INFJ gone wrong

Hitler's private life consisted of a small group of friends he often excused himself from, long walks alone in the forest with his pet German Shepherd, a vegetarian diet, he only drank camomile tea, he would cry himself to sleep listening to moving classical music. (according to a documentary I once saw). I remember thinking - he must have been an INFJ.
 
waterbaby said:
What would an INFJ gone wrong be like? Say they'd had a rough start, lived in shadow for a while, made some very ironic and out of character choices in life (i.e. dropping out of school despite previously loving it), maybe they were brutally abused... you get where I'm going...

What would the result be like?

Would this person be "too crazy" to type (I think I saw that in one of the books)? Is there enough natural resiliency to our type that such a person still be functional? Would they become an evil dictator?
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I felt that way throughout high school. I didn't fit in very well, I wanted to get out as soon as possible. People looked rotten to me. My family driving me insane. I questioned my existence and my existence in this environment I was dropped in. I know there are people suffering much worse than me, but my mind just went into this negative activity. I was an honor student and I started skipping class and failed some classes. I just felt numb.

On the negative side of the spectrum I felt closest to two ways:

One would be just suicide, because I didn't feel anything anymore.

The other to be a dictator actually and set right what is wrong. I don't know if you watch anime, but I would have gone down the same ideas as Light Yagami from Deathnote. He wanted to clean up the "scum" of the earth and make the world a peaceful place for good people.

However, the problem with the second one to me and perhaps this is due to the INFJ attributes in me, is that I don't want to subject my judgment on people who I don't fully understand. Who am I to determine what is right for a whole mass of people and what is wrong for them? INFJs are proud of their judgment, but as feelers, I don't think we could impose what we believe onto an entire group of people. That would go against what we stand for. We want all people to be successful and happy and live in peace. I suppose though if an INFJ wanted to make the world better and just went crazy he could go this way.

I bounced back after a while. And I am most optimistic among my friends. :)

But assuming I hadn't offed myself or bounced back, I probably would have become a loner and started experimenting with people. Experimenting as in subjecting them to mind games and reevaluating people as a whole. I would probably have just become a bitter, lonely person. That could be an individual thing though, not INFJs in general. My conclusion is that an INFJ gone bad would reject other people, because that's what we enjoy, connecting with them and understanding them.

Just my thoughts.
 
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I've been "INFJ gone wrong" many times in my life and the outcome is always the same. Fatigue Apathy Withdrawal Seclusion Recovery. Every time I rebelled against who I really am in order to fit in or attempted to live an uninhibited life, the outcome was always the same.
I think the ultimate INFJ gone wrong would be an INFJ female on PMS.
 
Nobleheart said:
The INFJ stress mode is ESTP. This is our personality when we are 'fully stressed'. This is our 'do or die' mode. It's a sharp contrast to our shadow mode, as this is our 'get it done' mode. While the ENFP shadow mode for us has given up, this is our toughest inner reserve of unyieldingness, and our last bastion of drive. We become extremely impatient, pushy, demanding, and logical. We let go of our desire to accommodate or come up with a clever solution, and tend to go after the goal before us with relentless tenacity. Anyone who gets in the way will be barked at, trampled, or both. This mode can leave us with regrets over the demanding and insensitive things we do while in it.
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I lived this during part of my cancer treatment, as well as many others at other moments. Your responses give me a renewed sense of hope. Thank you.
I'm also glad that several of you pointed out the choice in what we do with this, because sometimes it can be hard to remember that part, that our past does not just force our futures onto a default matching path. Choice, I think, is hope to me.
 
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Yeah, I was there when I had some nerve damage. Doctors beware.
 
waterbaby said:
What would an INFJ gone wrong be like? Say they'd had a rough start, lived in shadow for a while, made some very ironic and out of character choices in life (i.e. dropping out of school despite previously loving it), maybe they were brutally abused... you get where I'm going...

What would the result be like?

Would this person be "too crazy" to type (I think I saw that in one of the books)? Is there enough natural resiliency to our type that such a person still be functional? Would they become an evil dictator?
Click to expand...

He is usually 'typed' (in all of the online places that I've seen who type celebrities) as an INTJ, but I think James Hetfield perfectly fits the description that you provide above of having a rough start and living in the shadow. I don't think he is too crazy to type, but at one point he was headed in that direction until he became aware that he needed to change course or he was going to lose everything that mattered to him. His behaviour after this epiphany makes me think very strongly that he is an INFJ.

My rationale is that once I look past the hard exterior of his persona as Metallica's frontman, I get a very strong strong sense of empathy for those who are suffering, and a desire for social justice for those who are marginalized and disenfranchised when I listen to Metallica's lyrics. That doesn't make the NT temperament my first choice. I'm not a professional at this, so I may be way off base.
 
Personally I think they'd either cease to be INFJ, or simply just break down and cry.:)
They don't strike me as being particularily resistant to torture.
 
...You get me. I'm currently, well, I call myself f*cked-up. But a few people I know would beat me over the head for being self-hating. I won't post details unless asked.
 
I had typed Hitler as INFP, but if he was an ENTJ in shadow mode, that would make sense.




INFJ gone wrong:

1. Inability to see alternative perspectives, possibilities or points of view like a healthy INFJ would.
2. Everything becomes non-negotiable. Probably the most thickheaded person you can ever argue with.
3. This non-negotiable is reinforced by view of the world as inexorably amoral.
4. A lack of hesitation to use brutal physical aggression if met with resistance.

I know a lot of these things apply to a lot of people who go bad, but my personal view is that, because INFJs try so hard to be "good" people, once they go bad, they really lose it. For the INFJ, going bad is not just about them being bad person, it is about the world being a bad place (bad as in absolutely and undeniably evil).

Your typical INFJ tries their best not to offend or hurt people and usually puts the needs of others well before their own, and the result of INFJ going bad is a complete reversal of this. The needs of others are completely ignored in accordance with the perceived evilness of the world, and, even worse, all the rules that govern human behavior and interactions go far out the window, even the rules that govern how to fight that even most types at their worst would adhere to.
 
I don't think I can imagine anyone staying in the ESTP shadow mode. That just doesn't compute for me. I think that a person under stress would occasionally enter shadow mode, lash out, and then return to normal soon afterward.

I've never been truly impulsive, and I don't think I could live that way.

Under stress, I'm more likely to become quietly self-destructive and apathetic, than to go out and gratify my impulses. Maybe I'll eat too much, spend all my time on escapism, or stop caring about things... but this tendency tends towards inactivity, being parasitic, and laziness rather than a flurry of risk-taking and action. It just doesn't seem very ESTP, it seems more Introverted than that.

Anyway, as for a classic INFJ gone wrong? What about this:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3Qd5JyR1l8"]YouTube- ‪Tales of Symphonia- Martel's Final Wish‬‎[/ame]
 
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IndigoSensor said:
The type of INFJ you are describing is one that has taken on the bad aspects of an ESTP, or an ENFP, depending on what kind of trama they have indured and for how long.

If you have an INFJ who is an an ESTP mode it is likely caused by long term stress from things in their external life. Money issues, relationships, bad luck, ect. If this goes on long enough they enter this mode. It is pretty much a way for the INFJ to get certainty, and instant gratification. As being like a bad ESTP it allows the individual to get satisfaction in the short term to mask out the hurt they are feeling. To the external observer the INFJ would appear very much like an ESTP (depending on the degree of the shadow mode, the true INFJ nature may or may not be visiable). The distinction between an INFJ in shadow and a true ESTP is how the INFJ feels while this is going on, and how they feel after words. An INFJ in shadow ESTP mode will likely feel detatched, almost as if they watching themselves do the things they are doing. They could in essence, rob a store and punch the person they are robbing, then after the ordeal, wonder to themselves "...did I actually just do that? It feels so surreal..." they will have the urge to process it beyond that, but something stops them from being able to do so. An INFJ in shadow mode also isn't there 24/7, when the individual exits the mode for a short time, it is usually a very depressive mode and they ask themselves "why is all of this happening". Full relization does not come about until they have fully exited shadow mode.
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This is not exactly true... it sounds sound on paper, but I don't think its realistic. I dont think INFJs become ESTPs or ENFPs...

I think some INFJs withdraw completely, or become extremely paranoid

I dont see how Ni Fe dom will turn into a Se dom... that doesn't make sense.

Are you going on personal experience or just by theory-craft?

If by experience can you explain what events you were reacting to that put you into your shadow?
 
sumone said:
I've been "INFJ gone wrong" many times in my life and the outcome is always the same. Fatigue Apathy Withdrawal Seclusion Recovery. Every time I rebelled against who I really am in order to fit in or attempted to live an uninhibited life, the outcome was always the same.
I think the ultimate INFJ gone wrong would be an INFJ female on PMS.
Click to expand...


+1 add in paranoia and self hatred and i think you got it, not sure where this estp, enfp crap is coming from.
 
Billy said:
This is not exactly true... it sounds sound on paper, but I don't think its realistic. I dont think INFJs become ESTPs or ENFPs...

I think some INFJs withdraw completely, or become extremely paranoid

I dont see how Ni Fe dom will turn into a Se dom... that doesn't make sense.

Are you going on personal experience or just by theory-craft?

If by experience can you explain what events you were reacting to that put you into your shadow?
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Actually the fluidity of the functions allows us to "become" other types, or at least give that impression. Those that share functions are easier to flow into, so an INFJ giving an ESTP vibe isn't unheard of.

You do realise you act very ISTPish?
 
88chaz88 said:
Actually the fluidity of the functions allows us to "become" other types, or at least give that impression. Those that share functions are easier to flow into, so an INFJ giving an ESTP vibe isn't unheard of.

You do realise you act very ISTPish?
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ISTPs share the exact same functions in an inverted manner as an INFJ

But I dont actually act istpish in that I dont use Se very well and I am insanely Ni-eurotic.

And our functions arent really all that fluid...

IMO

Shadow isnt switching from your cog functions to new ones, its a realignment of certain functions in a differnt direction.

Ni instead of finding answers, finds paranoia
Fe instead of seeking harmony from others seeks approval and becomes needy
Ti in conjunction with the rest sharpens up the rest
(in my case Te) acts out instead of seeking organization and order it exploits people for gain.
Se is always in the background it doesnt change much.

but tell me how im an ISTP.

I've never had my N taken away by an S before so this is an interest to me.
 
Billy said:
ISTPs share the exact same functions in an inverted manner as an INFJ

But I dont actually act istpish in that I dont use Se very well and I am insanely Ni-eurotic.

And our functions arent really all that fluid...

IMO

Shadow isnt switching from your cog functions to new ones, its a realignment of certain functions in a differnt direction.

Ni instead of finding answers, finds paranoia
Fe instead of seeking harmony from others seeks approval and becomes needy
Ti in conjunction with the rest sharpens up the rest
(in my case Te) acts out instead of seeking organization and order it exploits people for gain.
Se is always in the background it doesnt change much.

but tell me how im an ISTP.

I've never had my N taken away by an S before so this is an interest to me.
Click to expand...

You become very argumentative online and not so empathetic as an INFJ usually is. This is clearly a switch from Fe to Ti. I've seen the same thing in another INFJ, and also se similar characteristics in myself.

The functions don't change, we just change preferences.
 
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