[INFJ] Do Sensors make sense?

[Rferraris]

So do you find them confusing, or are you confused by them because they require you to communicate in a way that is difficult for you? (if they don't understand your analogies and require you to explain using a different approach)

Well this is why I created this.
I am sure it's my analogies.
But some people I'm finding I seem to understand better, and others just confuse me. I never knew about types or that people were different and had types. Call me stupid.
But trying to understand if others have discovered the same things.

To be honest, I find this entire topic confusing. I don't know how many sensors I've interacted with, but I don't find them confusing. I do find some of them confused by my speech, but that's another thing altogether. I like to think I'm a mixed kid, somewhat of half-sensor, half-intuitive, cousin to the ambivert. Maybe for that reason I can get along with both relatively decently. But, also, like [MENTION=2240]rawr[/MENTION] pointed out, they tend to be direct and communicate in a manner that lays it out there. That's much easier than trying to figure out the indirect, layered brain of an intuitive, imo.

I appreciate the direct approach, but it the intolerance for the way I say stuff that frustrates me I guess.

Anyway, I think clarity in communication relies to a much greater extent on things like intelligence, cognitive organization, honesty, consistency of expression, etc. And sometimes it comes down to personal differences, cultural understandings, etc.

If you are having trouble communicating with an entire group of people whom other intuitives understand, then perhaps it would be helpful to learn to communicate with them in a manner that's effective and fulfilling.

Not sure who is what type and what their experience is. That's why I asked.
But seems to have set people off. So it must be me.

 

[Soulful]

Well this is why I created this.
I am sure it's my analogies.
But some people, and I'm finding I seem to understand better, and others just confuse me. I never knew about types or that people where different and had types. Call me stupid.
But trying to understand if others have discovered the same things.



I appreciate the direct approach, but it the intolerance for the way I say stuff that frustrates me I guess.




Not sure who is what type and what their experience is. That's why I asked.
But seems to have set people off. So it must be me.

I think people are ignited by the generalization of sensors that you've employed here.

I'm sure you're intelligent, but perhaps it might help to clarify for yourself what it is you are trying to say before you communicate it. Tbh, I actually find your posts confusing sometimes, like the first verse in this quote -- imo, it's not very clear at all. I don't know if the reason is due to a difference in our cognitions, or whether it is generally unclear.

 

[Rferraris]

The conversation depends on the person and the topic at hand. No I can't just randomly hold a conversation about something I know nothing about. I don't need to exaggerate my ignorance on the topic; however if it is something I find interesting I will engage, listen and learn. I don't typically speak in metaphors, but have been known to do so in order to convey an overall "feeling". My ISTJ husband is not receptive of metaphors, but that doesn't make him "simple minded." It just means he'd rather have the the quick factual version, rather than the monologue. I think it's quite possible he gets lost in the long version ... where the main topic becomes portrayed as several topics. You have to remember that sensors are very detail oriented ... they will see every tree in the forest before they see the forest.

Actually didn't know that. I think I'm trying to understand if people that are the way you are explaining them tend to be S types. But to your point if you talk in monologues and the other person three word sentences, then there's likely to be a problem.

Not sure I talk in monologues, but usually more than three word sentences
Maybe it has nothing to do with them being an S type. And so the answer to my question is no, you don't have the problem I am having. I just get frustrated with some people and I'm not getting closer to figuring out how to work with them.

I wouldn't suggest people that talk in three word sentences are simple minded. I'd even go as far as to say they might get it without all the extra noise. But I still feel richer having a longer conversation.

I think the real question before you make assumptions about all sensors is how often are you exposed to them? Are you exposed to many people on a regular basis or are we just talking about a couple of the same people over and over? You can't gain experience on how to communicate with others if you don't allow yourself to experience others. This is really the bottom line and it has nothing to do with MBTI.

I'm around a lot of people all the time.
No way of knowing who is what type.
But if you tried to type someone else, how would you do it. Probably start be trying to point out a behavior or a characteristic. I was hoping I was honing in on something. But maybe looking for MBTI to help is a stupid idea. And then maybe it's not

 

[Rferraris]

I think people are ignited by the generalization of sensors that you've employed here.

I'm sure you're intelligent, but perhaps it might help to clarify for yourself what it is you are trying to say before you communicate it. Tbh, I actually find your posts confusing sometimes, like the first verse in this quote -- imo, it's not very clear at all. I don't know if the reason is due to a difference in our cognitions, or whether it is generally unclear.

Wish I understood what it is I said that was unclear or confusing. And interesting you say that about a lot of my posts. I also think its interesting that the generalization got people going. To me it like I asked if you liked cats or got along with dogs better.

 

[Majesty]

I'm around a lot of people all the time.
No way of knowing who is what type.
But if you tried to type someone else, how would you do it. Probably start be trying to point out a behavior or a characteristic. I was hoping I was honing in on something. But maybe looking for MBTI to help is a stupid idea. And then maybe it's not

No that's not the problem.

You read the description of Intuition vs Sensing in some lame biased website.They tell you that you have shiny rainbows N types: intelligent, creative, clever, awesome, intelligent, deep, able to understand everything, etc.

And then, you have *gulp*sensor*gulp* types. Boring, dumb, listens to Justin Bieber.

You, little person who doesn't like boring and stupid people, gets that *aaaaahhh thank you jesus* feeling. Finally there is an explaination! You are part of the privilegied society of the intuitives! Yay!!! And all those sensor types suck!! They must burn!! Yay!! Ponies!!

And thats REALLY common. People will get into those little groups of people who think they're superior because they tested as an intuitive on an internet test.

Just take a look at the types: INFJ = Mystical psychic who's awesome and intelligent and stuff. ISFJ = House lady who failed elementary school. Which one will you chose? Yeah. Which is why so many people mistype. You could be one of those.

That's not how MBTI is meant to be used (i think ).


Actually the real difference between N and S types is simply wether you're a Ni/Se or Ne/Si (N) or Se/Ni or Si/Ne (S). And there begins your journey to begin a true Warrior of the MBTI.


note: i'm entp this is why this post make no sense (see! this is not reserved to sensors!)

 

[Rferraris]

No that's not the problem.

You read the description of Intuition vs Sensing in some lame biased website.They tell you that you have shiny rainbows N types: intelligent, creative, clever, awesome, intelligent, deep, able to understand everything, etc.

I really didn't read about it much at all.

And then, you have *gulp*sensor*gulp* types. Boring, dumb, listens to Justin Bieber.

You, little person who doesn't like boring and stupid people, gets that *aaaaahhh thank you jesus* feeling. Finally there is an explaination! You are part of the privilegied society of the intuitives! Yay!!! And all those sensor types suck!! They must burn!! Yay!! Ponies!!

Really. I never thought I was better than anyone. And you're right I don't like boring or stupid people. But I wasn't calling anybody boring or stupid. If S types are boring and stupid, then I'm sure I won't like them.

And thats REALLY common. People will get into those little groups of people who think they're superior because they tested as an intuitive on an internet test.

Wow this seems over the top.
I'm not in any group. And I don't think I'm superior to any other type because I'm intuitive.
But you seem to have a lot of experience here. So I guess people put a lot into online tests. But I don't need a test to tell me who I am and what things about me are better because I've worked hard at it my whole life. But being initiative doesn't sound like a reason to get excited. I mean we all have intuition I think. Jmo

Just take a look at the types: INFJ = Mystical psychic who's awesome and intelligent and stuff. ISFJ = House lady who failed elementary school. Which one will you chose? Yeah. Which is why so many people mistype. You could be one of those.

Sorry but this us kinda funny.
Think that's putting too much into INFJ.
And you could be right. I could have tested wrong.

That's not how MBTI is meant to be used (i think ).


Actually the real difference between N and S types is simply wether you're a Ni/Se or Ne/Si (N) or Se/Ni or Si/Ne (S). And there begins your journey to begin a true Warrior of the MBTI.


note: i'm entp this is why this post make no sense (see! this is not reserved to sensors!)

Your post makes sense. Thank you.

 

[Honey]

They confuse the hell out of me. I think it's because they seem so confused themselves. Do any INFJs have a hard time understanding Sensors? Do they make you want to run and hide and not see them anymore.

I understand sensors pretty well overall I think, and I do not detect that they are more confused than intuitives in general. I sometimes get along with sensors far better than I get along with certain intuitive types.

 

[knight in battle]

They confuse the hell out of me. I think it's because they seem so confused themselves. Do any INFJs have a hard time understanding Sensors? Do they make you want to run and hide and not see them anymore.

Sensors are charming people. They're straight with me. They communicate every word, except perhaps in the case of my ESTP acquaintance, who hardly talks at all, and even if he does talk, he's rather whispery about it. My ISFJ is so verbally communicative; it's amazing. My ISFP may be too quiet or too talkative, but he doesn't fail at communicating.

Intuitives - meh.

 

[Sriracha]

Just take a look at the types: INFJ = Mystical psychic who's awesome and intelligent and stuff. ISFJ = House lady who failed elementary school. Which one will you chose? Yeah. Which is why so many people mistype. You could be one of those.

note: i'm entp this is why this post make no sense (see! this is not reserved to sensors!)

Thumbs down. That was really a nasty thing to say (regardless if you were trying to be funny.)

 

[Lexika]

Well this is why I created this.
I am sure it's my analogies.
But some people, and I'm finding I seem to understand better, and others just confuse me. I never knew about types or that people where different and had types. Call me stupid.
But trying to understand if others have discovered the same things.

Try taking a look at cognitive functions behind the types:

INFJ's functions are Ni,Fe,Ti,Se

This means that INFJ will understand those types better who also use these functions.

Then if you take a look at all the S-types, you will see that ESTP, ISTP, ESFP, ISFP, ESFP share some of those functions with INFJ. Types that have no functions in common are ESTJ and ISTJ. xSTJs value Si,Te,Ne,Fi - so not a single function in common. Therefore INFJs are likely to have most communication problems with these two types, as many INFJs report having issues with the ESTJs. In socionics INFJ-ESTJ (IEI-LSE) relationship is called relations of conflict.

 

[barbad0s]

1) @Rferraris I have a hard time understanding you a lot of the time. It took me a while to get used to your writing and communication style on here. Your cadence, and the things that you feel are acceptable to say seem a little out of the ordinary. I think the way you communicate is unusual even for an INFJ. I have actually noticed that you've improved, but I remember when you first joined, many of your posts were quite the clusterfucks of words and it was pretty incoherent.

2) I don't think @Rferraris 's question is a big deal. Sure, the sensor vs. intuitive thing is a tired topic on MBTI discussion forums and it gets people's buttholes all tightened up at the first whiff of it, but that doesn't mean you guys need to all gang up on the poor guy and be all "wtf is wrong with you" (this kind of Fe group behaviour makes me want to throw up). He seemed to be genuine and without ill intention in his inquiry. It was asking for people to share their personal experiences and is really not that stupid of a question. And besides, everyone has to admit they're at least a little bit MBTI racist sometimes.

 

[knight in battle]

Try taking a look at cognitive functions behind the types:

INFJ's functions are Ni,Fe,Ti,Se

This means that INFJ will understand those types better who also use these functions.

Then if you take a look at all the S-types, you will see that ESTP, ISTP, ESFP, ISFP, ESFP share some of those functions with INFJ. Types that have no functions in common are ESTJ and ISTJ. xSTJs value Si,Te,Ne,Fi - so not a single function in common. Therefore INFJs are likely to have most communication problems with these two types, as many INFJs report having issues with the ESTJs. In socionics INFJ-ESTJ (IEI-LSE) relationship is called relations of conflict.

I do not consider INFJs Sensors. While they may share functions with and understand/communicate well with ISFJs, for instance, but they are Inferior Sensors, whereas ENFJs are Tertiary Sensors, or what I would term Partial-Sensors.

As such, INFJs delude themselves in thinking they are able to understand ISFJs on a Sensory level or Sensor·dom in general. ENFJs are actually better positioned to understand Sensors, whereas INFJs better positioned to understand Thinkers.

***

Only INFJs who are weak feelers are Relations of Conflict with ESTJs. (INFp - ESTj / IEI - LSE). (MBTI-Socionics Conversion). Otherwise, they are INFjs and are Dual Relations with ESTJs. (INFj - ESTj / EII - LSE).

 

[Shaqie]

Well according to Sensors, Initiatives make no sense, sometimes.
But on the topic, well depends on the person with whom you talk to. I have met a lot of sensors that make a lot of sense, so I can not say that the can't.

 

[knight in battle]

Well according to Sensors, Initiatives make no sense, sometimes.
But on the topic, well depends on the person with whom you talk to. I have met a lot of sensors that make a lot of sense, so I can not say that the can't.

Technically, only Introverted Sensors make no sense. Si and Ni are irrational functions, whereas Se and Ne are rational functions.

 

[Lexika]

I do not consider INFJs Sensors. While they may share functions with and understand/communicate well with ISFJs, for instance, but they are Inferior Sensors, whereas ENFJs are Tertiary Sensors, or what I would term Partial-Sensors.

As such, INFJs delude themselves in thinking they are able to understand ISFJs on a Sensory level or Sensor·dom in general. ENFJs are actually better positioned to understand Sensors, whereas INFJs better positioned to understand Thinkers.

You are forgetting to mention the orientation of sensing functions, which is very important. ENFJs like INFJs also value Se which means that they will also understand Se-sensing types better. Just like INFJs they have frequent misunderstandings with ESTJs and ISTJs.

 

[Tin Man]

They confuse the hell out of me. I think it's because they seem so confused themselves. Do any INFJs have a hard time understanding Sensors? Do they make you want to run and hide and not see them anymore.

I think I understand your problem. First turn on tv, do the people on it seem to be saying crazy confusing things. Ah I though so, next read a newspaper, is it all a random stream of nonsense? If so then you're actually living in a foreign country where you don't understand the language.

It's actually a common problem, you walk onto a plane or ship without realising it and then a few hours later people are speaking gibberish. It's either this or you're an idiot.

 

[88chaz88]

You're either an idiot or you converse solely with idiots.

 

[Majesty]

Thumbs down. That was really a nasty thing to say (regardless if you were trying to be funny.)

Noooo. I was talking about the stereotypes about types. Just take a look at all those people (like the thread starter) who tend to think that intuitives are magical smart etc. and that sensors are dumb and boring (hence the houselady). Heck even my mom got offended when I tried to show her an ISFJ description lol.

Thats what I meant. Hope its clear.

 

[Rferraris]

Noooo. I was talking about the stereotypes about types. Just take a look at all those people (like the thread starter) who tend to think that intuitives are magical smart etc. and that sensors are dumb and boring (hence the houselady). Heck even my mom got offended when I tried to show her an ISFJ description lol.

Thats what I meant. Hope its clear.

I'm not sure if ur referring to me. The thread starter. If so, not sure where you got they idea said anything about intuitives being magical and sensors stupid. Pretty sure I didn't say that.

 

[Rferraris]

You're either an idiot or you converse solely with idiots.

Thank you for your useless comment