFJs (most likely why we are so rare, and why Jung said we couldn't actually exist when he developed these theories).

I'm starting to think my ambiguity stems from this balance, as it would imply that we NFJs (especially INFJs) are also prone to developing balanced cognitive functions, given time and stressors.

Sounds about right I kind of get this gut feeling like you may have been much more INFJ at one point...but that doesn't fit you much anymore. I think one of the best parts about MBTI is being able to balance yourself out so you're NOT constricted to one type anymore.
Do whatever is most comfortable for you. ANFJ is not a bad thing -- you can be both and neither, and that's fine

 

[VH]

Okay, I went to a party last night, and I noticed some telling behaviors. This was a party full of people I love, fifty or so people in a house, and only three people I didn't know.

1. I always gravitate to small groups, and avoid large circles.
2. I will take the lead in small groups and entertain instinctively and unconsciously, unless the group has a good lead 'entertainer'.
3. If I can't avoid large circles, I will go find somewhere to be alone.
4. At a certain point, that seems to be based on the amount of interaction not the duration, I have to become invisible and slip away entirely.

In other words, I realized last night that despite my gregarious nature, I am inherently an introvert.

So much for this false alarm. My Fe is strong, but I'm dominantly an Ni. I'm a Chart the Course who can be a Take Charge if need be, though despite being comfortable in the role, I cannot do it indefinitely like I can Charting the Course.

I find this fascinating because it seems to validate a principle that I wasn't sure that I agreed with - the notion that our cognitive function hierarchies do not change. We simply learn how to use our lesser functions more fluently as we develop. We learn how and when to rely on our lesser functions in preference to our more dominant functions based on the situations at hand. In other words, we develop the ability to assess a situation and choose the most advantageous function as a response, rather than change our function order.

This leads me to an interesting postulation. If this is true, then it means that my Ni assesses situations then chooses which function to apply in response, to which my Fe agrees, then my Ti acknowledges, my Se accepts, etc. until the desired function is applied. Does this then mean that some cognitive function orders are better designed to allow this sort of 'teamwork' than others? For instance, someone with Si, Te, Fi, and Ne might have a lot of trouble getting their Si to accept that things need to be different, but if they can they must then convince their Te that things relate differently than previously assumed, followed by changing their own feelings on the subject, and lastly harness their Ne into choosing the correct direction.

Have I stumbled onto the root of how personality is manifested through Jungian cognitive function order?

Fascinating.

 

[Tamagochi]

I'm not exactly sure, but according to some reading I've done on the topic - you always use your primary function (for INFJ it would be Ni). It never tires, but it can be wrong and on rare occasions it can even shut down during extreme stress. The secondary function (Fe) usually works in tandem with the primary, but is not so advanced therefore it gets tired after some usage and needs to be recharged. In practice it can even make INFJ appear as extroverted in public situations - but they just can't keep it going for very long. I sometimes get supercharged uptime of Fe which lasts up to two weeks, but ENFJ would have it running 24/7, 365 days a year.

Then if things don't get solved using the first two functions (or if secondary is in recharge state), the third one is used. That would be Ti And if still stuck, the fourth and least preferred function may be used. In practice you might have to force it's usage, because the mind can fall into a deadlock using the first three. Originally Jung suggested to identify type using this least preferred function - because it's absence is best observed.

The shadow functions Ne, Fi, Te and Si are also used occasionally, but we have little conscious control over them.

 

[VH]

I'm not exactly sure, but according to some reading I've done on the topic - you always use your primary function (for INFJ it would be Ni). It never tires, but it can be wrong and on rare occasions it can even shut down during extreme stress. The secondary function (Fe) usually works in tandem with the primary, but is not so advanced therefore it gets tired after some usage and needs to be recharged. In practice it can even make INFJ appear as extroverted in public situations - but they just can't keep it going for very long. I sometimes get supercharged uptime of Fe which lasts up to two weeks, but ENFJ would have it running 24/7, 365 days a year.

Now that is a theory I did not know about, but seems entirely congruent with everything I have learned.

Taking that into consideration, I can easily say that I could run on Ni indefinitely, and there is no way on this blue planet that I could run on Fe indefinitely.

Very insightful. Thanks!

Then if things don't get solved using the first two functions (or if secondary is in recharge state), the third one is used. That would be Ti And if still stuck, the fourth and least preferred function may be used. In practice you might have to force it's usage, because the mind can fall into a deadlock using the first three. Originally Jung suggested to identify type using this least preferred function - because it's absence is best observed.

Yes, I am familiar with this theory. It is an example of how people develop their lesser functions, as well as an explanation as to why we sometimes seem like different types based on our stress levels. When we get stressed, we drop to our next function, and then the next, and the next. As an example, INFJs drop to ENFJ, then ISTP, then ESTP. Ni doesn't work very well in a social setting, so we can appear like an ENFJ in proportion to our Fe. If our intuition and our values system is challenged beyond our capacity to reconcile, we will then revert to our Ti and Se, and become ISTPs. It is our 'safe place' where we accept everything for what it is, and tend to tinker with our hobbies and crafts. However, when pushed to the point of extreme stress, we will drop to ESTP, and act out in viceral and impulsive ways.

I've been under a great deal of stress over the past two years, and can atest to the validity of this theory. I've run the gammut of INFJ, ENFJ, ISTP, and even ESTP at times. This has been a factor in my confusion. I've been rolling through them so frequently, I was losing my grasp on which was my base state.

As a side note: This is why it is so good to have an INFJ around in a dangerous situation. We drop to ENFJ/ESTP, using all of our functions at once, in a hurry. All of a sudden, we become large and in charge, able to manage everyone to safety, while keeping everyone calm.

The shadow functions Ne, Fi, Te and Si are also used occasionally, but we have little conscious control over them.

I've developed a theory on this subject. I don't believe that people actually have shadow functions, but rather these are truly shadows of our true functions by using two of them in tandem.

For example, Ni and Fe can create a shadow Fi. Fe and Ti can create a shadow Te. Ni and Se can create a shadow of Ne.

I can personally come to the same conclusions as someone who is Ne dominant, but I have to reason my way through it with Ni, Fe, and Te. I cannot compare to the speed at which an Ne person can come to the same conclusions. What takes me moments takes them microseconds. But, the opposite is true. They can't come to Ni type conclusions as quickly as I can, but given enough time, they will end up at the same conclusion.

I think this would explain the phenomenon of our shadow functions being so unreliable, while also explaining leanings on the MBTI that may not be congruent with one's actual type.

Good post! Very helpful! Thanks!

 

[gloomy-optimist]

I like this thread. It's interesting. And it has once again reinforced that I am NOT INFP, but INFJ with a decent grip on functions.

I do agree on all of this, though. I've noticed for quite some time that I can be almost any type (with exceptions to ones that are Si or Te dominant, since I don't have a strong grip on those functions). BUT I can't stay in that role indefinitely. One of the reasons I have problems getting to know people well is because of my Ni -- when I socialize, I tend to put more emphasis on Fe. I look like an ENFJ to many people. But I can really get comfortable with someone when I can use Ni more.

I also think that's why I feel so immediately comfortable with ENFJs, and they with me. I can use Fe with them much more easily, but more importantly, I can also withhold it when I need to recharge and they can take the main stage -- and they can freely exercise their Ni, while having time to recharge that when needs be too (if any of this makes sense). I don't really feel such a strong pull to other types like most because I have well-developed functions -- I don't necessarily need that T guy to do the logic or the S guy to ground me. I can handle that, but an ENFJ just makes things feel so much easier with one of the hardest things that I have to deal with -- constant socialization

 

[VH]

I like this thread. It's interesting. And it has once again reinforced that I am NOT INFP, but INFJ with a decent grip on functions.

I do agree on all of this, though. I've noticed for quite some time that I can be almost any type (with exceptions to ones that are Si or Te dominant, since I don't have a strong grip on those functions). BUT I can't stay in that role indefinitely. One of the reasons I have problems getting to know people well is because of my Ni -- when I socialize, I tend to put more emphasis on Fe. I look like an ENFJ to many people. But I can really get comfortable with someone when I can use Ni more.

I also think that's why I feel so immediately comfortable with ENFJs, and they with me. I can use Fe with them much more easily, but more importantly, I can also withhold it when I need to recharge and they can take the main stage -- and they can freely exercise their Ni, while having time to recharge that when needs be too (if any of this makes sense). I don't really feel such a strong pull to other types like most because I have well-developed functions -- I don't necessarily need that T guy to do the logic or the S guy to ground me. I can handle that, but an ENFJ just makes things feel so much easier with one of the hardest things that I have to deal with -- constant socialization

This whole train of thought has reminded me how fluid the cognitive processes are. Satya's thread also brought up some interesting points to support this.

When we take a look at our functions, most of us NF types have most if not all of the N and F functions as our most developed functions. While this defies the conventional theories of type, it simply is the case.

Cognitive types are defined by the order of cognitive preference, not the degree of development. However, when we are stressed, our preferences change. When our dominant function fails to solve our stressors, our minds will switch to the next favored function.

Combine these factors, and this is the crux of the issue Satya, myself, and others been pondering recently. Cognitive type can be extremely elusive.

I've recently been spending a lot of time thinking about this, and I realized that I am inherently an Fe dominant. When I'm healthy and not stressed, my default focus is on how I feel things should be. This is the reason I'm so technical and precise. I was convinced to feel that these factors are important, and spent a great deal of my life developing them. While the brilliance of Fe is often underestimated because of its abstract and philosophical intelligence, I have developed my Ti to a sufficient degree to augment it. And while it is much easier for me to express how I feel things should be than how I personally feel, my Fi is much stronger than my Ti, and my Te is weakest of all. Fortunately for me, I've become very close friends with an INTJ and an ENTJ who are helping me a great deal with augmenting my under developed Te. The end result is that I can appear to have much greater T functions than I actually do.

However, when I am stressed, I drop to introverted intuition dominance, and my functions switch to Ni, Fe. I've been under a lot of stress for a long time. When I first reacted to the concept of Ni being the function that I cannot turn off, the answer was 'yes' because for the past few years, I've been living in a stressed state. When I am in Ni dominance, I spend an inordinate amount of time living in my head, pondering all manner of things, pulling connections together, and gleaning insights. I'm fluent with this state because I've been under long term stress during so many phases in my life, from early childhood on. However, this state is my hiding place. It is well furnished, but it is not my home.

This morning, I found myself having a moment of clarity from my recent stresses. My world has drastically not been how my Fe insists it should be for the past two years, which has caused me a great deal of stress. It's the downside of being an Fe dominant (and likely secondary). The world that we have so little control over has so much control over us. However, at some point we will be forced to shift our paradigm to accept how things are. My NTJ friends have been a tremendous help with this.

I was laying in bed, reflexively pondering all of the subjects that I had been inducting recently when I realized that I can't. It took me a few minutes to realize that I was finally back to my natural state, and that's when I had the epiphany. I let go of my stressors enough to revert back to Fe dominance, with Ni backing it up, not the other way around.

Here are the averages of my cognitive function results over the past year...

(Ni) *************************************** (41.5)
(Fe) ************************************** (39.1)
(Fi) ********************************* (32.5)
(Ne) ******************************** (30.9)
(Ti) ********************************* (29.6)
(Se) ******************************* (29.3)
(Te) ************************ (24.7)
(Si) ********************* (18.7)

Ni = Fe > Fi = Ne = Ti = Se > Te > Si

My Ni and Ti are slightly more developed than my Fe and my Se because I've spent so much time in my stressed state of INFJ preference. But, they're close enough together to be statistically equal. My actual preference looks like this, when I am healthy and not stressed...

Fe = Ni > Fi = Ne = Se = Ti > Te > Si

I'm actually an ENFJ at my core, but I can take on the INFJ preference at will. I would assume that if I become stressed enough, I would then switch to my next dominant function which is Fi (despite all the theory that suggests otherwise) making me appear as an INFP, followed by the function order of an ENFP. Only after that, would I revert to the standard progression of ESTP, and finally ISTP.

This means that I am firmly an NF type. It also means that a lot of the theory on cogntive function psychology is less than accurate due to the fluidity of the way they interact within the mind and when subjected to stimulus. It means that the human mind is more dynamic and adaptable than psychologists give it credit. Heh, who'd have thought?