The coming American civil war.

Eventhorizon said:
Agreed. Which is why I believe the vast majority of liberals are not ignorant, simply uninformed and sometimes deliberately so.
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I think we really want mostly the same things overall...we want this country to succeed and succeed for all those willing to contribute...it’s how we get there and such that we come to disagreements on.
What you state works both ways...like my Aunt and Uncle, very smart, he’s like one of those computer geniuses that got in at the right time.
The GOP’s agenda works best for them and their tax bracket, but they are by no means bad people and want to see the county fall to shit.
I know you don’t want that either and you know I don’t as well.
There are some people who constantly ignore factual information that doesn’t fit their plan/beliefs/etc.
I like to hope though that the majority are good, hard-working, moral, people.
 
Skarekrow said:
I think we really want mostly the same things overall...we want this country to succeed and succeed for all those willing to contribute...it’s how we get there and such that we come to disagreements on.
What you state works both ways...like my Aunt and Uncle, very smart, he’s like one of those computer geniuses that got in at the right time.
The GOP’s agenda works best for them and their tax bracket, but they are by no means bad people and want to see the county fall to shit.
I know you don’t want that either and you know I don’t as well.
There are some people who constantly ignore factual information that doesn’t fit their plan/beliefs/etc.
I like to hope though that the majority are good, hard-working, moral, people.
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Quit building bridges, this is a forum not a love fest.
 
Skarekrow said:
I think we really want mostly the same things overall...we want this country to succeed and succeed for all those willing to contribute...it’s how we get there and such that we come to disagreements on.
.
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I disagree. The plurality of Democrats (in my opinion) think that taxes should be used to lift society economically, socially, environmentally and medically. Just look at the support Sanders' brand of socialism has garnered. They recognize that the US is fabulously wealthy as proven by the Trillions spent waging war to protect the west's access to oil. They want to direct that wealth at education, health care, clean air and water, economic support for the elderly and infirm, reversal of global warming, social justice.

The plurality of Republicans believe that the country is near bankruptcy, that the country is besieged by migrants that have not entered the country legally, that it is human nature to be slothful if there is a way to get free stuff, that most of those who endure economic hardship deserve it because they didn't work hard enough or didn't plan well enough, that most of those who clamor for a more "just " society are blaming society for their own shortcomings.

And the "independents" are not really paying enough attention to what is going on.
 
Stu said:
I disagree. The plurality of Democrats (in my opinion) think that taxes should be used to lift society economically, socially, environmentally and medically. Just look at the support Sanders' brand of socialism has garnered. They recognize that the US is fabulously wealthy as proven by the Trillions spent waging war to protect the west's access to oil. They want to direct that wealth at education, health care, clean air and water, economic support for the elderly and infirm, reversal of global warming, social justice.

The plurality of Republicans believe that the country is near bankruptcy, that the country is besieged by migrants that have not entered the country legally, that it is human nature to be slothful if there is a way to get free stuff, that most of those who endure economic hardship deserve it because they didn't work hard enough or didn't plan well enough, that most of those who clamor for a more "just " society are blaming society for their own shortcomings.

And the "independents" are not really paying enough attention to what is going on.
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I think its an incorrect assement to associate the wars that have been fought primarily have to do with oil. For Democrats I believe they also have an incorrect assessment that the US has an unlimited amount of money. The money the US has is dependant on the creation of things people want.
 
Eventhorizon said:
I think its an incorrect assement to associate the wars that have been fought primarily have to do with oil.
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We invaded Afghanistan because a Saudi-Yemeni lead group attacked us from there, they were hell bent on our destruction because we consider the Arabian peninsula as vital to our economic interest. We invaded Iraq to keep the Bathists from developing their oil fields and using the profits to dominate all Arabian oil production.

Tell me another story that makes more sense
 
Stu said:
I disagree. The plurality of Democrats (in my opinion) think that taxes should be used to lift society economically, socially, environmentally and medically. Just look at the support Sanders' brand of socialism has garnered. They recognize that the US is fabulously wealthy as proven by the Trillions spent waging war to protect the west's access to oil. They want to direct that wealth at education, health care, clean air and water, economic support for the elderly and infirm, reversal of global warming, social justice.

The plurality of Republicans believe that the country is near bankruptcy, that the country is besieged by migrants that have not entered the country legally, that it is human nature to be slothful if there is a way to get free stuff, that most of those who endure economic hardship deserve it because they didn't work hard enough or didn't plan well enough, that most of those who clamor for a more "just " society are blaming society for their own shortcomings.

And the "independents" are not really paying enough attention to what is going on.
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I think though that we all don’t want to see it crumble.
That toxic lead lined water is not acceptable. Neither side has done shit about that.
Even the GOP who is just as bought out as the Democrats IMHO, are starting to see that the game Reagan started is fucking up the economy and our country.
I believe we are going to see a mad scramble back toward the middle and away from all the Fox news/MSNBC far-left or far-right rhetoric.
They will have to, because even though the American people seem to have short memories and even our Congress (repeal of Glass-Stegall for example).
But more and more the public are demanding accountability and transparency...something Obama promised but never did.
Hillary certainly isn’t going to change it...you may as well just keep Obama in the WH...Congress will give her the cold shoulder and obstruct her just like they have with Obama.
Frankly IDK if Bernie could do anything about it, but I think he’ll at least call out Congress, he’s at least fighting and has a consistent record of fighting for the middle class and poor. Then Fox news will have it’s hay-day talking about how we’re now a Socialist country...fucking idiots.
I just don’t know...I think some serious shit could very easy be hitting the fan...there is a dude somewhere squatting over a fan and it’s hanging.
The people of this country will only take so much shit before we begin to see more acts (probably violent) committed by growing discontent.
I mean...what happened to the New Deal?
It’s been slowly dismantled by the republicans over the decades and now we are almost back to bread lines, we certainly see lines for medical care.
Both parties since Reagan have been owned by the rich.
We have growing numbers of people who hate both parties.
That’s why those who registered “Independent” to vote have been disenfranchised.
And then....if it goes to a contested convention...where is the voice of the people?
We need to repeal Citizen’s United and start this whole election over, but that won’t happen...so I hope whomever ends up in the WH gets their shit together real fast, because I believe they're going to need it.
 
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Stu said:
We invaded Afghanistan because a Saudi-Yemeni lead group attacked us from there, they were hell bent on our destruction because we consider the Arabian peninsula as vital to our economic interest. We invaded Iraq to keep the Bathists from developing their oil fields and using the profits to dominate all Arabian oil production.

Tell me another story that makes more sense
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So you dont put any stock into trying to stabilize the area by giving the people something other than a dictatorship?
 
Eventhorizon said:
So you dont put any stock into trying to stabilize the area by giving the people something other than a dictatorship?
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Freedom is something you take, it is never a gift
 
Stu said:
I disagree. The plurality of Democrats (in my opinion) think that taxes should be used to lift society economically, socially, environmentally and medically. Just look at the support Sanders' brand of socialism has garnered. They recognize that the US is fabulously wealthy as proven by the Trillions spent waging war to protect the west's access to oil. They want to direct that wealth at education, health care, clean air and water, economic support for the elderly and infirm, reversal of global warming, social justice.

The plurality of Republicans believe that the country is near bankruptcy, that the country is besieged by migrants that have not entered the country legally, that it is human nature to be slothful if there is a way to get free stuff, that most of those who endure economic hardship deserve it because they didn't work hard enough or didn't plan well enough, that most of those who clamor for a more "just " society are blaming society for their own shortcomings.

And the "independents" are not really paying enough attention to what is going on.
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independants is too broad a term these days.
 
I am convinced we are absolutely headed toward a now unavoidable civil war. The question is whats the time frame we are looking at.
As could be expected Obama is focusing on gun laws yet again rather than terrorism. We cant say Obama is a failure in regard to terrorism because his failure to protect American interests is intentional.
 
Two out of ten candidates on our primary ballot declared for Bernie, they got my my vote and I am getting yard signs for them.
 
Stu said:
Two out of ten candidates on our primary ballot declared for Bernie, they got my my vote and I am getting yard signs for them.
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I do not understand what you are saying here?
 
Eventhorizon said:
I do not understand what you are saying here?
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Talking about voting in my state's Democratic Primary, you know "voting" what responsible citizens do to influence their government and society, rather then what irresponsible citizens do, like talking up "civil war" and loosely throwing around words like "treason"
 
Stu said:
Talking about voting in my state's Democratic Primary, you know "voting" what responsible citizens do to influence their government and society, rather then what irresponsible citizens do, like talking up "civil war" and loosely throwing around words like "treason"
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Oh I see. Well irresponsible would be an opinion but you are right to some extent. When we have people in political office who do not follow the laws associated with the county, do not follow what the constitution states or think its nothing more than a suggestion or better yet doesn't aplly to them... its simply left to the people to correct these fallacies of thought or perhaps better put, lack of it.

That is where we are headed. When our government officials stop obeying the law they have to be held accountable and they will be.
 
I don't think there will be a civil war. I feel like we are at that point where if some patriot killed one of the ruling tyrants, that person would just be killed. It would create a power vacuum letting in a new psychopath to power, and the media would just gloss over the patriots actions.

Also so I don't see any new vision for the country. The old vision was too fragile.
 
the said:
I don't think there will be a civil war. I feel like we are at that point where if some patriot killed one of the ruling tyrants, that person would just be killed. It would create a power vacuum letting in a new psychopath to power, and the media would just gloss over the patriots actions.

Also so I don't see any new vision for the country. The old vision was too fragile.
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How do you see the old vision as being too fragile?
 
the said:
I don't think there will be a civil war. I feel like we are at that point where if some patriot killed one of the ruling tyrants, that person would just be killed. It would create a power vacuum letting in a new psychopath to power, and the media would just gloss over the patriots actions.

Also so I don't see any new vision for the country. The old vision was too fragile.
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Actual change will have to happen through subverting their own system, a legitimate political and ideological movement that has the mass to make waves.
 
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