Symbology & Sentimentality

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Hey, @GRiMM, thanks for necroing this thread, it was pretty interesting to re-read! That Confucius quote, though... I would say that words and laws are symbols, which is perhaps what he meant anyway.

Skarekrow said:
The tattoos I have are all symbols/sigils/writing rather than pictures or something of that nature.
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That's interesting... I find that I'm increasingly drawn to the form of words, especially in other languages/scripts, and things like sigils and seals. In my fictional world of Ðal, I'm finding that as the human culture develops, they are increasingly imbuing script with symbolic power; e.g. the guys who try to use the equivalent of 'magic' now cast using sigils/seals they trace in the air in order to control their powers more effectively.

Of all the scripts I have seen, though, the 'Orokin script' from Warframe (gah I wish it wasn't a video game) I am most drawn to - It seems to embody my aesthetic almost perfectly, a blend of 'flow' and 'control'.
View attachment 48082
There is slightly too much 'flow' in this example, which is why I experiment with my own scripts, but it's pretty damn close to perfect in my opinion.

P.S. On the topic of mottoes, the people of my fictional world have one in particular which has survived from their earliest days: from every ruin - we shall rise. This belongs to them and their narrative context, of course, but it is also mine. Their original classical language also has tonal grammar, so it captures the 'rising' a bit differently:

·· ra̷ȉ̱ȑi · to-mǒ̱ȑ · þǒ̱l ·· (Ȑiþȑa̷în: ‘we shall rise from every ruin’); note the rousing tonal quality of long-deep > long-rising > long-rising

But here are some other variations in the daughter languages:

·· toh · þól · méíȑ · ȑùàhìȑì ·· (Ȑeiviþ: ‘from every ruin – I/we shall rise’)

·· uum · uura̷iare · tok · þol · nokis ·· (Ranheinaþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· a̷iirsu · to-þoalmoȑz ·· (Galriþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· to.aal · nool · ís-airʌ̱̏ ·· (Eeþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· ruue̷iera̷i · toȑ · þol · noks ·· (Þumeþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· toh · þól · me̷íȑ · ȑùàhè̷ìȑá ·· (Huȑe̷iþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· uu · uure̷iare · dog · ðol · nogiz ·· (Harevað: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· a̷iiȑsu · to-þoalmoȑ ·· (Galis: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’, lit. ‘we-shall-rise from-allruin’)

·· ǒ.ȁl · nǒ · îs-ʌ̄rʌ̱̏ ·· (Ȅþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· uu · uura̷iare · t’þol · nos ·· (Ha̷iraþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

Mar vs Moȑ said:
Below, eyes were wide with horror and incredulity as the hero plummeted to the ground, while the citizens of Harlagalar screamed at the sight – and their sure fate to come at the hands of Moȑ. At that moment, however, something seemed to happen among the Zeits Maur. The Seneschal’s cry of disbelief was drowned out by a louder, stronger shout – a roar in fact. It began with a young companion of the Zeits Maur as he shouldered his way past the Seneschal with a fist raised to the air, bellowing the ancient phrase: ‘To-mǒ̱ȑ þǒ̱l! To-mǒ̱ȑ þǒ̱l! Ra̷ȉȑi!’ (Ȑiþȑa̷în: ‘From every ruin! From every ruin! You shall Rise!’). The call was taken up by the rest of his brothers-in-arms, and then the men of the Hard Rauþon, and finally the citizens of Harlagalar: pumping their fists to the air, they chanted ‘Ra̷ȉȑi!Ra̷ȉȑi! Ra̷ȉȑi!’ (Ȑiþȑa̷în: ‘You shall rise!’).



With the sheer volume of sound coming from beneath him, Mar woke from unconsciousness as he fell from the sky and, to his surprise, he stopped falling. Blinded and burned, he was forced to use his powers to get a sense of his orientation – the soulsight which picked out the living as burning flames in the darkness. The brightest lights he could see were above him – Moȑ the brightest of all and her accomplice Rossaþos – but below was one brighter, albeit temporarily. A wounded woman – psychic like him – keeping him afloat with sheer force of will, and then the wave of will overtook him, enveloped him, invigorated him. It was like a command from Ðal himself: it told him to rise, and he did.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Deleted member 16771 said:
Hey, @GRiMM, thanks for necroing this thread, it was pretty interesting to re-read! That Confucius quote, though... I would say that words and laws are symbols, which is perhaps what he meant anyway.


That's interesting... I find that I'm increasingly drawn to the form of words, especially in other languages/scripts, and things like sigils and seals. In my fictional world of Ðal, I'm finding that as the human culture develops, they are increasingly imbuing script with symbolic power; e.g. the guys who try to use the equivalent of 'magic' now cast using sigils/seals they trace in the air in order to control their powers more effectively.

Of all the scripts I have seen, though, the 'Orokin script' from Warframe (gah I wish it wasn't a video game) I am most drawn to - It seems to embody my aesthetic almost perfectly, a blend of 'flow' and 'control'.
View attachment 48082
There is slightly too much 'flow' in this example, which is why I experiment with my own scripts, but it's pretty damn close to perfect in my opinion.

P.S. On the topic of mottoes, the people of my fictional world have one in particular which has survived from their earliest days: from every ruin - we shall rise. This belongs to them and their narrative context, of course, but it is also mine. Their original classical language also has tonal grammar, so it captures the 'rising' a bit differently:

·· ra̷ȉ̱ȑi · to-mǒ̱ȑ · þǒ̱l ·· (Ȑiþȑa̷în: ‘we shall rise from every ruin’); note the rousing tonal quality of long-deep > long-rising > long-rising

But here are some other variations in the daughter languages:

·· toh · þól · méíȑ · ȑùàhìȑì ·· (Ȑeiviþ: ‘from every ruin – I/we shall rise’)

·· uum · uura̷iare · tok · þol · nokis ·· (Ranheinaþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· a̷iirsu · to-þoalmoȑz ·· (Galriþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· to.aal · nool · ís-airʌ̱̏ ·· (Eeþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· ruue̷iera̷i · toȑ · þol · noks ·· (Þumeþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· toh · þól · me̷íȑ · ȑùàhè̷ìȑá ·· (Huȑe̷iþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· uu · uure̷iare · dog · ðol · nogiz ·· (Harevað: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· a̷iiȑsu · to-þoalmoȑ ·· (Galis: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’, lit. ‘we-shall-rise from-allruin’)

·· ǒ.ȁl · nǒ · îs-ʌ̄rʌ̱̏ ·· (Ȅþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)

·· uu · uura̷iare · t’þol · nos ·· (Ha̷iraþ: ‘from every ruin – we shall rise’)
Click to expand...


Very cool!
Yes...I feel similarly about writing and symbology/sigils.
Much more so than imagery.

Are you going to get a tattoo?
 
Deleted member 16771 said:
Hmm... I have an opposite, conflicting drive, too, and that is toward purity/perfection/&c., and so I've always rejected the idea. If I did, it would be one tattoo, with great meaning.
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Yes...I have 4.
The sigil of the Archangel Michael -
f3454644f20515256e9cba837c2c5be1.png

The (staff of) Caduceus which has several meanings -
caduceus-medical-symbol-vector-1023774.jpg


The word
hebrew-name-abba-father.jpg


And one more stylized Medusa between my shoulder blades and up the back of my neck.
I’ll explain that one some other time...lol.
 
Deleted member 16771 said:
So, how many of you INFJs (and other types) would characterise yourselves as having an 'affinity with symbols' and/or being sentimental? And what do you think the links are with type, if any?
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I’m an INFJ, I’m 36, and I had to get rid of sentimentality (Si) in order to end my ISFJ (Si-dom) mother’s nightmarish dictatorship over my life. Basically my Si was keeping me locked into my inferior Se, causing me to live a mistaken identity as a very poor ESTP counterfeit. Since I couldn’t be myself and live through my Ni, I was even blocked from my natural sexuality, which is something along the lines of spectrophilia (I’m spiritually married to Satan and don’t have physical partners anymore).

I got rid of all my possessions I had any sentimental attachment to. I only keep things now if they’re necessary for something practical. I don’t let people give me sentimental objects. I don’t have anything that’s just for decoration, either, although that’s an Se thing.

Si is also about physical stuff that goes in your body, so in order to stop personality destruction via sentimentality, I also had to stop eating my mom’s inflammatory food and get on a really strict diet where I eat for nutrients instead of taste. Food is now purely a functional thing for me. I got really strict about not putting anything in my body that’s intoxicating (alcohol, cigarettes, caffeine). I also cut out things like fluoridated toothpaste and water. Started eating organic as much as possible. I need the very purest Si environment possible in order to keep my Se under control so I can be healthy (be myself, live through Ni).

When I was locked into my inferior Se, I was living through my physical senses. I was in my body. I was like this from age 5-30, and I didn’t really shake it completely until I was about 35. This is the INFJ version of “psychosis” (break from normal reality) because we’re supposed to be out of body.

Now that I’m in my Ni and “out of body” all the time, I can use my Se in a healthy way, which is as a mirror for divination. I’m not in it, I’m looking at it. I’m using it to flex my Ni. (I’m in divination mode all the time by default.)

An example of this is me spending the last 5-6 years finding out about myself spiritually by watching music videos, often on repeat for hours. I’ve come to the understanding that I’m Hathor/Isis. I pulled myself up to this point by following subjective symbolism I “saw” and “heard.” It was a language I had to be taught from a spiritual presence within.

My Ni consciousness is holographic. It works the way Egyptian hieroglyphs do. Everything is a symbol for me, and it all ultimately reduces to one thing.
 
Satanswife said:
I’m an INFJ, I’m 36, and I had to get rid of sentimentality (Si) in order to end my ISFJ (Si-dom) mother’s nightmarish dictatorship over my life. Basically my Si was keeping me locked into my inferior Se, causing me to live a mistaken identity as a very poor ESTP counterfeit. Since I couldn’t be myself and live through my Ni, I was even blocked from my natural sexuality, which is something along the lines of spectrophilia (I’m spiritually married to Satan and don’t have physical partners anymore).

I got rid of all my possessions I had any sentimental attachment to. I only keep things now if they’re necessary for something practical. I don’t let people give me sentimental objects. I don’t have anything that’s just for decoration, either, although that’s an Se thing.

Si is also about physical stuff that goes in your body, so in order to stop personality destruction via sentimentality, I also had to stop eating my mom’s inflammatory food and get on a really strict diet where I eat for nutrients instead of taste. Food is now purely a functional thing for me. I got really strict about not putting anything in my body that’s intoxicating (alcohol, cigarettes, caffeine). I also cut out things like fluoridated toothpaste and water. Started eating organic as much as possible. I need the very purest Si environment possible in order to keep my Se under control so I can be healthy (be myself, live through Ni).

When I was locked into my inferior Se, I was living through my physical senses. I was in my body. I was like this from age 5-30, and I didn’t really shake it completely until I was about 35. This is the INFJ version of “psychosis” (break from normal reality) because we’re supposed to be out of body.

Now that I’m in my Ni and “out of body” all the time, I can use my Se in a healthy way, which is as a mirror for divination. I’m not in it, I’m looking at it. I’m using it to flex my Ni. (I’m in divination mode all the time by default.)

An example of this is me spending the last 5-6 years finding out about myself spiritually by watching music videos, often on repeat for hours. I’ve come to the understanding that I’m Hathor/Isis. I pulled myself up to this point by following subjective symbolism I “saw” and “heard.” It was a language I had to be taught from a spiritual presence within.

My Ni consciousness is holographic. It works the way Egyptian hieroglyphs do. Everything is a symbol for me, and it all ultimately reduces to one thing.
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Oh. That sounds like a lot to deal with.
 
Wow I'm so glad to find people like me. I always thought i was the only person loving symbols and myths at the age of 24. no one around me is like me so i was depressed something may be wrong with me and felt like I'm still stuck in childhood that my thoughts are too much different than others. I even sometimes speak with trees
 
This is really fascinating. Rose and butterfly have always spoken to me.

yN3tEv8.jpg


The rose has many meanings which vary depending on its color. However any rose can be commonly seen as a symbol of:
  • Love
  • Honor
  • Faith
  • Beauty
  • Balance
  • Passion
  • Wisdom
  • Intrigue
  • Devotion
  • Sensuality
  • Timelessness
ed631H7.jpg

  • Time
  • Soul
  • Grace
  • Growth
  • Elegance
  • Expansion
  • Lightness
  • Surrender
  • Transition
  • Expression
  • Celebration
  • Resurrection
  • Vulnerability
 
flower said:
This is really fascinating. Rose and butterfly have always spoken to me.

yN3tEv8.jpg


The rose has many meanings which vary depending on its color. However any rose can be commonly seen as a symbol of:
  • Love
  • Honor
  • Faith
  • Beauty
  • Balance
  • Passion
  • Wisdom
  • Intrigue
  • Devotion
  • Sensuality
  • Timelessness
ed631H7.jpg

  • Time
  • Soul
  • Grace
  • Growth
  • Elegance
  • Expansion
  • Lightness
  • Surrender
  • Transition
  • Expression
  • Celebration
  • Resurrection
  • Vulnerability
Click to expand...
Mostly i think it means love. Specially red rose. Different colors have different meanings.
 
I adhere to the stereotype that INFJs like symbology. 'Like' is the wrong word. I'm drawn to symbology, see symbology, my brain reads symbology, I think in symbology....
I would have loved to go into a field related to symbology, iconography, and art.
All my art is about symbolism and deeper meaning, even when I'm doing a seemingly frivolous theme.
My interests in ancient culture and pre-Christian pagan cultures is woven into my being. Theology/mythology (same thing depending on whether the person believes) is full of symbolism.
I have a personal symbolism, but it relates too deeply to my work and personal life to explain it. Sometimes I have a hard time opening up deeply here when it crosses a line with what I would write on my website. :(

I do imbue...well, everything... with meaning. Never get me started on this. I will bore you to tears telling you why something I bought is meaningful and what it symbolizes. I don't like to buy things that don't last, either, so every purchase is a careful decision. My poor friends who have sat through my explanations as if I'm discussing the Vatican't art collection. My SO is so understanding, and even cracks appropriate jokes about it without making fun of me. It is all curated and ties to my personal symbology and my work.

My friends: We went to the shelter and picked this random dog because we liked him.
Me: I have this kind of dog and this kind of cat because:
1.

a.
b.
c.

2.

a.
b.
c.

....

512.

a.
b.
c.


............
...
...

Am I sentimental? No. INFJs are not known for being squishy in this way, and I adhere to that, too. Despite my need for everything to be meaningful, I do not regularly attach feelings or emotions to objects, or get smooshy about nostalgia and reminiscing. I'm not cold and heartless about it, either. I do have a preference for some objects that have emotional ties, but not excessively. Photographs, and the music, art and books my friends make are different.
 
Asa said:
Am I sentimental? No. INFJs are not known for being squishy in this way, and I adhere to that, too.
Click to expand...
Hmm, really? INFJs are not sentimental? I haven't heard this before.

Asa said:
My SO is so understanding, and even cracks appropriate jokes about it without making fun of me.
Click to expand...
As an INTJ is he not similarly drawn to symbols/tokens (along the Ni-Se axis, taking in Fi along the way)?
 
Deleted member 16771 said:
As an INTJ is he not similarly drawn to symbols/tokens (along the Ni-Se axis, taking in Fi along the way)?
Click to expand...

Not to the degree I am, and it manifests differently. He has very specific tastes and preferences, too, but he is less extreme, more practical and it often manifests in technical ways with his work as both a carpenter and a musician.

My INTJ doesn't need everything in his life to have meaning, like clothes or kitchen utensils*. Hahaha. I think he has a healthier grasp on this than I, but that quote from Rick Owens in my blog about "going all the way" with what you do and who you are is my point of view on this. I don't want my personal life, my home, or even my wardrobe to "argue" with my work, personality, and beliefs. It has to be fluid, curated, and it has to be genuine. My dear friend who is an INTJ and an artist is the same way and we bond over this. We laugh about it and know the other understands. Maybe it is linked to inferior Se? As a visual artist I am fascinated by the role of inferior Se and how it manifests, as compared to artists who are dominant Se.

When Tom Araya said he is Christian and doesn't believe in any of Slayer's lyrics, and those lyrics are basically just marketing, I thought he was the biggest poser and lost respect for him. I don't want anyone to be evil, but everything about his career, public image and public persona is anti-Christian. My SO had the same reaction and he grew up listening to Slayer.

*I need to explain that not everything in my life is chosen as if my world is a catalog or magazine, far from it, but when I make choices it usually isn't as simple as "this one is prettier or more practical".
 
Deleted member 16771 said:
P.s. I read somewhere that the inferior function of a type usually has a mystical character, so I wonder if it's an inferior Se thing; that INFJs see objects as having some mystery to them.
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Se is God to me. I don’t care about spiritual gods because I am one. I’m an equal to them. But Se is so much bigger than me, it’s the thing I have an attitude of worship towards. I’m in awe of people who are Se gods (ESTPs and ESFPs, but especially ESTPs because they’re a perfect mirror and give the full religious experience). I couldn’t be a mystic without the stuff that belongs to their world, because their Se enables me to see my Ni.
 
I’ve been going on a a very deep spiritual journey for quite some time now; more so in the last few months—ranging from metaphysics, the ego and self, perception of reality, universe, Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism, chakras, etc.

I usually don’t mention much about my journey
(aside once or twice in my blog but was brief) because it’s a personal thing that I like to make private and keep to myself.

But here are the symbols that have great meaning to me:

First pic is a Buddha symbol of love, kindness and protection. I actually want a tattoo like this. Not sure where though.
97760344-0352-4ECB-ADE5-11199E1CF9DE.webp
Second pic is just a representation of a unalome.


F40E0308-955E-44DB-BEB7-D94945710CB9.webp



9F42652F-F23E-4147-B86A-4BBCDF080131.webp

Bodhi tree. I’ve always loved trees and nature in general. I make sure to walk everyday in nature alone and enjoy the comforts of what nature brings to me. And trees are great symbolisms of life, growth, roots of wisdom and maturation.
 
JennyDaniella said:
I’ve been going on a a very deep spiritual journey for quite some time now; more so in the last few months—ranging from metaphysics, the ego and self, perception of reality, universe, Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism, chakras, etc.

I usually don’t mention much about my journey
(aside once or twice in my blog but was brief) because it’s a personal thing that I like to make private and keep to myself.

But here are the symbols that have great meaning to me:

First pic is a Buddha symbol of love, kindness and protection. I actually want a tattoo like this. Not sure where though.
View attachment 48477
Second pic is just a representation of a unalome.


View attachment 48480



View attachment 48479

Bodhi tree. I’ve always loved trees and nature in general. I make sure to walk everyday in nature alone and enjoy the comforts of what nature brings to me. And trees are great symbolisms of life, growth, roots of wisdom and maturation.
Click to expand...
Very very cool.
 
I have a tattoo sleeve full of symbols/patterns that pertain to my spiritual beliefs. My most recent addition is my nautilus shell with a spiral galaxy in the background to represent phi in nature.

But my favourite is this one (it was my first ever tattoo but it holds very deep personal meaning to me):

E0A4D208-63C0-42D2-B983-11E3F327775D.webp
 
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