Dreaded INTP falls hard for INFJ

mintoots said:
Yes, yes. You will live. This sucks. Men suck. Grrr.
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everybody sucks sometimes. But yeah in this case. (Realizes I’m some In some sappy nauseating Justifications to idealize his actions and make excuses for him so I can like him again. That sounds like some co-dependent shit right there. I am going to go through this cycle a few times. It is unhealthy for me to stay in contact with him.)

* wonders if I have encountered a covert narcissist. I’m being gaslit like a motherfucker. Damn.
 
Dopamine said:
everybody sucks sometimes. But yeah in this case. (Realizes I’m some In some sappy nauseating Justifications to idealize his actions and make excuses for him so I can like him again. That sounds like some co-dependent shit right there. I am going to go through this cycle a few times. It is unhealthy for me to stay in contact with him.)
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Don't be too hard on yourself. You're going through these motions healthily.
 
If there is a narcissist within 50 ft of me- it’s a fucking curse. I find these people everywhere. I really don’t understand. I don’t know if he is but stuff is starting to work out in my mind and I am absolutely being gaslit. 100%.

yuck. Listen- I know it’s tough sometimes being an INFJ but being an INTP is no pretty pony pirate parade.

(y’all should not have told me about edit tool- it really inspires added facilities for continuous rant)

yeah. I’m not crazy. We talked about this. We didn’t say the words but I was there he absolutely led me on or switch gears hard. But- there is a small consolation here. He’s on a dating AP. He does not know how to do that smoothly. The Internet Universe is going to dole out karma. Hard. He’s gonna pull this stunt with a crazy bitch eventually. It’s inevitable.

*recognizes faint Kubler Ross rapid cycling of stages of grief.

greif? Really? Gross.

How do you people stand it? HOW? How do you run around feeling your feelings all of the time? this is horrible. I do not understand.
 
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Awww {{hugs}}. Yeah, you sound like you’re under a ton of pressure with your work, both in terms of output demand and moral conscience. For what it’s worth, I appreciate what you’re doing trying to advance grappling with this crazy ass pandemic.

I’ve totally been where you are and it’s really hard to stay open when there’s not a lot to hold onto. And if you’re stressed, have a lot on your mind and not a ton of emotional energy, ofc your tolerance for the unknown is going to be limited.

You guys are still talking, so that’s positive. He knows what you need, so like you said, it’s a matter of where he’s at emotionally and whether he’s ready to take that step towards you. It’s probably good you have your guard up.

Edit: Ok, I just read your follow-on posts. If you were lead to believe you two were exclusive, and then he says he wants to see other women, then yeah, I’d say no to that.
 
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Dopamine said:
You are likely not wrong. On any points. I assumed it because early on we talked about what we were looking for and wanted. I probably projected some on him what that meant to me. I may have missed some clues.
We spent so much time and energy on each other, it just wasn’t conceivable that he was with other people too. Who can do that?? I don’t want to portray him as a bad person, he absolutely is not in any way. I think he just has a way he thinks his dating life needs to be and wasn’t clear enough about it to me.
It is also true that I have an extremely hard time feeling personally safe with other people as my true self. It’s very hard for me. He made me feel safe in the space between us and on a very unfortunate day with crazy stuff going on, it felt like he ripped that rug out from under my feet. I am positive that he had absolutely no intention of doing that. But it happened none the less. I just felt really safe with him, and now I feel really unsure about whether or not I can trust myself to see him clearly. Not trusting my own ability to recognize someone who will devastate me is a big problem for me. The bigger problem is actually knowing for a fact I can’t trust myself because I have been wrong in really REALLY painful ways.
He has kept in touch, but it’s just different now. I feel like I have to keep a distance. I was blindsided. And I think you are right that he felt instinctively that he had done something wrong. I told him he hadn’t really, but that being more clear early on would have been helpful. We are more guarded than before, unfortunately he’d likely have to bridge the distance for us. I’m too scared of it now. He won’t. I don’t think I meant quite enough to him for that effort. I wouldn’t expect him to. Not for someone that he didn’t know THAT well, and to be fair the other women are probably just easier than an overburdened complex scientist INTP. That and he is likely just hanging around because he feels bad that I was hurt.
It’s better probably for me to give up and slink back into my shadow and let men who don’t try to understand me (or can’t) pursue me. Those relationships leave a big emptiness inside of me but, they also like me better. You guys might understand that, I’m not sure, but being an odd person isn’t always fun. The old “you might not get what you want, but you can get what you need.”
Reading about INFJs, if he felt burned by all of this somehow, it’s kinda hopeless anyway. It is just a sad thing for me.

boo hoo. I’ll live. The “F“ function sucks.
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I definitely don't think that finding someone who understands you is an unobtainable goal. People who don't make the effort should be filtered out as white noise. However, it can take quite some time to get on the same page with someone. Essentially any healthy relationship romantic or otherwise is like a journey into the other person's mind over time. So it's not unreasonable and not impossible to do.

I do get the handicap of being an INTP (obviously). It has its own unique difficulties for sure.

Again at the risk of getting too personal i'd like to ask where you to typically go to search for potential partners. Do you do the dating sites thing or the pub or just roll the dice with people at work? What types of people do you pursue and why?
 
I started dating again after a long time of not dating. 7ish years. Grad school- life. I am a different person now so I have tried to keep an open mind about the type of person I would be compatible with. I am a strange person with an insane life story. Not a hugely tragic one, but there has been a lot. I’m a very difficult match. I do not look on the outside like my personality. I do not look my age nor do I look like a scientist- I hear it all of the time. I look like airplane nose art from the 40s. I’m not complaining but it has some big downsides. I attract a pretty typical type of man. Successful and or wealthy and pathologically narcissistic. It doesn’t matter where I meet them- it’s always them. I know that this is due to a flaw in my approach. I don’t really want to hash it out right here. That’s a lot of exposure when I’m already feeling pretty vulnerable. It’s ok to ask but not right now.
 
Dopamine said:
I started dating again after a long time of not dating. 7ish years. Grad school- life. I am a different person now so I have tried to keep an open mind about the type of person I would be compatible with. I am a strange person with an insane life story. Not a hugely tragic one, but there has been a lot. I’m a very difficult match. I do not look on the outside like my personality. I do not look my age nor do I look like a scientist- I hear it all of the time. I look like airplane nose art from the 40s. I’m not complaining but it has some big downsides. I attract a pretty typical type of man. Successful and or wealthy and pathologically narcissistic. It doesn’t matter where I meet them- it’s always them. I know that this is due to a flaw in my approach. I don’t really want to hash it out right here. That’s a lot of exposure when I’m already feeling pretty vulnerable. It’s ok to ask but not right now.
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The price of being a catch: attracting everyone and everyone is a weirdo. Success and wealth are the best masks. They must have something put together.
 
Dopamine said:
thank you. I’m not wanting to be shitty- I just can’t.
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You're fine. It's just hard to give advice that is accurate and not generic without it getting personal. So although I can respect your need for privacy I hope you can respect that there's not going to be a lot of surgical precision in my helping you with solving this problem. Nobody's fault, just the way it is unfortunately.

After lockdown is over I suggest seeing a therapist and asking for help with spotting malevolent people. Also working through any personal trauma you might have could be greatly beneficial. I can't know what would be best for you though, insufficient information as i said.
 
Wyote said:
The price of being a catch: attracting everyone and everyone is a weirdo. Success and wealth are the best masks. They must have something put together.
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sure they do! Generally attractive too. But they want to date me so that they have a fun companion they can “spoil” (ugg barf), be entertained by, and show off to their friends. They don’t try to know me. It’s like they are buying a car. They love that I’m a scientist because it impresses their friends. Not because I’m actually trying to do something good here. It’s REALLY lonely. And I’m not that person at all. I want a friend. I don’t want some sugar daddy who will expect me to be available god knows when to entertain him. It’s gross.
 
Dopamine said:
sure they do! Generally attractive too. But they want to date me so that they have a fun companion they can “spoil” (ugg barf), be entertained by, and show off to their friends. They don’t try to know me. It’s like they are buying a car. They love that I’m a scientist because it impresses their friends. Not because I’m actually trying to do something good here. It’s REALLY lonely. And I’m not that person at all. I want a friend. I don’t want some sugar daddy who will expect me to be available god knows when to entertain him. It’s gross.
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You know the signs, you just gotta learn to exit earlier
 
I have. So when I see it I bail. But back to the original point, I’m not sure I know exactly what would be good for me so I am trying to keep an open mind. I’m not sure being completely understood by someone matters. Being a trophy is disgusting- but having a friend who doesn’t always get you but makes an effort to be there for you and offers something that feels good and safe- better. I don’t want a soulmate. Nothing but trouble.
 
Dopamine said:
I have. So when I see it I bail. But back to the original point, I’m not sure I know exactly what would be good for me so I am trying to keep an open mind. I’m not sure being completely understood by someone matters. Being a trophy is disgusting- but having a friend who doesn’t always get you but makes an effort to be there for you and offers something that feels good and safe- better. I don’t want a soulmate. Nothing but trouble.
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Have you had a 'soulmate' before?

If so, how did that go?
 
Dopamine said:
I have. So when I see it I bail. But back to the original point, I’m not sure I know exactly what would be good for me so I am trying to keep an open mind. I’m not sure being completely understood by someone matters. Being a trophy is disgusting- but having a friend who doesn’t always get you but makes an effort to be there for you and offers something that feels good and safe- better. I don’t want a soulmate. Nothing but trouble.
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The idea of soulmates is nice, and there are certainly people in the world that we immediately resonate with.
But a real soul-partner is something that is built.
I could elaborate a lot more, but I think you are on a good track with your thinking already.
 

2 points I think are relevant here:
1 - Your parents, who are your first exposure to love, give you a mixed bag of experiences that you then associate with love, even though lots of those interactions are negative.
When someone doesn't "feel right" he says, it's because "We are out to find partners who feel familiar...we are on a quest to suffer in ways that feel familiar."
2 - None of us are perfect. We are imperfect human beings who fall in love with other imperfect human beings. Real life and real people don't match up with the Disney type of love we see on screen etc. Not that I think anybody here is that naive. But still, our early impressions of what love is supposed to look like are very ingrained in us. Doesn't mean we are doomed. But maybe there is a different way to approach "love" that will leave us all happier. He explores that in more depth...
 
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hithere said:

2 points I think are relevant here:
1 - Your parents, who are your first exposure to love, give you a mixed bag of experiences that you then associate with love, even though lots of those interactions are negative.
When someone doesn't "feel right" he says, it's because "We are out to find partners who feel familiar...we are on a quest to suffer in ways that feel familiar."
2 - None of us are perfect. We are imperfect human beings who fall in love with other imperfect human beings. Real life and real people don't match up with the Disney type of love we see on screen etc. Not that I think anybody here is that naive. But still, our early impressions of what love is supposed to look like are very ingrained in us. Doesn't mean we are doomed. But maybe there is a different way to approach "love" that will leave us all happier. He explores that in more depth...
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"Compatibility is an achievement of love"
"In choosing them, we compromise. Compromising is noble."
 
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