Jordan Peterson

Deleted member 16771 said:
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Pin said:
Most Americans are not as socially conservative (blatantly racist and sexist) as The GI Generation or The Silent Generation.

You've got your racial supremacists here and there, your religious traditionalists but that's not most people. Most Americans have their biases but I don't think they're prepared to actively bring back segregation or actively seek to kill ethnic, sexual, and gender minorities.

Contraception isn't going anywhere.
Roe v Wade (abortion rights) isn't going anywhere.
The Civil Rights Act isn't going anywhere.
The Voting Rights Act isn't going anywhere.

Conservative politicians talk big game, they'll deliver on economic issues to placate their donors but they're losing the public on social issues.

Gay marriage = Legal
Interracial Marriage = Legal
Abortion = Legal
Women Voting = Legal
Non-Property Owners Voting = Legal
Marijuana = We're working on it.


Historically speaking, the United States is gradually becoming a more socially progressive place with time. That said, it's a slow country to change compared to our more developed neighbors.
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You're hallucinating what conservatism is and what I mean Pin.
 
Pin said:
Most Americans have their biases but I don't think they're prepared to actively bring back segregation or actively seek to kill ethnic, sexual, and gender minorities.
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That's great news
Pin said:
Contraception isn't going anywhere.
Roe v Wade (abortion rights) isn't going anywhere.
The Civil Rights Act isn't going anywhere.
The Voting Rights Act isn't going anywhere.
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More good
Pin said:
Conservative politicians talk big game, they'll deliver on economic issues to placate their donors but they're losing the public on social issues.

Gay marriage = Legal
Interracial Marriage = Legal
Abortion = Legal
Women Voting = Legal
Non-Property Owners Voting = Legal
Marijuana = We're working on it.
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I'm pretty well plugged into conservative news and political commentary and i've never heard someone come out against any of these things so I have no idea where you're getting the idea that conservatives are largely against these things from. PBS must be cranking out a lot of hitpieces these days.
Pin said:
Historically speaking, the United States is gradually becoming a more socially progressive place with time. That said, it's a slow country to change compared to our more developed neighbors.
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X- Doubt
 
Reason said:
You're hallucinating what conservatism is and what I mean Pin.
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Well, I'm aware of what conservatism means in terms of orthodox political science. Edmund Burke is what I'm thinking of, Pro-monarchism versus not. For example, Burke opposed the French revolution. There's a lot to say in this respect.

However, in the American context it's less nuanced. Historically speaking, conservatives were in support of slavery, segregation, opposing the right of everyone to vote, etc.
 
Pin said:
Well, I'm aware of what conservatism means in terms of orthodox political science. Edmund Burke is what I'm thinking of, Pro-monarchism versus not. For example, Burke opposed the French revolution. There's a lot to say in this respect.

However, in the American context it's less nuanced. Historically speaking, conservatives were in support of slavery, segregation, opposing the right of everyone to vote, including women.
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All i'm thinking of and referring to is what is being said by conservatives in the modern era.
 
Reason said:
I'm pretty well plugged into conservative news and political commentary and i've never heard someone come out against any of these things so I have no idea where you're getting the idea that conservatives are largely against these things from. PBS must be cranking out a lot of hitpieces these days.
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Reason said:
All i'm thinking of and referring to is what is being said by conservatives in the modern era.
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You can't just act like historically conservatives haven't opposed those things lmao.
The party has changed drastically in a pretty short period of time.
 
Reason said:
All i'm thinking of and referring to is what is being said by conservatives in the modern era.
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I see.

Well, the most prominent conservatives I'm familiar with in terms of the modern American intellectual tradition are people like William F. Buckley, Milton Friedman,Thomas Sowell, and F.A Hayek.

In the UK... Peter Kitchens and Roger Scruton.

There's also an important distinction to make between the authoritarian-right and the libertarian-right. The common thread between these two strands of thought is the idea of what often justifies certain hierarchies (power, wealth, race, hereditary privilege, influence over market conditions, etc). This would be a cool idea to explore but it's quite shocking, at least in my opinion.
 
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But no I never said conservatives didn't have different views in the past.

The populist wing of the party is slowly eating away at the Bush era wing of the party. Soon it will the populists and not the establishment that's in control, that is if these trends continue.
 
Reason said:
But no I never said conservatives didn't have different views in the past.

The populist wing of the party is slowly eating away at the Bush era wing of the party. Soon it will the populists and not the establishment that's in control, that is if these trends continue.
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I have deep concerns about right-wing populism especially.

I also don't think that the populist wing of the Republican Party is very different from the Establishment Wing of the Republican Party with respect to socioeconomic policy and foreign policy. The only divide I've observed is with respect to the more trivial "culture war" issues.
 
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Pin said:
I have deep concerns about right-wing populism especially.

I also don't think that the populist wing of the Republican Party is very different from the Establishment Wing of the Republican Party with respect to socioeconomic policy and foreign policy. The only divide I've observed is with respect to the more trivial "culture war" issues.
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You need new sources, you're missing a lot of what's going on there. What kind of conservative outlets do you read or watch typically?
 
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