The Syrian Clusterfuck

As an observer from afar, I feel this all began in the early eighties in Beirut.

As for Putin? Ports have been all important in his global bid, as well as power(oil, gas, etc). He has now positioned himself for vast global arms sales. Iran will be crossing Israel's red lines with arms transfers to Hezbollah and now Syria. Israel is still at war with Syria. The Kurds did more in the fight against ISIS than most people would admit, and the vacuum has instilled Erdogan's hatred for the Kurds by invading Syria to take from the Kurds. The US might best sit where they are and stand up for their Kurdish allies, while fighting remnants of ISIS that are trying to regain their momentum. War games with real people involved. Chlorine gas killing civilians. Dictators killing those against them.

The bombing of northern Africa was a clustermess that opened the doorway to immigrants. Immigrants bring militants and spies. Someone will outwit the Russian S-300 and S-400 SAMs and sales will stop the flow of money, but Putin still has his power money.

Give me one operable S-400 and a team a few months with it, and those will be history. Can I have two?

Guess I should mention Saudi Arabia and Iran's Yemen. I was told many years ago to never forget Saudi Arabia.
 
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I'm no fan of Putin, but i'd like to make this point briefly if I may- Gorbachev made a deal with George Bush Sr, the soviets allow their satellite states in eastern Europe to be dissolved and in exchange the U.S. does not expand NATO.

After Bush lost to Clinton, Clinton expanded NATO. Bush Sr. and Clinton also failed to deliver on the kind of economic aid that would have stabilized Russia during the collapse of the Soviet union and instead opted on military spending (in case the soviets should rise again, presumably) which contributed to the collapse of Boris Yeltson's capitalist government and effectively put Putin in office.

Now look at this picture:

Thousand Yard Stare.webp

For the record I am not saying that Putin is not a bad man, I am not saying Russia does not want war- what i'm saying is that one of the reasons why we're in the situation that we're in is because of our choices in the 90s. Also it is important to note that there are some purely defensive considerations on the part of the Russians. Whether that includes Syria, or whether that justifies anything Putin has done is a separate conversation. That's all I want to say, carry on.
 
- Trump announces he will pull out of Syria.
- Israeli news agencies start writing articles that condemn Trumps proposal.
- A week later, Assad 'reportedly' uses chemical weapons against civilians.
- American news media immediately start questioning Trumps announcement and propose that maybe 'now is too early'

Trump has been defeated by the establishment. Not that he's a good man -- he just isn't. Below is a video that summarises the situation in Syria nicely.

 
wolly.green said:
- Trump announces he will pull out of Syria.
- Israeli news agencies start writing articles that condemn Trumps proposal.
- A week later, Assad 'reportedly' uses chemical weapons against civilians.
- American news media immediately start questioning Trumps announcement and propose that maybe 'now is too early'

Trump has been defeated by the establishment. Not that he's a good man -- he just isn't. Below is a video that summarises the situation in Syria nicely.

Click to expand...

Respectfully, I think you should take another look at that video, the YouTube user and the agenda they're pushing. Even if you believe every word of the video, there's Assad on camera freely admitting, he did have chemical weapons.
 
We have seen this before. Lets start with 911. What did Iraq have to do with with 911? Nothing. Bush even joked about still looking for those weapons of mass destruction. And admitted that Iraq had nothing to do with 911. So how many innocent civilians did our country kill? We murdered those people because we started a false war. We were the terrorists in Iraq.
Lybia. What did momar gadaffi do? Nothing. He agreed to give up his weapons he was complying with the un. Hillary Clinton laughed at killing him. The man was murdered through an illegal act of war. Congress did not sign off on this. And yet we went. I often wonder who got all of gadaffis and saadam Husains gold reserves. Because both countries were planning to accept gold as payment for oil. Our US dollar is tied directly to their oil. If the petro dollar collapses the United States is sunk. The USA is using war to prop up the economy. The military sector has grown substantially since 911. Its good business. And since they make the intel. They can say anything to justify killing now because people are trained to trust the government. Any one paying attention can see that most Americans will believe what the news says. That's why it's important to keep the internet free of government control. Propaganda right now is very high and has been for some time. We're going to war over 14 people? The USA government is insane to spend that kinda money over 14 people. And sadly Americans are too preoccupied with useless distractions and under the burden of paying taxes and for their daily life. They have stolen your wealth through inflation. And made you a slave through the idea of the American dream which I realize is the American nightmare. We have homelessness running rampant in the country and no one seems to really care. They bide their time hoping it won't be them. Your food supply can be shut off over night. And In a short time as little as 30 days millions could be dead. We are totally dependent on someone else for our food. And if one does not see that the tempature is slowly rising they will be cooled in their own mess. No one should ever think that government is working for your good just looking at your own local city council should open your eyes. If the locals peoplefrom your own town will screw you why would you think that big brother won't be inline to get theirs in. If you want to save America you better get involved locally. Because in the end it's the same kinda people in the federal government as in the state. Americans need to start looking a little deeper.
 
James said:
Respectfully, I think you should take another look at that video, the YouTube user and the agenda they're pushing. Even if you believe every word of the video, there's Assad on camera freely admitting, he did have chemical weapons.
Click to expand...

Sure. But how does that change anything? A book I read, called The Queen of Chaos, mentioned that the Syrian invasion happened because of a few converging factors. Access to the Golan Heights, Israeli dominance in the Middle East and the oil Pipeline from Iran to Syria. Americas humanitarian 'intentions' are probably disingenuous, as was explained in by Chomsky in Manufacturing Consent. I actually believe this because of the way people like Noam Chomsky and Naomi Klein have meticulously documented American colonialism in recent history. The video I showed is merely a summary of the only facts that I consider relevant.
 
wolly.green said:
The video I showed is merely a summary of the only facts that I consider relevant.
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I've read Chomsky and like him. It's a complex situation. In the video the narrator claims there is no evidence, while proposing alternative theories (with no evidence).

I think Assad admitting he "previously" had chemical weapons ? That is evidence.

Check out the other videos they've posted.
 
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If this is helpful – this is from official UN sources. My organisation has sent many experts to the Syria Commission of Inquiry since its establishment in 2011.

COISyria_ChemicalWeapons.jpg
 
James said:
He did. And he used them, on both his own people and the Kurds. Whilst I was against the Iraq war, he was a psychotic killer, detested by his people.
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Iran was stopped at Iraq's door with CBWs. If I am not mistaken, I remember pictures from the Israelis showing covered trucks leaving Iraq through the mountains to Syria right before we went in. While Saddam Hussein was a terrible man, he stood between Iran and Hezbollah. That vacuum led to ISIS, which erupted into a nightmare. Putin sold S-300 SAMs to Iran and is trying to help them move into Syria. Turkey is trying to rid themselves of the RPK. ISIS is trying to loot the place and destroy religious relics. Iran still says the destruction of Israel is a must. Hezbollah is their proxy, but with Russia helping Iran set up shop in Syria? It becomes a new situation.

Russia was told when we were coming and how we would avoid Russian targets. Who is responsible for the constant use of CBWs in Syria? If one thinks about it long enough, it becomes more than Assad.
 
We did not go to war over a few people being killed. We destroyed anything that had anything to do with the use of CBWs.....except, of course, those using them.
 
James said:
He did. And he used them, on both his own people and the Kurds. Whilst I was against the Iraq war, he was a psychotic killer, detested by his people.
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My point is they found nothing. And Iraq had nothing to do with 911. So Iraq was a false war. The government lies to the American people. Bush Cheney and the whole lot should be water boarded to find out what they know. Every shady torture technique they used should be applied to them. Their false war has killed more civilians than if saadam was left alone. The Saudi s were responsible for the hi jackers. It's not Americans job to spread freedom. Freedom is earned not given. They are using these wars to keep the economy going. War is good business. Plus you can sell the country you bombed loans so they have to give up precious resources for worthless printed money. The American government tried that with the Native Americans. Tried to give them a chest of paper money and the chief would not take it and it started a fight. Because paper is worthless. And now with electronic currency you don't even have paper. All your money can be stolen electronically. They control everything. And we kid ourselves into believing they care about us. Katrina should never be forgotten. The government cannot help you. And to depend on them makes you a slave to anything they desire. They tell you what the news is. The media did everything they could to get h clinton elected some how they didn't get it done. But it was quite clear they were going for the dems. And with the way the republicans acted it shows me that they are working with the dems. They put on a good show. But screw us all behind closed doors. When pres O was in power the republicans went along with every spending increase and everything the dems threw at them. You don't trust the man on the street but you trust government? That is a fools folly. And one the American public will pay the price for in the end. They care nothing about you your just a tax paying unit.
 
Y'all are worried about chemicals, meanwhile nanotech super virus's are being developed that can wipe out the planet and are held in "secure" places

:lol::IAMRAGE:
 
James said:
I think you mean WMD not chemical weapons.
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A weapon of mass destruction is a nuclear, radiological, chemical, biological or other weapon that can kill and bring significant harm to a large number of humans or cause great damage to human-made structures (e.g., buildings), natural structures (e.g., mountains), or the biosphere. The scope and usage of the term has evolved and been disputed, often signifying more politically than technically.
 
We got all kinds of wmds hell were the only country to use a nuke against innocent civilians. Twice. This country of ours is more bad than good when it comes to how it treats its world neighbors. We have many transgressions that are just blindly ignored cause who wants to think about that shit when you can fuck do drugs drink go on vacation get new phones and all the other things we use to distract ourselves from the truth. America has lost its way. It needs to find its heart again.
 
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