Michael Brown Case

Lark said:
What evidence is there of government "agent provocateurs" or that it "happens all the time"?

I think there's a lot of bullshit being posted on forums and that happens all the time.
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[video=youtube;-CGqWHaMhNM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CGqWHaMhNM[/video]
 
[video=youtube;TDHboMmIni4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDHboMmIni4[/video]
 
agent provocateurs in UK protests

[video=youtube;H7HpSqO52D4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7HpSqO52D4[/video]
 
muir said:
The point of training is that it overrides the stress response; effectively you act through reflex

But you are presuming that an aggressive situation has to arise in the first place that requires shooting to occur; if the police are less aggressive then situations might be less confrontational

Some people say michael stole something from a store while others say he paid for it

But even if someone has stolen soemthing...lets say a packet of cigarettes...is that really something a policeman needs to shoot someone over?

I'll give you an example of how policy is a factor

If you watch programmes on TV like police, camera, action the US police have a policy whereby they will aggressively shunt the cars they are pursuing off the road; this is more likely to lead to damage, injury or death

The British police on the other hand will hold back and pursue instead and set up a police trap ahead or a helicopter

In the military the US soldiers tend to kill more civilians than the UK sodliers because they do not have to account for the bullets they fire, whereas UK soldiers have to account for all bullets they fire

So when the UK government stupidly and belligerently sent paras in to police protestors on 'bloody sunday' the authorities knew fine well after the event who had done the shooting because all soldiers involved had to declare how many bullets they had fired

The authorities then know who has fired what number of rounds; also debriefing can then attempt to ascertain what the bullets were fired at

But the point i'm getting at is policy often dictates how aggressive a police officer is. Would a police investigation into the possible theft of some cigarettes (or whatever it was) back in for example the 1970's have ended in a shooting?

If the guy runs, let him run; police should be close enough to their neighbourhoods that they can track a suspect down through police work without needing to shoot at the guy
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The theft of the cigars is what set off this chain of unfortunate events, but it was not the reason Brown was shot. You're neglecting to acknowledge a very significant part of the story. He punched officer Wilson in the face while still sitting in his patrol car AND attempted to take his gun. Think about that, Muir. Who the fuck does that? Someone with a death wish. Suicide by cop, maybe? It's either that or he is/was just one dumb motherf'er because that is some stupid shit right there.

And even after he was shot, he kept coming back for more! How can you say, "if the guy runs, just let him run"? Sure, that would probably have happened if Brown would have ran BEFORE he decided to punch a cop and grab his gun. But that's not what happened. He attacked the cop.

And that makes me wonder about his toxicology report. There are drugs out there that can make a person very aggressive, like meth. Not that it would even matter but I'm curious.

Bottom line, Officer Wilson was not being aggressive. He was doing his job. Brown made some bad decisions and it ended up costing him his life.

It amazes me how people are ignoring Brown's reckless and violent behavior towards an officer, and are concentrating on making Officer Wilson into some horrible racist person. He's neither of those things. It's fucked up.
 
Anywhere But Here said:
The theft of the cigars is what set off this chain of unfortunate events, but it was not the reason Brown was shot. You're neglecting to acknowledge a very significant part of the story. He punched officer Wilson in the face while still sitting in his patrol car AND attempted to take his gun. Think about that, Muir. Who the fuck does that? Someone with a death wish. Suicide by cop, maybe? It's either that or he is/was just one dumb motherf'er because that is some stupid shit right there.

And even after he was shot, he kept coming back for more! How can you say, "if the guy runs, just let him run"? Sure, that would probably have happened if Brown would have ran BEFORE he decided to punch a cop and grab his gun. But that's not what happened. He attacked the cop.

And that makes me wonder about his toxicology report. There are drugs out there that can make a person very aggressive, like meth. Not that it would even matter but I'm curious.

Bottom line, Officer Wilson was not being aggressive. He was doing his job. Brown made some bad decisions and it ended up costing him his life.

It amazes me how people are ignoring Brown's reckless and violent behavior towards an officer, and are concentrating on making Officer Wilson into some horrible racist person. He's neither of those things. It's fucked up.
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Can you show me the video evidence of what happened in the car?

It would interesting to see what went on between the two men; obviously we will only hear one side of that story now unless we watch the video footage
 
Police shoot a man holding brake pads

[video=youtube;pBuwceiQ5Ik]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBuwceiQ5Ik[/video]
 
Police shoot a man dead for camping in the foot hills

[video=youtube;JwytoxMuk4U]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwytoxMuk4U[/video]
 
Policeman shoots an unarmed man for a seatbelt violation

[video=youtube;LaaeXIg9kSk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaaeXIg9kSk[/video]
 
Cop slits a dogs throat

[video=youtube;C8NeJh8E3wM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8NeJh8E3wM[/video]
 
Man tasered for no reason

[video=youtube;6b1QLR5LfjE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6b1QLR5LfjE[/video]
 
[h=1]Police caught framing woman for DUI on dashboard cam[/h]
[video=youtube;PtNvxZ9yCcI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtNvxZ9yCcI[/video]
 
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All of these videos!

Yes, there are bad cops out there. We all know that. But there are just as many good cops. I will post videos of good cops doing good things when I get more time. But it balances out. You can't have the good without the bad.

image.webp
 
SpecialEdition said:
eXaWAMN.png


I mean look at this poor guy. His place is torn to shit when he already had to endure a robbery. Now people are rioting and causing MORE damage than the guy who fucked up in his own actions and got shot. This is the result!

People are fucking animals. Play the race card all you want but don't be a fucking scum bag and expect to be treated like anything other than a scum bag, unless you get other scum bags rising up to cause a shit ton more damage that will overshadow what happened in the first place.

I'm actually disgusted.
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Preach it, sister. There is no excuse to use this as an excuse to show your true colors and steal from your neighbor, burn down his business, and take selfies in front of it. Proud of that? Go somewhere else and act like the selfish idiots you really are.
 
muir said:
Michael seemingly paying for his cigars before the disagreement with the store clerk

[video=youtube;maA1FUJqhew]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maA1FUJqhew[/video]

store owners say they did not call the police: http://fox2now.com/2014/08/15/store-owners-talk-about-surveillance-released/
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This video proves nothing. But Dorian Johnson's confession does:

"Freeman Bosley, a former St. Louis mayor and the lawyer for Brown’s pal, 22-year-old Dorian Johnson, said he has not seen the tape but confirmed that the slain teen took the cigars.

“My client did tell us – and told the FBI – that they went into the store,” Bosley said on MSNBC. “He told the FBI that he did take cigarillos. He told that to the DOJ and the St. Louis County Police.”

http://www.nationalreview.com/corne...rms-michael-brown-stole-cigars-greg-pollowitz
 
Once police start treating peaceful protesters as hostages of the few bad guys who took advantage of the situation instead of using the peaceful protestors to flex their pepper spray muscles, then I will go ahead and defend the actions of police. Til then I take the side of the protestors /victims by default.
 
muir said:
Can you show me the video evidence of what happened in the car?

It would interesting to see what went on between the two men; obviously we will only hear one side of that story now unless we watch the video footage
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Its funny. You complain about hearing only one side of the story, and then go and post all those videos that literally are only one side of the story. And while there's not video evidence of what happened in the car (as far as I'm aware), there is the swelling of the officer's face, blood inside the car, blood on the gun, gun powder residue in the thumb wound (only), bullet in the door of the car, and all of that included in witness testimony that said how brown fought with the officer in the car. I don't think the altercation in the car is in question.
 
Anywhere But Here said:
All of these videos!

Yes, there are bad cops out there. We all know that. But there are just as many good cops. I will post videos of good cops doing good things when I get more time. But it balances out. You can't have the good without the bad.

View attachment 22546
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Nonsense and flashing the yin and yang symbol is not an argument

The 'bad' can be exacerbated by aggressive training, aggressive culture, aggressive policy and by hiring aggressive people lacking in empathy....all of which is going on now in the police (watch the very good VICE interview i posted above for more insight)
 
muir said:
Nonsense and flashing the yin and yang symbol is not an argument

The 'bad' can be exacerbated by aggressive training, aggressive culture, aggressive policy and by hiring aggressive people lacking in empathy....all of which is going on now in the police (watch the very good VICE interview i posted above for more insight)
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I wasn't arguing. :attention:
 
Anywhere But Here said:
This video proves nothing. But Dorian Johnson's confession does:

"Freeman Bosley, a former St. Louis mayor and the lawyer for Brown’s pal, 22-year-old Dorian Johnson, said he has not seen the tape but confirmed that the slain teen took the cigars.

“My client did tell us — and told the FBI — that they went into the store,” Bosley said on MSNBC. “He told the FBI that he did take cigarillos. He told that to the DOJ and the St. Louis County Police.”

http://www.nationalreview.com/corne...rms-michael-brown-stole-cigars-greg-pollowitz
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Use your head.....all the police have to do is lean on Johnson to get the confession they want to cover their tracks (that's how the real world works)

http://nos-legionem.newsvine.com/_news/2014/11/25/26682893-officer-wilson-vs-unarmed-michael-brown

[h=1]Officer Wilson vs Unarmed Michael Brown[/h] By nos legionem
Tue Nov 25, 2014 4:43 AM
In the Past, in the Vast of Majority of Shootings, I have sided with the Police Officer. The "Problem" I have with the Ferguson Shooting comes down to the Last 95 Seconds of the Shooting.
1. From the Ferguson Police Dispatch Transcripts Officer Wilson was Aware of 2 Suspects involved in "Stealing Cigars" NOT an "ARMED ROBBERY" involving an Armed BANK ROBBERY!!!!! Where a Robber got away with Thousands of Dollars and had threatened People's Lives and was an Armed THREAT to Ferguson Citizens!!!!!
JUST STOLEN a BOX of CIGARS!!!!!! If anyone watches the Video it looks like Michael Brown puts Money down on the Counter before taking the Cigars and the STORE OWNER did NOT call the Police a Customer did. So, did he REALLY Steal the Cigars?
2. Officer Wilson thinks he has just passed the Suspects in the "Stealing a Box of Cigars Case".
3. So, Rather than stop his Police Cruiser and call for back up (which is 58 Seconds away!!!!!) and call the Suspects to him for questioning. Officer Wilson BACKS UP his SUV until he is Right Next to the 2 Suspects. So CLOSE, his door wont open because it hits the perps when he tries to open his door.
4. So, He reaches out his Drivers side Window to Grab Michael Brown and DEPENDING on who you believe EITHER 1. Pulled his weapon and threaten to shot Michael Brown, who was the Aggressor and was trying to take his gun OR 2. Officer Wilson was the Aggressor and Pulled his Weapon to shoot Michael Brown who Resisted because Officer Wilson had ALREADY pulled his weapon and Michael Brown was fearing for his life. Officer Wilson THEN SHOT Michael Brown.
5. Michael Brown Broke free and was running away from Officer Wilson when some Witnesses say Officer Wilson Shot Michael Brown from behind AND Michael Brown THEN Stopped and Turned around and PUT HIS HANDS UP "THEN" Officer Wilson shot him at least 4 more times.
6. 3 to 4 Seconds later!!!! SINCE Michael Brown, who has been shot at Least 4 Times, NOW starts to stumble forward!!!!!
7. THEN Officer Wilson Fires at Least 2 more shots as Michael Brown as he is "FALLING FACE FIRST" to the Ground!!!!!!!
8. These Last 2 Shots include the SHOT to the """"TOP"""" of Michael Browns Head and WAS the KILL SHOT!!!!!!
9. Officer Wilson has ALREADY Shot Michael NUMEROUS Times and Michael Brown is now """"STUMBLING"""" from being shot so many times!!!!!
10. Why Does Officer Wilson CONTINUE to Fire at UNARMED Michael Brown?????
There were so many NONE lethal ways Officer Wilson could have dealt with this MINOR infraction!

Why did over 100 Cleveland Police Officers Pursue 2 UNARMED people, THEN when they stop, shoot them 137 times?
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...o-car-after-chase-killing-unarmed-couple.html
Does Anyone think this is OK?????
How about this Police Shooting?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ux17aho5CSM
WHY did the Officer KEEP Shooting at the Guy EVEN AFTER he drops his wallet and his hands are EMPTY and in the AIR????

WTF is going on here? Why is it OK for Police Officers to use Deadly Force, in responses that do NOT call for Deadly Force????
 
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