I feel this is quite ominous.

Albino animals are treated with a nose up. Injured creatures are shunned and attacked. What you saw was commonplace in the animal kingdom.

The child that is born different is likely bullied at school. What does that make us when we bully one that is different of our own?
 
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Rift Zone said:
Perhaps... Having 2 separate species attack in that fashion is most unusual indeed. Crows will eat eggs and chicks but I've never known them to show that type of aggression. Even stranger is the seagull.

These creatures don't know anything about human symbolism, they weren't making a political statement on our behalf, the we're reacting on a level we scarcely have access too. I have no idea what that was all about but I have the impression I should be thankful toward the crow and gull.
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Interesting...why are you thankful towards them?
 
say what said:
Interesting...why are you thankful towards them?
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I don't know enough about the situation to actually be thankful but I have suspicions that I would approve of their actions if I knew more about it. Why? Intuition, I guess. I've spent a lot of time in true wilderness. I know the natural world really, really well. The only thing I can really say about that interaction is they were acting in accordance with natural law. Thus, they have my support. I'm under the impression the birds were colored white as opposed to being white thanks to lack of coloration so I'm not certain about the albino factor mentioned by just me but just the same, they saw something... Inbreeding? Some type of genetic issue seems plausible. Who knows? -something. Either way, I trust the natural world more than the one we built for ourselves and if nature says there's something wrong with the church's birds then I believe it and I'm glad it was handled properly.
 
Rift Zone said:
I don't know enough about the situation to actually be thankful but I have suspicions that I would approve of their actions if I knew more about it. Why? Intuition, I guess. I've spent a lot of time in true wilderness. I know the natural world really, really well. The only thing I can really say about that interaction is they were acting in accordance with natural law. Thus, they have my support. I'm under the impression the birds were colored white as opposed to being white thanks to lack of coloration so I'm not certain about the albino factor mentioned by just me but just the same, they saw something... Inbreeding? Some type of genetic issue seems plausible. Who knows? -something. Either way, I trust the natural world more than the one we built for ourselves and if nature says there's something wrong with the church's birds then I believe it and I'm glad it was handled properly.
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This is from National Geographic
Why did the crow and the gull attack the doves? Because the doves were white. Thousands of pigeons (relatives of doves) live in Rome, as in most cities. They range in color from grayish to brownish to blackish and everything in between. Many other species of birds live in Rome as well, but none are pure white. So if you're an aggressive, badass bird (as gulls and crows tend to be), what's going to draw your attention? The pure-white bird. What's going to be the target of your aggression? The pure-white bird. There's a reason that albino birds (and other animals born without any color pigment) generally don't live long in the wild: They're easily seen, they can't hide, and predators single them out for attack.
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I never really considered the albino factor. I know it's extremely rare in nature- and they're considered by many spiritualist to be extremely sacred.

I like what you mention that they're not in accordance with natural law- it's an interesting perspective.

Again from NG:

Why were these doves white? Because white symbolizes peace, purity, serenity, and other good stuff. But here's the thing: There are no pure-white doves in the natural world. The ones that were released were the result of hundreds of years of domestication and breeding, creating these freakishly white birds for use as pets, and for release at weddings and other ceremonies.
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As for being sacred, many wild albinos are embraced in different cultures. Was fishing and saw a white deer on the bank for a second. Used the trolling motor to ease forward quickly enough for my partner to get a glimpse. We had been talking about my Mother who had recently passed on. It was where I hunt deer often. Never have seen it again. I dare say I prayed nobody would ever see it during hunting season, and know I would never shoot an albino deer. It was not a piebald.
 
just me said:
Albino animals are treated with a nose up. Injured creatures are shunned and attacked. What you saw was commonplace in the animal kingdom.

The child that is born different is likely bullied at school. What does that make us when we bully one that is different of our own?
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Non-human animals are on a totally different level than us.

S. d. personata, the Masked Booby (a bird lol) typically lays just two eggs. Only one chick of the two will survive - the stronger chick kicks the weaker one out of the nest, and the weaker is shunned and left to die.
 
blue-footed-booby_fb_2578727.jpg
 
Scientists consider and albino to be a genetic error, because they technically were the 'weaker' genetic through evolution and naturally became distinct (the idea that their colouring makes them easier prey makes sense). So, scientifically an albino animal would be considered 'weaker' and/or an error....however, culturally, they're considered spiritual representations!

It's so interesting that there's such a contrast!
 
sprinkles said:
Non-human animals are on a totally different level than us.

S. d. personata, the Masked Booby (a bird lol) typically lays just two eggs. Only one chick of the two will survive - the stronger chick kicks the weaker one out of the nest, and the weaker is shunned and left to die.
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Yes, we are on a different level. We never find babies alive in dumpsters and the likes. At least it is an exception to the rule.
 
just me said:
Yes, we are on a different level. We never find babies alive in dumpsters and the likes. At least it is an exception to the rule.
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Non-humans just do what they do. Humans think about shit and have moral compunctions.

Why is a dumpster even a thing to begin with? Should we even be having dumpsters to put babies in? Human question.

Animals don't seem to have this existential quagmire bullshit where they talk about the meaning of life and what's right or wrong, let alone bringing other species into the equation.
 
Yes, we are special. Saw a few pics and witnessed a raccoon at a park eating from trash cans, and a bear from a dumpster. They aren't stupid.

Some folk have been together for so long, they need not speak a lot.
 
just me said:
Yes, we are special. Saw a few pics and witnessed a raccoon at a park eating from trash cans, and a bear from a dumpster. They aren't stupid.

Some folk have been together for so long, they need not speak a lot.
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I think you're missing my point that moral aversion is probably not a thing for them.

When you talked about how crows gang up on owls? Maybe that's just how they are. Your apparent aversion to it is subjective to you.

The owl probably does not judge the crows. It probably just finds them a pest and wants to get away from them.

Edit: an owl will also probably snatch and eat a crow if it can. The crows mob the owl because they find the owl threatening.
 
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sprinkles said:
I think you're missing my point that moral aversion is probably not a thing for them.

When you talked about how crows gang up on owls? Maybe that's just how they are. Your apparent aversion to it is subjective to you.

The owl probably does not judge the crows. It probably just finds them a pest and wants to get away from them.
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I talked back and forth with that owl on some late evenings about two years before he came to a tree to nest about 40' from my house. I took it personal.

Fed the main crow months earlier less than a mile away a small pecan. He immediately started building a nest and his family ruined years of preparations for the wild geese and the owl. Mad at myself, also. I don't shoot eagles, falcons, hawks, and the likes....just run them off. These guys want to run the neighborhood and I let them. To me, I have seen their nature and only the dominant male needs to go. The rest will leave.
 
just me said:
I talked back and forth with that owl on some late evenings about two years before he came to a tree to nest about 40' from my house. I took it personal.

Fed the main crow months earlier less than a mile away a small pecan. He immediately started building a nest and his family ruined years of preparations for the wild geese and the owl. Mad at myself, also. I don't shoot eagles, falcons, hawks, and the likes....just run them off. These guys want to run the neighborhood and I let them. To me, I have seen their nature and only the dominant male needs to go. The rest will leave.
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Did the owl tell you that owls raid crow nests and eat baby crows? Did the owl tell you that owls will eat just about any live meat they can catch and stuff in their face, including mammals, snakes, scorpions, small birds, crows, and some times other owls too?

Owls and crows have a balance. That's why they're both still around. They're mutually annoying to each other but that is how it works. Owl is hungry, some times eats a crow if it needs to. Crows want to live too.

Crows are obnoxious, annoying, and territorial, but that's how they manage to live.
 
sprinkles said:
Did the owl tell you that owls raid crow nests and eat baby crows? Did the owl tell you that owls will eat just about any live meat they can catch and stuff in their face, including mammals, snakes, scorpions, small birds, crows, and some times other owls too?

Owls and crows have a balance. That's why they're both still around. They're mutually annoying to each other but that is how it works. Owl is hungry, some times eats a crow if it needs to. Crows want to live too.

Crows are obnoxious, annoying, and territorial, but that's how they manage to live.
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...an exception to every rule...
 
May I ask a question? Why is it funny the crow attacked the dove, and not so funny I attack a crow? [MENTION=8332]isabellajay[/MENTION] and others
 
[MENTION=680]just me[/MENTION] I don't think either are funny. The crow and seagull attacking the dove is just a weird, somewhat unfortunate happenstance. Sad, but it's life. You can attack the crow if you want to. It just seems more cruelly intentioned rather than instinctive. I might be slightly biased because I love crows...and birds in general.
 
just me said:
May I ask a question? Why is it funny the crow attacked the dove, and not so funny I attack a crow? [MENTION=8332]isabellajay[/MENTION] and others
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The crow isn't the funny part. Humans are. The fact that the tradition got kinda wrecked by reality is kind of funny - the crows on the other hand are just being normal crows.

Also I don't want it to seem like I was arguing with you or anything. I was just saying that crows are not the bird equivalent of assholes that do things out of spite.
 
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