Presidential candidate discussion for 2016

Superlative said:
The truth is that I don't like any of them.
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This still sums up my feelings pretty accurately.

Also

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BrokenDaniel said:
That's exactly my thought eventhorizon and that's why i can't seem to wrap my mind on such a mentality coming from Donald Trump and it's supporters. Watching it from outside comes across as contradictory to what the USA really is.
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Ok so what about the rest of it. There is a difference between undocumented immigrants, the people that Trump is speaking about and those following the laws we have in place when they come into this country. You are suggesting Trump isnt making a distinction?
 
DonTaushMe said:
So this is an interesting note. If the business is big enough they can't pay them under the table, they'd have to have it on the books as salary wages for workers. And they would have to have it on the books because if not the government would be after them. After Exxon the government implemented a law for accountants that if they find they've been cooking the books they go straight to jail. And all the information from these companies has to be made public through the SEC. So they really couldn't be paid under the table. So how the fuck... Employees have to have a social, right? Because if Tyson chicken is hiring a bunch of illegal immigrants and their not putting the wages on the books because the workers don't have social security numbers, then how does it work? And how would people who work for Tyson not be put in jail for cooking their books..? I'm trying to wrap my head around this. I don't think my accounting one class has taught me how to employ illegal immigrants yet *squints* But they company would have to write the wages off as something! And they would have to pay them under the table, or maybe they wouldn't? I suppose it's not illegal to employ illegal immigrants..? But only if they have work visa.? Now I'm completely confused x.x
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I'm saying not on the books at all. You'll see this with contractors who pick up workers off the street to get (let's say) carpentry done.
 
Trump, Bush, Clinton, most of the GOP, oh and Biden are egomaniacal megalomaniacs who are beholden to folks like Sheldon Addlson and the Koch Brothers.
(maybe not Trump, but how many times has he filed for bankruptcy now? Yes, let’s hire that guy.)
This election in 2016 is about one thing - money.
How anyone can be okay with the obvious perversion and hijacking of our election system (not to mention those purposefully making it difficult for certain groups of the population to vote) it just blows my mind.
Those who are CHOSEN by the super rich donors to be the two front runners that the rest of us get to sort-of vote for, seeing as how we also have a bogus electoral college and both sides gerrymander the votes.
It’s nonsense…the SCOTUS made sure with the laws they passed regarding money=free speech that this country is solidly no longer a Democracy.
 
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ezra said:
Moreso republicans than democrats, though.
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Well…there are hardly any Democrats running…at least so far.
You have Clinton and that other guy who’s name nobody remembers (Lincoln Chaffe??)

But I think the big surprise has been Bernie Sanders.
He’s a democratic socialist, and his record shows that he has always fought on the side of the people (which is what they are elected to do, but most do not).
He has drawn sold out crowds in stadiums designed to hold tens of thousands with people standing outside to listen.
He so far, is was ahead of any democrat or republican in the polls…but you don’t hear about it on the mainstream news because they wish he would go away.
It will be interesting to see what happens.
 
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Anywhere But Here said:
[MENTION=8603]Eventhorizon[/MENTION]

I do like Trump's views in regards to Homeland Security and Foreign Policy. But you're right. He seems to be hyperfocusing on immigration, probably because of the strong reaction it creates among Americans; it's a key issue that brings out the fight in people. Anger always draws a crowd.

Anyway, there's still time. I'll wait and see who else will be throwing their hat(s) into the ring.
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(Not that you didn't know this specifically) I think it's important to note that DHS (homeland Security) is our immigration enforcement.

"The Trump Act" (http://www.westernjournalism.com/th...a-landslide-and-obama-doesnt-like-it-one-bit/) was passed by the house which "forces local law enforcement agencies to notify Immigration and Customs Enforcement if they have an illegal immigrant in custody; otherwise, certain federal law enforcement grants would be withheld." Obama doesn't like this bill, if he vetoes it then candidates who have not solidified a stance on this issue will have to come out of the closet with their opinion. Looking at candidates IS putting the cart before the horse. We want to know who will put up or who will shut up.
 
Skarekrow said:
Well…there are hardly any Democrats running…at least so far.
You have Clinton and that other guy who’s name nobody remembers (Lincoln Chaffe??)

But I think the big surprise has been Bernie Sanders.
He’s a democratic socialist, and his record shows that he has always fought on the side of the people (which is what they are elected to do, but most do not).
He has drawn sold out crowds in stadiums designed to hold tens of thousands with people standing outside to listen.
He so far, is was ahead of any democrat or republican in the polls…but you don’t hear about it on the mainstream news because they wish he would go away.
It will be interesting to see what happens.
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As per the OP: "This should probably be limited to conservative or libertarian candidates as a result." Please make your own thread if you want to show support to a socialist candidate. I personally am in this thread b/c I am only interested in conservative or libertarian candidates. There is no person nor amount of false meme's that can sway my opinion otherwise. What I don't want to read are inflammatory posts that congest a thread b/c of your hatred for the people we are discussing. If you would like to DISCUSS and point out FACTS about conservative/libertarian candidates, by all means please do so and please site your references. Thank you.
 
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Eventhorizon said:
Ok so what about the rest of it. There is a difference between undocumented immigrants, the people that Trump is speaking about and those following the laws we have in place when they come into this country. You are suggesting Trump isnt making a distinction?
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I wrote a lot in response to the rest of your post, but then i decided to erase it, mainly because i thought it wasn't that relevant. But in a nutshell, here were i live there are the same problems with immigrants. Once i did a small gig in an almost exclusive colombian club, and last place i worked, more than half of my work colleagues were immigrants, and i'm talking about the upper side of town. Thing is that most undocumented people don't count with the same priivileges, and it's not like they don't want to, and i live in a country were getting a visa it's not that complicated, compared to the USA. Once i knew of three haitians who worked 70 hours per week and weren't documented, and without any health care because of that. I don't see how is valid taking an issue with that, it's mostly prejudice, it's not like illegals are stealing from them, that's absurd, it's pretty much the other way around. And note that i haven't talked about racism here, and how undocumented immigrants in this context seems to equate hispanics in Trump's propaganda.
 
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Sriracha said:
As per the OP: "This should probably be limited to conservative or libertarian candidates as a result." Please make your own thread if you want to show support to a socialist candidate. I personally am in this thread b/c I am only interested in conservative or libertarian candidates. There is no person nor amount of false meme's that can sway my opinion otherwise. What I don't want to read are inflammatory posts that congest a thread b/c of your hatred for the people we are discussing. If you would like to DISCUSS and point out FACTS about conservative/libertarian candidates, by all means please do so and please site your references. Thank you.
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We should be able to discuss all the candidates because all the candidates have a chance at being the next president.
So let’s weigh the pros and cons of all sides not just libertarian or conservative views…I can chill out with the meme’s but there is nothing false about the statement Trump made, nor are the companies listed below not paying any taxes or in fact getting money from the government.
I’m probably more fiscally conservative than most Republicans thank you.
I’ll keep contributing my opinions and I will provide you with links to so many facts that you’ll wish I was Muir…haha.
 
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Sriracha said:
As per the OP: "This should probably be limited to conservative or libertarian candidates as a result." Please make your own thread if you want to show support to a socialist candidate. I personally am in this thread b/c I am only interested in conservative or libertarian candidates. There is no person nor amount of false meme's that can sway my opinion otherwise. What I don't want to read are inflammatory posts that congest a thread b/c of your hatred for the people we are discussing. If you would like to DISCUSS and point out FACTS about conservative/libertarian candidates, by all means please do so and please site your references. Thank you.
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I want to know how this -
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Originally Posted by SkarekrowWell…there are hardly any Democrats running…at least so far.
You have Clinton and that other guy who’s name nobody remembers (Lincoln Chaffe??)

But I think the big surprise has been Bernie Sanders.
He’s a democratic socialist, and his record shows that he has always fought on the side of the people (which is what they are elected to do, but most do not).
He has drawn sold out crowds in stadiums designed to hold tens of thousands with people standing outside to listen.
He so far, is was ahead of any democrat or republican in the polls…but you don’t hear about it on the mainstream news because they wish he would go away.
It will be interesting to see what happens.
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How is that inflammatory? I was answering a direct question from someone else entirely.
Explain how I said something so devastatingly wrong and inflammatory please?
 
Skarekrow said:
Well…there are hardly any Democrats running…at least so far.
You have Clinton and that other guy who’s name nobody remembers (Lincoln Chaffe??)

But I think the big surprise has been Bernie Sanders.
He’s a democratic socialist, and his record shows that he has always fought on the side of the people (which is what they are elected to do, but most do not).
He has drawn sold out crowds in stadiums designed to hold tens of thousands with people standing outside to listen.
He so far, is was ahead of any democrat or republican in the polls…but you don’t hear about it on the mainstream news because they wish he would go away.
It will be interesting to see what happens.
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Thank you for acknowledging Bennie Sanders as being socialist.
 
BrokenDaniel said:
I wrote a lot in response to the rest of your post, but then i decided to erase it, mainly because i thought it wasn't that relevant. But in a nutshell, here were i live there are the same problems with immigrants. Once i did a small gig in an almost exclusive colombian club, and last place i worked, more than half of my work colleagues were immigrants, and i'm talking about the upper side of town. Thing is that most undocumented people don't count with the same priivileges, and it's not like they don't want to, and i live in a country were getting a visa it's not that complicated, compared to the USA. Once i knew of three haitians who worked 70 hours per week and weren't documented, and without any health care because of that. I don't see how is valid taking an issue with that, it's mostly prejudice, it's not like illegals are stealing from them, that's absurd, it's pretty much the other way around. And note that i haven't talked about racism here, and how undocumented immigrants in this context seems to equate hispanics in Trump's propaganda.
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When we talked of undocumented people we mostly talk of Hispanics because that is the majority of undocumented people in this country. The truth is though its about all undocumented people regardless of race.
You are right, in my opinion undocumented aliens do get the short end of the stick. But, what exactly did they think was going to happen when they came here? They shouldnt be here. I know they are trying to get away from their country because America is a better place. I get that, I understand it. But why does anyone in the world think we have some sort of obligation to take care of other countries people and failings? Why do some people think that hard working people's tax dollars...THEIR tax dollars should go towards supporting them?
Anyway as I said we dont even have to go that far. Simply knowing who is in our country and what they have brought with them, drugs, nuclear bombs..whatever is enough to warrant removing them and closing the border. And for the people following the rules, lets fix the process so that its a clear unobstructed path for those willing to live by our laws.
 
Skarekrow said:
Well…there are hardly any Democrats running…at least so far.
You have Clinton and that other guy who’s name nobody remembers (Lincoln Chaffe??)

But I think the big surprise has been Bernie Sanders.
He’s a democratic socialist, and his record shows that he has always fought on the side of the people (which is what they are elected to do, but most do not).
He has drawn sold out crowds in stadiums designed to hold tens of thousands with people standing outside to listen.
He so far, is was ahead of any democrat or republican in the polls…but you don’t hear about it on the mainstream news because they wish he would go away.
It will be interesting to see what happens.
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While I do not have proof I am fairly certain that Hillary was promised the Democrat nomination for 2016 if she would take a back seat to Obamas campaign. It just seems right with the way she gave up so easily in 2008 after having already spent a ton on running. There had to be some major agreement to have that play out as it did.
When you see Biden join the race you'll know a couple of things I think. The Democrats see Hillary as being damaged beyond repair is the main one though.
 
Skarekrow said:
I want to know how this -
How is that inflammatory? I was answering a direct question from someone else entirely.
Explain how I said something so devastatingly wrong and inflammatory please?
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Inflammatory posts that are memes. I have googled the quote and found it to be no where. It's up to the OP to decide if he wants discussion of all candidates. I'm not interested in hearing peoples one liner opinion that they pulled somewhere off the internet when I see that all day on my Facebook. There is no meat to the bone and too much bias. I consider myself to be an objective human being, and want facts ... and at the same time I don't want to hear resurrected muir conspiracy theories. lol
 
I guess I should clarify. I would like to have a serious discussion about Presidential candidates for and of 2016. I think most know by now that I do not feel Democrats offer any solutions that are good for this country, that they instead hurt this country. My ears remain open but these days they are clearly accelerating in that direction. I just dont see a meaningful conversation coming about from including Democrat candidates because they arent viable in the first place.
Having said that, I cant keep people from talking about whoever they wish. Just keep in mind no amount of conversation will change my mind or I suspect others as well. So lets try to keep the discussion to the most potentially worthy Presidential contenders if possible please.
[MENTION=5045]Skarekrow[/MENTION][MENTION=4423]Sriracha[/MENTION]
 
Eventhorizon said:
I guess I should clarify. I would like to have a serious discussion about Presidential candidates for and of 2016. I think most know by now that I do not feel Democrats offer any solutions that are good for this country, that in fact hurt this country. My ears remain open but these days they are clearly accelerating in that direction. I just dont see a meaningful conversation coming about from including Democrat candidates because they arent viable in the first place.
Having said that, I cant keep people from talking about whoever they wish. Just keep in mind no amount of conversation will change my mind or I suspect others as well. So lets try to keep the discussion to the most potentially worthy Presidential contenders if possible please.
@Skarekrowr @Sriracha
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I fail to see how a Democrat cannot be a viable contender for president just because you don't agree with their position(s). Talking about Sanders and Clinton is very much a part of the current debate and political landscape. If you had wanted to talk about Republican candidates exclusively, i think you should have made that clearer in the OP and title of the thread. Just my two cents.
 
rawr said:
I fail to see how a Democrat cannot be a viable contender for president just because you don't agree with their position(s). Talking about Sanders and Clinton is very much a part of the current debate and political landscape. If you had wanted to talk about Republican candidates exclusively, i think you should have made that clearer in the OP and title of the thread. Just my two cents.
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Sure. So long as the thread doesnt devolve into a political brawl as has been known to happen ummm forever. So things like memes making a candidate look stupid isnt really the direction I would hope a serious discussion would take.
 
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