MBTI MAKES NO SENSE

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Urtehnoes said:
Mebbe you're not an ISTJ. :o
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I have considered that. But the conclusion I was led to by taking many tests and possessing an understanding of MBTI (which you claim to not have done either of those, at least not correctly) I feel safe in saying I am an ISTJ and you are not an ISTJ. Even if it turns out that I am not an ISTJ I will still be ok with that but you will be floundering for self understanding through 4 simple letters.
 
Urtehnoes said:
I find stereotypes to be very fitting and useful in the world. And ultimately true.
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You've got to be kidding me. Seriously? Think about what you just said, and how bad this just sounds. Stereotypes are indeed based of a nugget of truth and small patterns, but are by no means reliable to use. There are enough patterns to base some people off pure stereotypes for MBTI, but it's extremely unreliable and can lead people to quite bad behaviors and inaccurate information.
 
Ok... so, I haven't read the whole thread, but a few comments:

1. You can't be two types (as I'm sure you already know). That is to say, you may exhibit qualities of several types, but you are only ONE type. You mentioned that you think you are both ENFP and ISTJ. As others have also already pointed out, these two types use the same cognitive functions, just in different order. That explains why you relate to both types out least reasonably well, but you do use a distinctive order of cognitive functions.
2. The MBTI test is often very inaccurate. It is not useful as a valid typing tool. Nor is the cognitive functions test you used, since it relies on the same types of questions the MBTI test does. (in truth, the MBTI in general is just not right, but I will not go into this for sake of clarity). Don't use either of those tests to type you. Grow in knowledge of the cognitive functions (all of them), determine which ones you actively use, and then figure out your order of preference. Keep in mind that if you know just your dominant function, then you already have narrowed your choices by half. If you know your auxiliary and dominant functions, you know your type.*

Your main problem is looking at this in terms of the dichotomies. Everyone displays characteristics of extroversion, introversion, intuition, sensing, thinking, feeling, judging, and perceiving. You look at them and say that you have aspects of every one of them. Of course, everyone does. Also, the dichotomies mean nothing in and of themselves. You seem to be under the impression that whichever side of the axis you identify with the most determines which side of the axis you lie on. This is just not the case, at least not necessarily. The dichotomies only exist to explain the order of the functions, not the other way around. The only way to accurately type yourself is to do so functionally. Just because one is on one side of the axis does not mean he will necessarily portray the "characteristics" of that side of the axis. If this is how you are looking at and understanding MBTI, then it no wonder that you are confused. The test's problem is that it only looks at MBTI from the dichotomies and not the cognitive functions. The cognitive function test you took is slightly better in that it attempts to measure the cognitive functions but the questions may be confusing and it does not portray a full picture of each function. Also, it uses some very odd method to determine which functions you use the most, and thereby determine your type.

*It is considerably more difficult to determine your true type if you have developed your tertiary, inferior, and some unconscious functions above your dominant and auxiliary functions. I would wager I tested as INTP for so long on the MBTI test because I answered that I procrastinated, waited until the last minute, and always had things messy and unorganized. On the T-F axis, it was because I answered that I trusted reason rather feelings and did not care for people that much. It had nothing to do with anything. On the cognitive functions test, I always scored INTP because I have highly developed Ti (it outweighs my Fe and possibly even my Ni) and because the distinction between Ne and Ni is just not really there, so I scored high on both them, and low on Se. Since Ti was my highest, and Ti can't be followed by Ni, Ne was the only option, making me TiNe, or INTP. They were both incredibly wrong.
 
IndigoSensor said:
You've got to be kidding me. Seriously? Think about what you just said, and how bad this just sounds. Stereotypes are indeed based of a nugget of truth and small patterns, but are by no means reliable to use. There are enough patterns to base some people off pure stereotypes for MBTI, but it's extremely unreliable and can lead people to quite bad behaviors and inaccurate information.
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I disagree with you. Stereotypes are very useful.
 
corndogman said:
I disagree with you. Stereotypes are very useful.
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I was more disagreeing with the overarching principal of what he was saying. Either way stereotypes can be useful if someone actually fits them themselves. Further, it can be useful for telling how one should act or behave in a given environment.

It's more on an individual scale stereotypes becomes a very very tricky business. On a larger group scale, less so.
 
IndigoSensor said:
I was more disagreeing with the overarching principal of what he was saying. Either way stereotypes can be useful if someone actually fits them themselves. Further, it can be useful for telling how one should act or behave in a given environment.

It's more on an individual scale stereotypes becomes a very very tricky business. On a larger group scale, less so.
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Individuals make up the group. A 51+% chance of an individual possessing a a trait of the group is not that bad and probably wont get you into trouble if you treat them accordingly.
 
Indigo's right (even if I hate saying this :() stereotypes are pretty much the opposite of useful.

I'm ESFP. I should be out partying and shouldn't have any intelligence.
Oh wait. That's not true. I'm at home. :(

Just like INTJs aren't a bunch of robots with no emotions (evne if they try to act like it), ESTPs aren't always stealing cars and ENTPs aren't narcissistic assholes(err...bad example =/). Black people aren't all thieves (bad example again =/)

Do not rely on stereotypes. If you're a sensor and you rely on them, you're screwed. ;D
 
Royal said:
Do not rely on stereotypes. If you're a sensor and you rely on them, you're screwed. ;D
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Now you are just making up stereotypes.
 
Royal said:
Indigo's right (even if I hate saying this :() stereotypes are pretty much the opposite of useful.

I'm ESFP. I should be out partying and shouldn't have any intelligence.
Oh wait. That's not true. I'm at home. :(

Just like INTJs aren't a bunch of robots with no emotions (evne if they try to act like it), ESTPs aren't always stealing cars and ENTPs aren't narcissistic assholes(err...bad example =/). Black people aren't all thieves (bad example again =/)

Do not rely on stereotypes. If you're a sensor and you rely on them, you're screwed. ;D
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While they are not good for indepth analysis, they are perfect for getting a quick grasp of a situation.
 
corndogman said:
I have considered that. But the conclusion I was led to by taking many tests and possessing an understanding of MBTI (which you claim to not have done either of those, at least not correctly) I feel safe in saying I am an ISTJ and you are not an ISTJ. Even if it turns out that I am not an ISTJ I will still be ok with that but you will be floundering for self understanding through 4 simple letters.
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Ah, ISTJ eh? I typed you INTJ on tinychat. Poops.

Royal said:
Indigo's right (even if I hate saying this :() stereotypes are pretty much the opposite of useful.

I'm ESFP. I should be out partying and shouldn't have any intelligence.
Oh wait. That's not true. I'm at home. :(

Just like INTJs aren't a bunch of robots with no emotions (evne if they try to act like it), ESTPs aren't always stealing cars and ENTPs aren't narcissistic assholes(err...bad example =/). Black people aren't all thieves (bad example again =/)

Do not rely on stereotypes. If you're a sensor and you rely on them, you're screwed. ;D
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Good job ruining your argument :( lol :mhula:
 
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Was I the only one who noticed the significance of the ";D"
 
I just had a motherfucking Ni moment people. The whole thing just kinda clicked. :o HURRAY !


First off, I noticed the one major thing that fucked up the entire thing for me:

I had assumed that F/T/S/Ni was based on internal things, and F/T/S/Ne was based on external things. Which is in a sense true. But not the way I looked at it.

For example, I thought Ti was for math problems, that kind of thinking, and Te was thinking when dealing with people. The same with Ne, I mistook Fi for Ne, aka when I had a feeling about external things. I thought Si was basically Fi, and Se was a combination of Fe/Te. I mean I had the whole thing fucked up, haha. ( I found a site that explained them all)

Or like:

If I was very cold and cruel to a person, that was Te.

If I was very aware of the world around me, that was Se. (It still kind of is, but not the way I was thinking it was)

Ne, was Fi. Aka "i get a feeling about this person..." my Fi is shot to hell, luckily my Ne is still good :)




That being said, these are the JCF I use the most:

Si
Fe
Te
Ni


Now I just have to figure out what order I use them, and I just ay find my type. Ima lol if its a type I never considered, like ESFJ or something.


Although, just a prelimnary guess (may be wrong) I'd say the order I use them is

Si
Te
Ne
Fe
And I'm also putting F back on the table, though I'm very sure I'm still a T.




MBTI DOES MAKE SENSE!

But I've not looked into "pairs" people keep on talking about.


I'll get back to you guys about this.



Edit: I am now getting back to you guys about this.

With those 4 functions being used, I come up with the following types: Wait...What? You can't have Ni and Si? hmmmmmm................. I guess I'll go with Ne then... But then is it Te or Ti...? Actually... I think It's Ti. Because while I use Te a bit, when I really think about it... I'd have to go with Ti.

So:

Si
Fe
Ti
Ne

=

ISFJ— Protector Supporter Si Fe Ti Ne || Se Fi Te Ni - LOL! This is the first type I ever got.. hehehehehehehe.

ENTP — Explorer Inventor Ne Ti Fe Si || Ni Te Fi Se - Hmmm. HMMM! This makes semi sense, because when I get really stressed out I go so fucking Si on everything. Wait a sec... "The Aspirational Role (Inferior) (sometimes referred to as the 4th function)
The aspirational role usually doesn’t develop until around midlife. We often experience it first in its negative aspect of projecting our “shoulds,” fears, and negativities onto others. The qualities of these fears reflect the process that plays this role, and we are more likely to look immature when we engage in the process that plays this role. There is often a fairly high energy cost for using it—even when we acquire the skill to do so. As we learn to trust it and develop it, the aspirational role process provides a bridge to balance in our lives. Often our sense of purpose, inspiration, and ideals have the qualities of the process that plays this role."

Well that's how I use Si. So perhaps Si is my last function, and because I've been so stressed out I've flipped it into 1st gear?

INTP — Designer Theorizer Ti Ne Si Fe || Te Ni Se Fi -Hmmm, I never thought about this one... Intriguing. (also my Fi is fucking awful. haha.)

ESFJ — Facilitator Caretaker Fe Si Ne Ti || Fi Se Ni Te <- LOLOLOLOLOL!!!


edit: god, sorry for all these edits people.

What if the reason I got ISFJ when I took it backk in high school was because I was mad stressed, and I'm an ENTP? (opposite of isfj ofc)
 
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Also even more importantly, I think I will be putting introvertedness back on the table. Now that I know what I am talking about.



Ignorant question: is it possible for an introvert to have a need to be around people? All the I's in my family wouldn't mind it if they were the only ones in the world. I would hate it, which is why I thought/think I was/am an E.


[MENTION=387]IndigoSensor[/MENTION]; [MENTION=442]arbygil[/MENTION]; [MENTION=3465]Limit[/MENTION]; [MENTION=2873]SouloftheLaurel[/MENTION] [MENTION=2648]magister343[/MENTION]

I respect your guys opinions on the subject, and would like your opinion on this whole epiphany thing going on up in the post above.
 
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Ok, F this. I am really appreciative with the whole INFJf community who has gone through this erroneous learning process with me.


I'm looking into ENTP now, since the cognitive functions seem reasonable as to the way I use them.


And I think anyone who knows me has noticed this:


ENTPs are usually verbally as well as cerebrally quick, and generally love to argue--both for its own sake, and to show off their often-impressive skills. They tend to have a perverse sense of humor as well, and enjoy playing devil's advocate. They sometimes confuse, even inadvertently hurt, those who don't understand or accept the concept of argument as a sport.



Dear lord:
" When the subject matter interests them, they are able to find meaning in whatever they are studying"

Describes me down to the core XD


I will still lol if I'm esfj though.


"As a result, they function effectively in chaotic times."

Hmmm, thats what I mainly connected to in the ESTP description, but that is ENTP as well...
 
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Unless you've studied MBTI in depth, or have had years of exposure to it, you don't really know much about it.

At best, you'll know a few descriptions where its statements are understood though your own limited generalizations of people.
 
o_q said:
Unless you've studied MBTI in depth, or have had years of exposure to it, you don't really know much about it.

At best, you'll know a few descriptions where its statements are understood though your own limited generalizations of people.
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Whats your deal bro, can't take the heat?
 
Ok, now that I've looked into the ENTP, and seen it's merits I'm going to INTP, then glance at ESFJ. (isfj is so far off the list as of this time)


edit: yeah, I'm not seeing INTP in myself, too insensitive. Though O_q makes sense. L
 
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Dear Lord Almighty, I have found my type.

I will release it into the world once I have become absolutely positive of it.


edit: if you believe in mbti stereotypes my avatar should tell you what it is.



btw, I was kind of trolling about the stereotype comments earlier... Sigh


But anyways, every type I've found so far has only had what I wanted to see in myself, and none of what I actually had.

This type I found has what I really have , the good and the bad. I think I do have a type of developed E for this I type.
 
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