For Women

[JennyDaniella]

Oh mi gah!! This is the most cutest thing everrrrr!!

 

[flower]

Okay.
I've been wanting to contribute to this thread, but I've been scared. But.. I think perhaps sharing my story would be helpful to someone else going through the same thing, so I decided to just go for it, even though it won't be easy.
Like others here have shared, I am also a survivor of abuse and assault. About a year an a half ago I was raped by a complete stranger. I've never even uttered the words ''I was raped,'' not even in writing.. I would use some other terms to describe the event, but I have found a wonderful counselor and I am making great strides in recovering. I have accepted that this happened to me. I'm not afraid of men anymore. I go running outside. I live alone and I'm not paranoid at every moment. I never thought this would be the case for me again. I have PTSD but I know that if I keep going to therapy and just trying I will continue to get better and better..

@soulareclipse , I really like the quotes you shared, and especially "You survived the abuse. You're going to survive the recovery."
I tell myself that all the time! thank you for being so open!

I would really like to turn my trauma into something positive. i would like to help other people somehow who have been raped or abused [women AND men alike].. I think even just talking about our experiences can make other feel less alone. No one ever talks about what happens after. That was almost more traumatic for me. Having to go to the hospital, getting stitches, getting tested for diseases every couple of months, etc.. I just really don't want anyone to go through this alone.

Thank you to everyone in this thread who shared their experiences. I hope you guys all know that I am always, always here for you. you can message me any time.

Omg... I'm so so so sorry you've had to go through something so utterly horrible and scary! I'm very glad you've found the inner strength and courage to push forward! ♥ I'm proud of you.

 

[neko]

Omg... I'm so so so sorry you've had to go through something so utterly horrible and scary! I'm very glad you've found the inner strength and courage to push forward! ♥ I'm proud of you.

Thank you so much, little flower! *hugs to you, too*
So glad to see you back here!

 

[flower]

Thank you so much, little flower! *hugs to you, too*
So glad to see you back here!

Glad to be here.

 

[Asa]

@neko - <3 <3 <3 ((((hugs))) I have tears reading your post. I'm so, so sorry this happened to you.
I am thankful you are moving forward in the healing process. It can be slow, and it can be a struggle, but forward is good.

Yes, the aftermath can be worse than the trauma for so many reasons.
It helped me heal to remember it was a crime, to compartmentalize.

I don't want to talk too much in case what I write triggers you in any way. I just want to send you love and healing. <3
I am here.

i'm determined to live life, have fun, and make people happy.

<3

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I had my first major trigger moment where I panicked and acted on that panic (my panic response is always flight) in many years two weeks ago. It surprised me. I have some habits and boundaries that I probably would not have otherwise.

Dear survivors, it does get better, and you will feel whole again, but there is always a chance that something could trigger you and that is OK. You will feel it for days, but you will also be "normal". It's a strange duality. You will live a full and happy life. This won't consume you. <3

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I do recommend self-defense classes because they are empowering.

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@RonjaRaeubertochter - Part of abuse is being "brainwashed" into thinking there is something wrong with you, or that you deserve it. There is nothing wrong with you and you do not deserve this. I hope you leave this situation, but if you do not leave yet, I understand and do not think less of you.

You need a different therapist. Your therapist should understand why you are laughing and that your laughter is not because you think what you are going through is "funny".

------------------

My position with trying to support survivors is that it's their fight, so I shouldn't pressure them to talk or anything, just be there if they do decide that talking is the best thing to do in the moment, and remember that they are not defined by something that happened to them. Would you say that this is generally the way to go or…?

Perfect.
Some don't like it when their support system is silent, so if you sense that the person you are sitting with is agitated by your silence, you may want to make a gentle statement of support and ask if they want to talk about it.

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@MoonFlier - I didn't mean to ignore you.

@Wyote @Gaze – I definitely agree that women failing to support each other (and being awful to each other) is an issue.

Some universities have programs set up specifically so that women are not left out in the cold after graduation. Those schools know that without ongoing female support many of their graduates (and potential supporters) will let their degrees go to waste as they're pressured into the lower paying, mediocre jobs that we fill without complaint as it is in our nature to do what has to be done to keep the family/organization running.

This support system is amazing. It makes me happy to know schools are taking this initiative.
It is so common for women to take low paying jobs when they are qualified for more.

The problems really come in when we look at the corporate cultures that are predominately populated by white male at the higher levels. Even a man of color feels the need to conform and work harder to stay and grow in their position, so a woman, colored or otherwise is at a severe disadvantage unless they put on the cold, tough attitude it takes to get anywhere. I've seen it over and over and over again (been through too many lay offs). Women in managerial roles will be particularly hard on women in the office as that is what they feel is expected, and on the flip side, they feel all women need that attitude to get anywhere (they actually think they're helping by being jerks).

Ugh. Yes. Some women think they have to be twice as tough as the men to play along with the men, and then they are even harder on other women. (Then everyone calls them bitches behind their backs.) Fair bosses who acknowledge workers' strengths are more effective.

I've had some "women being mean to each other" situations at work, but I don't work in the business, finance, or corporate worlds.
Do you have any thoughts on how to alleviate this issue?

 

[BritNi]

Women are pretty dang cool. I am an ardent supporter of women supporting women, as I unfortunately don't see it enough in my own life.
Except for my mother of course, who is an absolute saint.

@Wyote, you don't see it enough? Are the women you know unsupportive (of other women)?

It's not a question of location because I've witnessed it in and out of offices in many areas. I generally don't see women maintaining healthy relationships with one another both in and outside workplace settings.

This is not a blanket statement of all women by any means, as I've seen many go out of their way to support other women. But the norm seems to be women largely supporting men while leaving their women "friends" behind in various ways.

I know I'm a little late to this party, but I agree with @Wyote. I have seen more women backstab and tear each other apart than they should ever.

I'm also a great supporter of women lifting up each other. But, it seems that most look at eachother as some form of competition or threat. It's disgusting and I'm so tired of it. That's one thing that I enjoy about this forum. It seems like the women here love each other and support each other the way I wish they would in the real world.

I wrote a paper once, I may share it sometime. It was focused on patriarchy and why men stay on top. One of my reasons to support this was the fact that women tear each other down, constantly.

Let me say "each other" once more: each other. (Haha) Can I get a synonym? I SAID... CAN. I. GET. A. SYNONYM? (Lol).

I wish it would stop. Love eachother up. Goshdarndamnit.

 

[neko]

I know I'm a little late to this party, but I agree with @Wyote. I have seen more women backstab and tear each other apart than they should ever.

I'm also a great supporter of women lifting up each other. But, it seems that most look at eachother as some form of competition or threat. It's disgusting and I'm so tired of it. That's one thing that I enjoy about this forum. It seems like the women here love eachother and support eachother the way I wish they would in the real world.

I wrote a paper once, I may share it sometime. It was focused on patriarchy and why men stay on top. One of my reasons to support this was the fact that women tear eachother down, constantly.

I wish it would stop. Love eachother up. Goshdarndamnit.

i love u.

 

[BritNi]

i love u.

No. Me luves you so heckin much!

 

[neko]

No. Me luves you so heckin much!

i love it when you use doggo speak to me!!

 

[BritNi]

i love it when you use doggo speak to me!!

Ur doin me a blush. Heck.

 

[Wyote]

That's one thing that I enjoy about this forum. It seems like the women here love each other and support each other the way I wish they would in the real world.

Yayyyy!

I wish it would stop. Love eachother up. Goshdarndamnit.

Amen.

 

[Asa]

I know I'm a little late to this party, but I agree with @Wyote. I have seen more women backstab and tear each other apart than they should ever.

For the record, I agree with @Wyote, too. (As well as others who have posted about this issue.) When I asked Wyote, "...You don't see it enough? Are the women you know unsupportive (of other women)?" I was trying to get him to expand on his thoughts. I was not disagreeing.

I wrote a paper once, I may share it sometime. It was focused on patriarchy and why men stay on top. One of my reasons to support this was the fact that women tear each other down, constantly.

The primary reason women are this way with other women is because of institutionalized misogyny. It is caused by misogyny and being unequal, objectified, and belittled. We are valued for our appearances so some women are catty toward other attractive women. We compete for the token female slot(s) at work, so some women are mean to their perceived competition. We fall for the stereotyping about female genders and are otherist toward women because feminine traits are seen as weaker, or less desirable, and we try to say we "aren't like other women" because being unlike a woman is perceived as "better".We lash out at other women we perceive as a threat to our relationships, instead of addressing the men we are in relationships with whose actions make us insecure. Etc, etc, etc.
(I'm using "we" to refer to all people who identify as women, and don't exclude myself out of principal, but I am personally not this way with other women.)
At its core, this is not a women's problem, it is a misogyny problem. End misogyny, end inequality, and create a situation where women are valued as equal people, and a lot of this behavior will fade. Of course, there will always be people who are horrible to other people, so it wouldn't go away completely.
More opportunity for all people means more women will have chances for top spots at work and we will be playing an even field with all other candidates. Some people will be cutthroat with everyone, while others will realize lifting others up helps lift us up.
I do see how my life, career, friendships, etc, have been affected by misogyny, and I have had to deal with some issues with other women being "mean girls", yes. For the most part, as soon as I see this in another person I avoid them. If I can't avoid them I deliberately ignore the bitchiness. There are times when I should have clapped back, honestly, but my agenda is keeping the peace. I can be hellfire, sure, but I don't bring it out until there is a big problem or until the chance for peace has dissolved. I don't like it. It's embarrassing, and people are always taken aback by that dark streak in INFJs when we do show it. But... heh... if necessary.

In my subculture, which is male dominated, my friends and I organized a group to support women. We were inspired to start this group because someone was assaulted and the young girls were confused by the assertive actions of the older women. We realized we needed to create a network to keep women safe and united, so if something similar happened to a younger women she would have a network of support to turn to. We encouraged each other and supported each other. It helped our community and over time there was no need for the organized group anymore. The newer people in the (local) subculture have no idea a group like this ever existed or was needed. <3

Of course a lot of cutting women down comes from insecurity. Support, lifting each other up, encouragement, and opportunity help erase those insecurities. People who are more balanced and mentally and emotionally healthier are less likely to backstab, talk trash, etc, regardless of gender. With women, a lot of insecurity occurs because we are objectified, sexualized, overlooked for goals and experiences, and lack avenues for opportunities... and because, honestly, we aren't treated with respect or constructive love by those around us. If we give positivity to each other we have a chance at helping each other be strong and succeed.

 

[Wyote]

I was trying to get him to expand on his thoughts. I was not disagreeing.

I hope I expanded sufficiently. I know it was a little vague. I can think about it and add more if you need

 

[Asa]

hope I expanded sufficiently. I know it was a little vague. I can think about it and add more if you need

Oh, you did!
I was just clarifying because I didn't want people in this thread to think I lived on Saturn or something and had no idea what you were talking about. <3

 

[Wyote]

Oh, you did!
I was just clarifying because I didn't want people in this thread to think I lived on Saturn or something and had no idea what you were talking about. <3

You are like one of the smartest earthy wamenz of all yo

*disappears before getting in trouble with the wamenz*

 

[Ginny]

I read a book where it was mentioned that this institutionalised misogyny became a thing as women stopped teaching one another the ways of womanhood. So as men took over the lives of women, they also decided what it means to be a woman. It also said that some remnant is still there in the soul (or unconscious if you prefer) and that's how the present state came about.
I have found further evidence of it in a few videos and made a very long (and clumsy) post about it just a few days after this discussion started.

 

[Asa]

I read a book where it was mentioned that this institutionalised misogyny became a thing as women stopped teaching one another the ways of womanhood. So as men took over the lives of women, they also decided what it means to be a woman. It also said that some remnant is still there in the soul (or unconscious if you prefer) and that's how the present state came about.
I have found further evidence of it in a few videos and made a very long (and clumsy) post about it just a few days after this discussion started.

In some cases the ways of womanhood became illegal because these practices were associated with paganism and witchcraft, etc. The roles of women and women's work were considered 'lesser' in male dominated society, too.
It wasn't like women just gave up on themselves and womanhood as a whole. It was wrung out of them.

 

[Ginny]

In some cases the ways of womanhood became illegal because these practices were associated with paganism and witchcraft, etc. The roles of women and women's work were considered 'lesser' in male dominated society, too.
It wasn't like women just gave up on themselves and womanhood as a whole. It was wrung out of them.

Indeed. It is also through the path of witchcraft and paganism that I learned of it. And as such, I think it right to pass on the message as is being done here, so that we can support each other again the way that we used to. Except perhaps a little modernised

 

[neko]

gaze! i love this thread idea. thank you for sharing so much about yourself and being so open. i will contribute soon <3

um.. wow. i made this post awhile ago, but I realize now that I meant Asa [the starter of the thread], and not Gaze [still <3 you!] .. I'm sorry, @Asa !

 

[Asa]

Indeed. It is also through the path of witchcraft and paganism that I learned of it. And as such, I think it right to pass on the message as is being done here, so that we can support each other again the way that we used to. Except perhaps a little modernised

Yes! Absolutely! <3
That was sort of my path for learning this, too.

um.. wow. i made this post awhile ago, but I realize now that I meant Asa [the starter of the thread], and not Gaze [still <3 you!] .. I'm sorry, @Asa !

<3 Thank you.

And @Gaze is the cat's meow!