Idea of Peace, No peace at all

Naxx said:
As an idealist myself I wish the world would move past all of this and see the universe for what it is. See everything for what it is. To embrace truth to embrace not only themselves but everyone and everything.
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you wish the world to transcend the natural order? that in and of itself will amass chaos...tip the scales so to speak...
 
Entyqua said:
you wish the world to transcend the natural order? that in and of itself will amass chaos...tip the scales so to speak...
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I wish for what will likely happen one day. How ever long it takes is how ever long it takes; that is natural.
 
I agree that the nature of the universe is in the cycle of change. However, I see no rationale here for participating in destruction beyond the necessary minimum.

You go to war to stop an evil, confused or cruel tyrant, group or government from hurting those who need protection. You destroy or change the environment to improve the circumstances of those who actually need the improvement.

To do these acts for lesser reasons is unnecessary. Killing an ancient forest to save money on paper, leveling jungle so a land baron can profit on selling gourmet coffee while his workers struggle to survive on 'his' land, killing innocents because they don't conform to your social expectations.. these acts can't be forgiven because the perpetrator claims he is only complying with universal nature.
 
Solar Empath said:
I agree that the nature of the universe is in the cycle of change. However, I see no rationale here for participating in destruction beyond the necessary minimum.

You go to war to stop an evil, confused or cruel tyrant, group or government from hurting those who need protection. You destroy or change the environment to improve the circumstances of those who actually need the improvement.

To do these acts for lesser reasons is unnecessary. Killing an ancient forest to save money on paper, leveling jungle so a land baron can profit on selling gourmet coffee while his workers struggle to survive on 'his' land, killing innocents because they don't conform to your social expectations.. these acts can't be forgiven because the perpetrator claims he is only complying with universal nature.
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But yet these actions are indeed part of the universe, for it has happened and will.

A preference for a certain way of life is what drives people to "stop an evil, confused or cruel tyrant, group or government from hurting those who need protection. "

Is there anything that said anyone HAD to do anything? The bias against destruction is indeed largely due to the a living being's own existence is threatened by destruction; a survivalist point of view.
 
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Naxx said:
I wish for what will likely happen one day. How ever long it takes is how ever long it takes; that is natural.
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It cannot...there will never be utopia...its a myth...

I mean I dream of it...As much as the next idealist...I want it too...But at what cost?
 
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Entyqua said:
It cannot...there will never be utopia...its a myth...
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World Unity is not an utopia, people can be unified and will still have problems. It is all but another stage in existence.
 
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Naxx said:
Unity is not an utopia, people can be unified and will still have problems. It is all but another stage in existence.
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I can see that...but what your saying is still as it has always been, while more people can be unified, there will still be conflict...its just another way of saying what i have already said...

There can be no unity with out conflict
 
Entyqua said:
I can see that...but what your saying is still as it has always been, while more people can be unified, there will still be conflict...its just another way of saying what i have already said...

There can be no unity with out conflict
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Indeed so peace does not lead to true peace. Violence is not evil or vile. Evil and vile are labels people put on things that are against their deeply held beliefs.
 
Naxx said:
Indeed so peace does not lead to true peace. Violence is not evil or vile. Evil and vile are labels people put on things that are against their deeply held beliefs.
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those are merely descriptive words...Though I do believe in inerrant evil and inherent good. whatever forms they take...a man who hurts an innocent child...there is evil...A man who saves another from being hit by a bus...there is good...You cannot change the nature of an evil man, nor the nature of a good man...In all stages of evolution, you will have these types...
 
Entyqua said:
those are merely descriptive words...Though I do believe in inerrant evil and inherent good. whatever forms they take...a man who hurts an innocent child...there is evil...A man who saves another from being hit by a bus...there is good...You cannot change the nature of an evil man, nor the nature of a good man...In all stages of evolution, you will have these types...
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Indeed, so blaming the universe for these descriptions and natural occurrences is perhaps ignorance?

So what happens when whole religions decide to go against these descriptions?

My answer to that is nothing, it's all apart of it.
 
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Naxx said:
Indeed, so blaming the universe for these descriptions and natural occurrences is perhaps ignorance?
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I wouldnt say ignorance...I would say its a product of society. We need something to blame for this natural order, and who better than the universe, or god, or whatever deific entity you wish to call upon.
 
Entyqua said:
I wouldnt say ignorance...I would say its a product of society. We need something to blame for this natural order, and who better than the universe, or god, or whatever deific entity you wish to call upon.
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Why do you think we need to blame something?

Could it be because we need to in order to build up on ideas that will lead beyond this order?

And if we move beyond this wouldn't it all be part of it as well?
 
Naxx said:
Have you ever watched an innocent animal being slaughtered? Perhaps an Orca playing with the life of a baby seal for pure amusement?

What do you think about these two events, are they really so different?

Is the human life worth more than animal life? Is life itself worth more than non-life?

Or it is all a spiral of existence and events in the past, present, future and unknown?
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Yes I have, humans have a higher priority on my list. However, animal cruelty is something I would like to address once I am satisfied with the former.
 
NeverAmI said:
Yes I have, humans have a higher priority on my list. However, animal cruelty is something I would like to address once I am satisfied with the former.
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What does your list mean when everyone has lists of their own?

The list itself is sacred and special but also not.
 
Entyqua said:
ok..As idealists, we have a hard time understanding this, while I know its true...it still hurts a part of me when something like war, or famine, or poverty hits...I want to change it...but well refer to aforementioned post...
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Idealism and the desire for change has its place in the world as well. Don't be disheartened because destruction in all its forms has always and always will exist. People must fight for peace and prosperity to make sure that the balance in the world remains undisturbed. If people like you and I were to give up on our quest for relative harmony then chaos would engulf human life.

We cannot eliminate all pain and destruction but we can mitigate and temper it.
:m170:
 
Naxx said:
What makes your view better than my view? What makes my view better than your view?

Am I to blame the Orca for killing a baby seal out of entertainment? Am I to blame the universe for allowing the thought of violence?

Do I have the right and am I so enlightened to judge things beings for what they are?
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You have every right to judge beings for what they are. Your opinion is as relevant as my own.

Martin Luther King Jr. once said "We must speak with all the humility that is appropriate to our limited vision, but we must speak."

If you like, I can link the entire speech.
 
NeverAmI said:
You have every right to judge beings for what they are. Your opinion is as relevant as my own.

Martin Luther King Jr. once said "We must speak with all the humility that is appropriate to our limited vision, but we must speak."

If you like, I can link the entire speech.
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MLKJR was a great man but so am I and so are you.
 
Why do you think we need to blame something?
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I do not know why we feel we need to blame something, Personally I do not place blame on anything or anyone but the cause of the problem. Blame in and of it self is of the same constant...Humans feel the need to punish evil, and place blame. it has been so since the oldest histories.

Could it be because we need to in order to build up on ideas that will lead beyond this order?
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The order not finite...there will be no beyond...no matter what level of enlightenment the earths beings achieve, there will always be this order. It will just have a different name.

And if we move beyond this wouldn't it all be part of it as well?
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As I said it is not finite...the name will change but the idea will be the same
 
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Peace will never be achieved. As soon as one problem is solved, another will crop up.

However, I cannot stay silent while women and children are murdered due to apathy and deceit.

My list may not matter to anyone else, but I hope someday it will...
 
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