Possible solutions to the worlds problems

The jumps in logic here are astounding. This is NOT science.

Just for a moment ignoring the fact of the technicalities if the situation, the drone attacks were on foreign soil. It is of some of the highest illegality for the government to deploy military assets on American soil. This killing drones would likely never be a problem so long as America stands.

That food thing, it is important to note that California is NOT the only state in the country. MUCH more food is produced by other states than California alone. Admittedly California is a large food producer, but basic economic principle would suggest that if food growth became expensive or ineffective in California, we would simply find a cheaper alternative. Aka, perhaps we could grow food more inland? New farming technologies are increasing food production capability by a lot anyways. There's even talk of this new layered greenhouse skyscraper for growing massive amounts of food per land area. Food growth will likely never be a problem thanks to advances in technology. My favorite example of optimization today is the UAV allowed in the civilian markets. The technology is in its infancy and we can already increases yields greatly. With the next advancement of hyperspectral imaging so very close to our reach, we will be very efficient farmers.

These are just the two most recent cases. I'm not going to nit pick over all of your other statements. You make jumps of logic to make statements that sound convincing. You are very good at putting words together.
 
The jumps in logic here are astounding. This is NOT science.

Just for a moment ignoring the fact of the technicalities if the situation, the drone attacks were on foreign soil. It is of some of the highest illegality for the government to deploy military assets on American soil. This killing drones would likely never be a problem so long as America stands.

That food thing, it is important to note that California is NOT the only state in the country. MUCH more food is produced by other states than California alone. Admittedly California is a large food producer, but basic economic principle would suggest that if food growth became expensive or ineffective in California, we would simply find a cheaper alternative. Aka, perhaps we could grow food more inland? New farming technologies are increasing food production capability by a lot anyways. There's even talk of this new layered greenhouse skyscraper for growing massive amounts of food per land area. Food growth will likely never be a problem thanks to advances in technology. My favorite example of optimization today is the UAV allowed in the civilian markets. The technology is in its infancy and we can already increases yields greatly. With the next advancement of hyperspectral imaging so very close to our reach, we will be very efficient farmers.

These are just the two most recent cases. I'm not going to nit pick over all of your other statements. You make jumps of logic to make statements that sound convincing. You are very good at putting words together.

The National Defence Authorisation Act permits the US military to deploy on US soil

They are flying drones over US skies

The drone attacks carried out against targets on Obamas 'kill lists' have so far been abroad yes but they have been used against US citizens abroad; these attacks were carried out without a trial before hand. Also drones can have many applications for example spying

The government can't bring in all the changes it wants to bring in in one go because people will be too alarmed by that and will resist it so they bring in the changes bit by bit testing the water as they go and if the public don't resist each step then they keep going and they achieve their aims bit by bit (give an inch and they take a mile)

It's like boiling a frog. If you drop a frog into boiling water it will jump straight out but if you put a frog in cold water then boil the water the frog will slowly boil to death. The public is the frog and it is being slowly boiled

There is no 'jump in logic' here just a record of each step they are taking in the process of destroying the constitution and removing your civil liberties
 
The National Defence Authorisation Act permits the US military to deploy on US soil

They are flying drones over US skies

The drone attacks carried out against targets on Obamas 'kill lists' have so far been abroad yes but they have been used against US citizens abroad; these attacks were carried out without a trial before hand. Also drones can have many applications for example spying

The government can't bring in all the changes it wants to bring in in one go because people will be too alarmed by that and will resist it so they bring in the changes bit by bit testing the water as they go and if the public don't resist each step then they keep going and they achieve their aims bit by bit (give an inch and they take a mile)

It's like boiling a frog. If you drop a frog into boiling water it will jump straight out but if you put a frog in cold water then boil the water the frog will slowly boil to death. The public is the frog and it is being slowly boiled

There is no 'jump in logic' here just a record of each step they are taking in the process of destroying the constitution and removing your civil liberties

No. According to the Posse Comitatus act of 1878 (http://usgovinfo.about.com/gi/o.htm...tml/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00001385----000-.html), the military cannot deploy military assets on American soil unless they declare martial law which can only be declared by congress.

As for the NDAA (national defense authorization act), I don't know what NDAA your talking about. But the NDAA the government talks about (and I admit not to be an expert in any sense of the world, simply went to the site) its just a budget.

From google: The National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) is a federal law specifying the budget and expenditures of the United States Department of Defense (DOD). Each year's act also includes other provisions, some related to civil liberties.

The website itself: http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/ndaa-home?p=ndaa

I don't know where you are getting any information about military drones flying over the united states with the specific military operations intent as that is explicitly illegal.

"It's like boiling a frog. If you drop a frog into boiling water it will jump straight out but if you put a frog in cold water then boil the water the frog will slowly boil to death. The public is the frog and it is being slowly boiled"
This is a perfect example of where you are very good at putting words together. Makes it sound good. Really, there's no basis for your claim.
 
I don't even do politics. I don't like politics. They are very annoying to me. I'm just trying to meet your comments on a field I have no experience in.
 
No. According to the Posse Comitatus act of 1878 (http://usgovinfo.about.com/gi/o.htm...tml/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00001385----000-.html), the military cannot deploy military assets on American soil unless they declare martial law which can only be declared by congress.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jim-garrison/martial-law-under-another_b_1370819.html

President Obama's National Defense Resources Preparedness Executive Order of March 16 does to the country as a whole what the 2012 National Defense Authorization Act did to the Constitution in particular -- completely eviscerates any due process or judicial oversight for any action by the Government deemed in the interest of "national security." Like the NDAA, the new Executive Order puts the government completely above the law, which, in a democracy, is never supposed to happen. The United States is essentially now under martial law without the exigencies of a national emergency.
Even as the 2012 NDAA was rooted in the Patriot Act and the various executive orders and Congressional bills that ensued to broaden executive power in the "war on terror," so the new Executive Order is rooted in the Defense Production Act of 1950 which gave the Government powers to mobilize national resources in the event of national emergencies, except now virtually every aspect of American life falls under ultimate unchallengeable government control, to be exercised by the president and his secretaries at their discretion.
The 2012 NDAA deemed the United States a "battlefield," as Senator Lindsey Graham put it, and gave the president and his agents the right to seize and arrest any U.S. citizen, detain them indefinitely without charge or trial, and do so only on suspicion, without any judicial oversight or due process. The new Executive Order states that the president and his secretaries have the authority to commandeer all U.S. domestic resources, including food and water, as well as seize all energy and transportation infrastructure inside the borders of the United States. The Government can also forcibly draft U.S. citizens into the military and force U.S. citizens to fulfill "labor requirements" for the purposes of "national defense." There is not even any Congressional oversight allowed, only briefings.
In the NDAA, only the president had the authority to abrogate legitimate freedoms of U.S. citizens. What is extraordinary in the new Executive Order is that this supreme power is designated through the president to the secretaries that run the Government itself:
• The Secretary of Defense has power over all water resources;
• The Secretary of Commerce has power over all material services and facilities, including construction materials;
• The Secretary of Transportation has power over all forms of civilian transportation;
• The Secretary of Agriculture has power over food resources and facilities, livestock plant health resources, and the domestic distribution of farm equipment;
• The Secretary of Health and Human Services has power over all health resources;
• The Secretary of Energy has power over all forms of energy.
The Executive Order even stipulates that in the event of conflict between the secretaries in using these powers, the president will determine the resolution through his national security team.
The 2012 NDAA gave the Government the right to abrogate any due process against a U.S. citizen. The new Executive Order gives the government, through the Secretary of Labor, the right to proactively mobilize U.S. citizens for "labor" as the government deems necessary and to coordinate with the Secretary of Defense to maintain data to coordinate the nation's work needs in relation to national defense.
What is extraordinary about the Executive Order is that, like the NDAA, this can all be done in peacetime without any national emergency to justify it. The language of the Order does not state that all these extraordinary measures will be done in the event of "national security" or a "national emergency." They can simply be done for "purposes of national defense," clearly a broader remit that allows the government to do what it wants, when it wants, how it wants, to whomever it wants, all without any judicial restraint or due process. As Orwell famously said in 1984, "War is peace. Peace is war." This is now the reality on the ground in America.
Finally, the 2012 NDAA was hurried through the House and Senate almost like a covert op with minimal public attention or debate. It was then signed by the president at 9:00 PM on New Year's Eve while virtually nobody was paying attention to much other than the approaching new year. This new Executive Order was written and signed in complete secret and then quietly released by the White House on its website without comment. All this was done under a president who studied constitutional law at Harvard.
It is hard to know what to say in the face of such egregious disregard for the integrity of what America has stood and fought for since its founding. It is hard in part because none of us thought such encroachments would ever happen here, certainly not under the watch of a "progressive" like Obama.
At one level, the prospect for war with Iran is probably an immediate justification. But the comprehensiveness of the Executive Order, like that of the 2012 NDAA, speaks to something much deeper, more sinister. I would suggest that this Order, like the NDAA, has been in the works for some time and is simply the next step in the logic of the "global war on terror." Our political elites have come to consider democracy an impediment to effective governance and they are slowly and painstakingly creating all the democratic legalities necessary to abridge our democratic rights with impunity, all to ensure our "security." Of such measures do republics fall and by such measures tyrants emerge.
The only thing that really remains is the occasion to test the new rules of the game. Perhaps that will be war with Iran, perhaps some contrived emergency, or perhaps, as long as the public and media remain asleep, no occasion will be necessary at all. It will just slowly happen of its own accord and we, like the frog in the pot of slowly boiling water, will just sit there and be consumed by our own turpitude.

As for the NDAA (national defense authorization act), I don't know what NDAA your talking about. But the NDAA the government talks about (and I admit not to be an expert in any sense of the world, simply went to the site) its just a budget.

From google: The National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) is a federal law specifying the budget and expenditures of the United States Department of Defense (DOD). Each year's act also includes other provisions, some related to civil liberties.

The website itself: http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/ndaa-home?p=ndaa

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnew...ntion-without-trial-approved-by-appeals-court

[h=2]NDAA Indefinite Detention Without Trial Approved by Appeals Court[/h]
The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second District struck down an injunction against indefinite detention of U.S. citizens by the president under the National Defense Authorization Act of 2012 in a July 17 ruling that is a blow to civil liberties protected by the U.S. Constitution. The appellate court ruled:
Plaintiffs lack standing to seek preenforcement review of Section 1021 and vacate the permanent injunction. The American citizen plaintiffs lack standing because Section 1021 says nothing at all about the President’s authority to detain American citizens.
The Section 1021 of the NDAA allows “detention under the law of war without trial until the end of the hostilities” for “a person who was a part of or substantially supported al-Qaeda, the Taliban, or associated forces that are engaged in hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners, including any person who has committed a belligerent act or has directly supported such hostilities in aid of such enemy forces.” The court is technically correct in stating that the law does not specifically mention U.S. citizens when it uses the term “person,” but like the vaguely worded “supported such hostilities in aid of such enemy forces,” it appears to be all-encompassing and subject solely to the president's discretionary whims.


The threat that the U.S. government would detain indefinitely — or even kill — an American citizen without formal charges or judicial proceeding is hardly theoretical. The appellate court that struck down the injunction acknowledged that fact:
Presidents Bush and Obama have asserted the right to place certain individuals in military detention, without trial, in furtherance of their authorized use of force. That is, whom did Congress authorize the President to detain when it passed the AUMF [Authorization for the Use of Military Force]? On December 31, 2011, President Obama signed into law the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2012. Section 1021 of that statute, which fits on a single page, is Congress’ first — and, to date, only — foray into providing further clarity on that question. Of particular importance for our purposes, Section 1021(b)(2) appears to permit the President to detain anyone who was part of, or has substantially supported, al-Qaeda, the Taliban, or associated forces.
Both President Obama and George W. Bush have authorized the detention or killing of American citizens without any due process.
U.S. citizen Anwar al-Awlaki had been deemed a terrorist by the Obama administration for essentially maintaining a YouTube site that called for attacks against Americans from Awlaki's Yemeni home. Awlaki — an American citizen — was later killed in a September 30, 2011 drone strike authorized by President Obama but without any judicial proceeding. No evidence of his actual involvement in any terrorist incident was ever made public, and no charges were ever brought in any court against Awlaki. Two weeks later Awlaki's Colorado-born 16-year-old son, Abdulrahman, was killed in a separate drone strike authorized by the president. And President Obama is widely known to have a “kill list” that includes American citizens.
President Bush detained at least four American citizens without trial: U.S. Navy Veteran Donald Vance, Nathan Ertel, Yaser Hamdi, and Jose Padilla. Although Vance and Ertel were released after a few months of torture (they were innocent), the Bush administration fought giving Hamdi and Padilla a trial — and even a habeas corpus hearing — all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court.
The suit against the NDAA was brought largely by plaintiffs who are journalists and political activists, each claiming that their First Amendment-protected rights to freedom of speech, press, and assembly had been “chilled” because of the threat of indefinite detention. One of the journalists, Nobel Prize-winner Christopher Hedges, had interviewed al-Qaeda members as part of a story on the terrorist organization, and sought an injunction against his detention for what a president could claim was “aid” of enemy forces under the NDAA. Hedges' fear is not unfounded; three former Guantanamo detainees (the British citizens released because they were innocent) were deemed by the U.S. government in 2007 as having “returned to the battlefield” for the crime of granting an interview for the documentary film The Road to Guantanamo.
The injunction against the NDAA that was overridden, issued by Judge Katherine B. Forrest last year, against detentions without the ordinary court process said: “The Government did not — and does not — generally agree or anywhere argue that activities protected by the First Amendment could not subject an individual to indefinite military detention under § 1021(b)(2). The First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution provides for greater protection: It prohibits Congress from passing any law abridging speech and associational rights.... First Amendment rights are guaranteed by the Constitution and cannot be legislated away.”
Though the injunction against indefinite detention was struck down largely on jurisdictional grounds, the appellate court essentially dismissed the district court ruling that “plaintiffs did present evidence that First Amendment rights have already been harmed and will be harmed by the prospect of § 1021(b)(2) being enforced. The public has a strong and undoubted interest in the clear preservation of First and Fifth Amendment rights.”


I don't know where you are getting any information about military drones flying over the united states with the specific military operations intent as that is explicitly illegal.

http://www.whiteoutpress.com/articles/q12013/new-drone-flight-records-over-the-us-released/

[h=2]January 5, 2013[/h]
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[h=1]New Drone Flight Records over the US released[/h] January 5, 2013. US unmanned drone flights over American air space are no secret. In fact, the US military and the Dept of Homeland Security still need to file flight plans with the FAA prior to launching each drone sortie. Thanks to one vigilant watchdog group and their FOI requests, Americans now know the extent of the aerial spying program enlisted against them over their own soil.

ec2d43865e1f9a3513030cf7678995d7.jpg

Major areas of aerial drone activity based on FAA and other documents.



Electronic Frontier Foundation victory
A couple weeks ago, the Electronic Frontier Foundation obtained and published thousands of pages of domestic drone flight information from 2012. The organization touts its successes after filing Freedom of Information Act requests to obtain the records from the FAA and other sources. For the first time ever, the details of spying and military drone flights over the US include information from the US Air Force, the US Marine Corps, and a little known government program called the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency.





EFF explains that some of the government agencies and military branches were more forthcoming than others. For instance, the group writes, ‘The Marine Corps is also testing drones, though it chose to redact so much of the text from its records that we still don’t know much about its programs’. For its part, the Air Force has been testing drones over the US that include small hand-launched aerial vehicles like the ‘Raven’, ‘Puma’, and ‘Wasp’, as well as the larger, bomb and missile-launching drones like ‘Predator’ and the ‘Reaper’.
All of these vehicles and more have been traversing the skies over America throughout 2012. What exactly they were doing, however, was rarely divulged. Although, separate investigative reports by such publications as the New York Times have revealed that drone pilots often practice surveillance missions by following civilian cars as they travel across American roads and highways.
Local details
The report also includes details from drone flight missions over local towns and cities in the US. For instance, the USAF has flown the ‘ScanEagle’ drone, which has a 360-degree, rotating camera turret, in the skies over Virginia Beach. The Air Force has also been testing Boeing’s A160 ‘Hummingbird’ drone over Victorville, California. The Hummingbird can stay airborne for up to 24 hours at a time.
Perhaps the most futuristic and ominous disclosures came from USAF drone flights of its Reaper unmanned strike vehicle. The drones have been flying over numerous US cities including Lincoln, Nevada and parts of California and Utah. These next-generation Reaper drones are reportedly equipped with ‘Gorgon Stare’ technology, which is described as a 9-camera surveillance system capable of spying on an entire city at one time.
Even more troublesome is the disclosure that human beings aren’t always the ones receiving and assembling the photos and videos taken by the overhead drones. A science fiction sounding program titled ‘Mind’s Eye’ is being tested that can receive and analyze all aerial drone video feeds, using artificial intelligence to process and report each mission’s details. There weren’t any details indicating whether or not computers are carrying out assassinations and other targeted killings, or if those sensitive missions were still being carried out exclusively by humans.
Risk Assessment
One of the major concerns regarding domestic drone flights is the possibility of accidents or crashes. Military drones continue to crash in highly politicized areas like Iran and Afghanistan, while the newly released documents show the US isn’t immune from similar accidents. One document noted 8 drone ‘incidents’, assumed to be crashes, near-collisions or software malfunctions, over the course of 79,177 flight hours.
Another document titled ‘Risk Assessment’ lists 15 possible hazards and problems a drone flight may encounter, along with its probability, severity and risk level. The most likely incident was ‘Weather/Wind/Icing’. While some of the less likely problems included ‘Conflict with other traffic’, ‘UAS Mechanical failure’, ‘UAS Software failure’, ‘Failure of Air Traffic Control Radar’, ‘Position error’ and others.





Not just the federal government anymore
While libertarians and civil rights advocates complain about the federal government and the Dept of Homeland Security using unmanned drones to spy on Americans over US skies, it’s local officials such as County Sheriffs and town police chiefs that are enlisting the aerial technology more and more.
The reasons listed by local officials in their attempts to obtain or use unmanned spy drones in their daily law enforcement duties varies widely, but most sound legitimate and beneficial, at least on their surface. For instance, the Queen Anne County, Maryland Sheriff’s Department applied for a drone license to search farms for hidden marijuana fields, as well as surveil suspected drug dealers and drug transactions. Gadsden, Alabama’s Police Dept also wanted to film drug transactions, according to its application.
Montgomery County, Texas wanted not only the drone, but thermal imaging capabilities – capturing imagery using body heat. Such cameras have the ability to reveal hidden individuals in the darkness, through tree canopies and even through walls. Local police want the technology to monitor their ‘high risk operations’ involving narcotics trafficking. Arlington, Texas may have beaten them all with regard to their ingenuity. They’ve officially requested the ‘Lepron Avenger’ aerial drone which is equipped with LIDAR imaging technology. These cameras are most known for being used in police speed guns, making some question whether or not Arlington plans to us military espionage drones to target local citizens with traffic violations from the sky.
Not all local law enforcement agencies are using their drone capabilities in a legal or ethical manner however. In fact, many have purposely violated Freedom of Information Act requests for even the most basic information, such as what type of drones are being used, how often, over what areas or for what reasons. Local municipalities guilty of erecting an iron curtain include Orange County, Florida and Mesa County, Colorado.
Not all local US officials have used their new aerial drone vehicles to target or otherwise victimize their own citizens. Some have come up with some really interesting uses. The Washington State Dept of Transportation requested a drone license to help monitor avalanches to speed up early warnings. Wyoming and the US Dept of Energy applied for a drone license to monitor methane emissions.
California and the US Forest Service have applied for drones which would be used to fight forest fires. And the University of Michigan even requested a drone. They have water buoys floating in the Great Lakes that until now, needed to first be found, then boated out to, and then manually moved. With an aerial drone, the University can move the buoys remotely by simply launching them up out of the water and dropping them down in their new desired position.





Resistance and push-back
Records also show that the FAA rejected a number of drone license applications, including one from the Georgia Tech University Police Department. Their application showed their drone flying in a high-traffic helicopter flight path without any ‘sense and avoid system’ to warn of airborne collisions with other aircraft. Otter Tail County, Minnesota was also denied a drone license by the FAA. In its case, the town couldn’t meet the minimum requirement for pilot training. To give an idea of how widespread drone flights are over US skies, the University of Colorado alone has received over 200 drone licenses so far.
All the unmanned drone flights over American skies haven’t gone unnoticed by local citizens across the country. Many are angry and condemn the intrusive espionage flights as an invasion of their privacy. Some, including a handful of street gangs in cities like Los Angeles and Chicago, have openly bragged about how they’d shoot down any unmanned drones caught flying over their turf.
In many rural areas across the Deep South, rumors abound about bounties being offered for anyone who can shoot down the first domestic spy drone. Others, specifically throughout Tennessee, Kentucky and the Appalachians, report shooting at drones flying overhead searching for secret marijuana fields. Like the moonshiners of past generations, it seems Uncle Sam and his G-Men still aren’t welcome on ole Rocky Top.
Related Articles:
Map of Unmanned Spy Drone Bases in US
Insect Size Spy Drones unveiled
Domestic Spy Drones to be Armed
Videos show Pics of Kids murdered by Obama Drone Strikes
US Marines killed in friendly Drone Attack


"It's like boiling a frog. If you drop a frog into boiling water it will jump straight out but if you put a frog in cold water then boil the water the frog will slowly boil to death. The public is the frog and it is being slowly boiled"
This is a perfect example of where you are very good at putting words together. Makes it sound good. Really, there's no basis for your claim.

It's a good analogy

You should really look more into things before forcing your opinion so strongly
 
As I mentioned I'm not good at politics. I could be missing stuff here, and likely am. I'll talk to a friend who is by far more knowledgeable in this topic and see if he can post a response.
 
As I mentioned I'm not good at politics. I could be missing stuff here, and likely am. I'll talk to a friend who is by far more knowledgeable in this topic and see if he can post a response.

Why don't you trust your own judgment on it?

Your friend might not be as infallible as you think and they might missguide you

Why not look into the things i've mentioned yourself?

The NDAA has been legally challenged by various US intellectuals but the government is upholding it. The NDAA allows your military to detain you indefinately without trial, on jumped up charges, and even to torture you for example with waterboarding. It is one more step towards a totalitarian dictatorship

Here are people behind the 'stop the NDAA' campaign discussing it

[video=youtube;-e7MBxpJUrI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-e7MBxpJUrI[/video]
 
Last edited:
Fight the NDAA through PANDA

[video=youtube;14I61UbjbDU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14I61UbjbDU&list=UUhwwoeOZ3EJPobW83dgQfAg# t=270[/video]
 
Ice cream.

Think about it.
 
No

beyond this reply i will think no more on it
 
http://www.funstock.co.uk/super-retro-trio-gaming-console

The retron!!!

This console will solve the problem of boredom among retrogamers, provided they have the games from years ago, you'll be able to play whatever game you choose without having to swap the whole console.

Boredom is a serious problem you know, it evolves and changes and the ability to cope with it successfully and transcend it determines whether people are likely to get involved in crime and anti-social behaviour escalating to serious things such as sadistic personality profiles.
 
http://www.funstock.co.uk/super-retro-trio-gaming-console

The retron!!!

This console will solve the problem of boredom among retrogamers, provided they have the games from years ago, you'll be able to play whatever game you choose without having to swap the whole console.

Boredom is a serious problem you know, it evolves and changes and the ability to cope with it successfully and transcend it determines whether people are likely to get involved in crime and anti-social behaviour escalating to serious things such as sadistic personality profiles.

I think that there is no substitute for doing something real and in the moment

I think we need to get the young growing their own food, making their own furniture, tools and other equipment, learning hard skills, working in and with nature, mending things and building things whether it is a chair or a piece of upto date modern cutting edge technology

We need community social events that celebrate creativity, arts, crafts, the best of technology, skills, music, story telling and so on which also enable people to share ideas and the fruits of their efforts as well as meet other people

I went to some great festivals that showed how people really don't need corporations to provide the things we need in life...let alone entertainment

Before you know it the task you have set yourself in which you immerse yourself and test your skills and problem solving becomes your entertainment and a great source of satisfaction and self esteem
 
Why don't you trust your own judgment on it?

Your friend might not be as infallible as you think and they might missguide you

Why not look into the things i've mentioned yourself?

I don't have experience in politics, so I don't think I have much room to talk about the subject. Just reading about it I don't think qualifies me as understanding it, at least so far as politics. I miss subtleties in politics sometimes and it gives me a headache :/ its just not my thing. I'm much more for philosophy or sciences. Get me started on a discussion about black holes or free-will and I will go to town. Politics I'm not good at except a few very small facets in the topic.
I never said that he was infallible, simply that he is better than me and could actually say something more accurate than I. This friend is also very good at logical reasoning and looking at topics. I'd venture to say he is better at philosophy than me (sometimes) and definitely better at debate.

After he read what you put, he said he agreed with most of what you said in so far as the points you made (drones are being flown over American soil, the provision you listed, etc.). However, he disagreed with your conclusions of this being a move of the government to "destroy the constitution and remove your civil liberties." For example, he listed that provision that you were talking about as true, but there is another provision specifically preventing the U.S. government from stripping your constitutional rights.
"Nothing in the Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law 107–40; 50 U.S.C. 1541) or the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2012 (Public Law 112–81) shall be construed to deny the availability of the writ of habeas corpus or to deny any Constitutional rights in a court ordained or established by or under Article III of the Constitution to any person inside the United States who would be entitled to the availability of such writ or to such rights in the absence of such laws."
Now on the face of this it would seem to protect the U.S. citizen from what you were suggesting (he also talked about another provision that protected civil liberties of the type you suggested, but I can't find it again, I forgot which part it was), but he also said this can be interpreted in another way that would still threaten the U.S. citizen as you would suggest. However since such a case would seem to break the original bill of rights, he said there is no way to know how this provision is to be interpreted without a court precedent. Until this is taken to a court, its hard to tell if this precedent will be enough to protect the U.S. citizen or not.
As for the military drones, it is important to note that there is no document that talks about the drones actually running surveillance or "sorties" as a part of the military. Those drones can be flown over American soil (testing and the like) but the Posse Comitatus act of 1878 would most likely take precedence in restricting military usage except in cases of martial law (declared only by congress). However, civilian authorities can request military assistance (in the form of advice or equipment *maybe* but no military officer can pick up a gun to run an operation on America soil). So civilian authorities can run drones, and I think I found some sources talking about the FBI among others admitting to such actions.

This is me trying to repeat what my friend was telling me, and after reading it again, I see that I did not explain it well. So because of my inexperience with politics, I feel I should step out of this discussion. Muir, if you want to start a discussion about science or philosophy, shoot me a message. I can put up a better argument in those topics. Overall, I think it is important to note that this is a relatively new technology. We are in the process of setting the laws and working out what should or should not be done with these drones. This site (https://www.aclu.org/blog/tag/domestic-drones) listed a set of regulations I agreed with. I think these should be implemented.
 
I don't have experience in politics, so I don't think I have much room to talk about the subject. Just reading about it I don't think qualifies me as understanding it, at least so far as politics. I miss subtleties in politics sometimes and it gives me a headache :/ its just not my thing. I'm much more for philosophy or sciences. Get me started on a discussion about black holes or free-will and I will go to town. Politics I'm not good at except a few very small facets in the topic.
I never said that he was infallible, simply that he is better than me and could actually say something more accurate than I. This friend is also very good at logical reasoning and looking at topics. I'd venture to say he is better at philosophy than me (sometimes) and definitely better at debate.

After he read what you put, he said he agreed with most of what you said in so far as the points you made (drones are being flown over American soil, the provision you listed, etc.). However, he disagreed with your conclusions of this being a move of the government to "destroy the constitution and remove your civil liberties." For example, he listed that provision that you were talking about as true, but there is another provision specifically preventing the U.S. government from stripping your constitutional rights.
"Nothing in the Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law 107–40; 50 U.S.C. 1541) or the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2012 (Public Law 112–81) shall be construed to deny the availability of the writ of habeas corpus or to deny any Constitutional rights in a court ordained or established by or under Article III of the Constitution to any person inside the United States who would be entitled to the availability of such writ or to such rights in the absence of such laws."
Now on the face of this it would seem to protect the U.S. citizen from what you were suggesting (he also talked about another provision that protected civil liberties of the type you suggested, but I can't find it again, I forgot which part it was), but he also said this can be interpreted in another way that would still threaten the U.S. citizen as you would suggest. However since such a case would seem to break the original bill of rights, he said there is no way to know how this provision is to be interpreted without a court precedent. Until this is taken to a court, its hard to tell if this precedent will be enough to protect the U.S. citizen or not.
As for the military drones, it is important to note that there is no document that talks about the drones actually running surveillance or "sorties" as a part of the military. Those drones can be flown over American soil (testing and the like) but the Posse Comitatus act of 1878 would most likely take precedence in restricting military usage except in cases of martial law (declared only by congress). However, civilian authorities can request military assistance (in the form of advice or equipment *maybe* but no military officer can pick up a gun to run an operation on America soil). So civilian authorities can run drones, and I think I found some sources talking about the FBI among others admitting to such actions.

This is me trying to repeat what my friend was telling me, and after reading it again, I see that I did not explain it well. So because of my inexperience with politics, I feel I should step out of this discussion. Muir, if you want to start a discussion about science or philosophy, shoot me a message. I can put up a better argument in those topics. Overall, I think it is important to note that this is a relatively new technology. We are in the process of setting the laws and working out what should or should not be done with these drones. This site (https://www.aclu.org/blog/tag/domestic-drones) listed a set of regulations I agreed with. I think these should be implemented.

I thought you explained it very well actually

If you zoom out from the situation a bit and take a look at the larger picture there are trends that can be discearned

The globalists behind these changes such as the NDAA, the 'patriot' act and the drone flights have a vision that they are trying to achieve

This vision can not be achieved in one step because it would be too big of a change for the public to accept in one go so they have to bring the change in slowly.....so slowly that most people don't even notice the political and economic landscape around the changing (until it is too late)

People like me are the canary in the coal mine

We are saying ''watch out, there are people trying to change our world and not in a good way''

But most people are too wrapped up in face book and their new 'smart' phone or xbox game to actually look up and look around at the world around them and see what is going on out there

If you go onto the facebook homepage you will see a map of the world with little people on it. If you count them you will find there are 13 of them which is a very significant number in the occult; for example a coven must have 13 members

If you look at the left hand cluster of people and you join lines between them you will see that they make the letter 'S'

Then look at the middle cluster and join the dots and you will see that they make the letter 'P'

Then look at the right hand cluster, imagine lines between them and they make the letter 'Y'

SPY

Julian Assange has publically warned people that facebook is a giant spy database with a direct interface with the CIA. Mark Zuckerberg is a CIA/Mossad asset

Hollywood is also run by the network of people behind the intelligence agencies, the drones, the NDAA etc and they made a film about Zuckerberg which portrays him as a teenage genius who just came up with facebook, but the reality is that he is simply a front man for the inteligence agencies

There are people out there you might consider intelligent, but if they are putting all their personal info on facebook and handing over all their info to the intelligence agencies then you have to ask yourself how well informed are they really because from where i'm standing they're not looking too smart

Which brings me to 'smart' phones. Anything with the pre-fix 'smart' for example 'smart car', 'smart phone', 'smart meter' is part of the agenda 21 programme which is a UN run programme which sets out the vision of the globalists for the society of tomorrow

This society is pretty well portrayed in the hollywood blockbuster 'the hunger games' where a central metropolis full of the elite chosen ones is fed and supplied by outlying districts who do the farming and mining and are used as slaves effectively, living a drastically lower quality of life to the the chosen ones in the high tech metropolis

Agenda 21 is about achieveing TOTAL control over every aspect of our lives which is where the term 'totalitarianism' comes from...that's what it means...it means total control over every aspect of life

So your smart car will have tracking devices which allow the corporate controlled government to track your where abouts and your speed, fiel consumption and probably in time your heart rate, vital signs etc

Your smart phone already gives away your location every minute of every day and your texts and calls are all monitored and stored by the NSA super computers

Your smart meter monitors your electrical useage and what appliances you are using etc

In fact even everyday items such as fridges, toasters, kettles and so on are all being microchipped now and will all be controlled by the 'smart grid'. This is being termed the 'internet of things' (please search engine this for more info ideally not using google which records everything you search and is controlled by the pentagon)

What this leads to is a world very much like the world outlined in orwells book '1984' where people are completely controlled, lack any sort of freedoms and are murdered by their government for disobeying them. It's very likely that the computer in front of you has a camera in it or on it and microphones and it can be hacked by the intelligence serivces so that they can watch you and listen to you and that is essentially the 'telescreen' from '1984' right there

Digital TV's are also being built with surveillance technology in them and so are computer game consoles which are able to watch the user

Now if the network announced all this in the news the public would be upset...so they don't....they don't tell them anything...they just do it

They are flying drones over US soil. Why do you think they are doing that? Do you think they are model aeroplane enthusiasts who just like to fly planes over people for fun? No they are using them to spy on people...it's all part of the smart grid that is being built

Google has now merged with DAARPA which is funded by the network and they have built microchips which they want to implant in peopls bodies so that they can use digital money instead of paper money. This way they can cut off the money supply to anyone who disagrees with the corporate controlled government

So the NDAA, FEMA camps, drone flights, militarisation of the police, US army drills carried out on US soil, patriot act, DHS purchsing of ammo etc is all about buidling up to totalitarian control

Please show this post to your friend and encourage him to look into my claims and see what he says
 
I thought you explained it very well actually

If you zoom out from the situation a bit and take a look at the larger picture there are trends that can be discearned

The globalists behind these changes such as the NDAA, the 'patriot' act and the drone flights have a vision that they are trying to achieve

This vision can not be achieved in one step because it would be too big of a change for the public to accept in one go so they have to bring the change in slowly.....so slowly that most people don't even notice the political and economic landscape around the changing (until it is too late)

People like me are the canary in the coal mine

We are saying ''watch out, there are people trying to change our world and not in a good way''

But most people are too wrapped up in face book and their new 'smart' phone or xbox game to actually look up and look around at the world around them and see what is going on out there

If you go onto the facebook homepage you will see a map of the world with little people on it. If you count them you will find there are 13 of them which is a very significant number in the occult; for example a coven must have 13 members

If you look at the left hand cluster of people and you join lines between them you will see that they make the letter 'S'

Then look at the middle cluster and join the dots and you will see that they make the letter 'P'

Then look at the right hand cluster, imagine lines between them and they make the letter 'Y'

SPY

Julian Assange has publically warned people that facebook is a giant spy database with a direct interface with the CIA. Mark Zuckerberg is a CIA/Mossad asset

Hollywood is also run by the network of people behind the intelligence agencies, the drones, the NDAA etc and they made a film about Zuckerberg which portrays him as a teenage genius who just came up with facebook, but the reality is that he is simply a front man for the inteligence agencies

There are people out there you might consider intelligent, but if they are putting all their personal info on facebook and handing over all their info to the intelligence agencies then you have to ask yourself how well informed are they really because from where i'm standing they're not looking too smart

Which brings me to 'smart' phones. Anything with the pre-fix 'smart' for example 'smart car', 'smart phone', 'smart meter' is part of the agenda 21 programme which is a UN run programme which sets out the vision of the globalists for the society of tomorrow

This society is pretty well portrayed in the hollywood blockbuster 'the hunger games' where a central metropolis full of the elite chosen ones is fed and supplied by outlying districts who do the farming and mining and are used as slaves effectively, living a drastically lower quality of life to the the chosen ones in the high tech metropolis

Agenda 21 is about achieveing TOTAL control over every aspect of our lives which is where the term 'totalitarianism' comes from...that's what it means...it means total control over every aspect of life

So your smart car will have tracking devices which allow the corporate controlled government to track your where abouts and your speed, fiel consumption and probably in time your heart rate, vital signs etc

Your smart phone already gives away your location every minute of every day and your texts and calls are all monitored and stored by the NSA super computers

Your smart meter monitors your electrical useage and what appliances you are using etc

In fact even everyday items such as fridges, toasters, kettles and so on are all being microchipped now and will all be controlled by the 'smart grid'. This is being termed the 'internet of things' (please search engine this for more info ideally not using google which records everything you search and is controlled by the pentagon)

What this leads to is a world very much like the world outlined in orwells book '1984' where people are completely controlled, lack any sort of freedoms and are murdered by their government for disobeying them. It's very likely that the computer in front of you has a camera in it or on it and microphones and it can be hacked by the intelligence serivces so that they can watch you and listen to you and that is essentially the 'telescreen' from '1984' right there

Digital TV's are also being built with surveillance technology in them and so are computer game consoles which are able to watch the user

Now if the network announced all this in the news the public would be upset...so they don't....they don't tell them anything...they just do it

They are flying drones over US soil. Why do you think they are doing that? Do you think they are model aeroplane enthusiasts who just like to fly planes over people for fun? No they are using them to spy on people...it's all part of the smart grid that is being built

Google has now merged with DAARPA which is funded by the network and they have built microchips which they want to implant in peopls bodies so that they can use digital money instead of paper money. This way they can cut off the money supply to anyone who disagrees with the corporate controlled government

So the NDAA, FEMA camps, drone flights, militarisation of the police, US army drills carried out on US soil, patriot act, DHS purchsing of ammo etc is all about buidling up to totalitarian control

Please show this post to your friend and encourage him to look into my claims and see what he says

I'm afraid that now he and I are on summer break (we both go to college together). He lives in Chicago and I live in southern Illinois, so I don't want to bother him over this. Now I think you are right that some of these things are happening. Its just you seem to assume there is some single entity or group that is running this change with express intent to use these advances to reach this totalitarian government you are talking about. However, that is your jump in logic. There is no proof of such a group. Every single thing that you just listed can be shown to have a different intent. I can see where you might try to reach this conclusion, however when you say your looking at the big picture, I think you are missing how all that you said is a small part of all that's going on in the world. Now with everything that goes on in the world, statistical probability would suggest that you can pick and choose things to find the patterns you are looking for. That does not mean that pattern is actually what is happening.
Cases of this have existed and still exist today. One of my favorite examples is the geocentric model of the solar system. It worked nearly perfectly. All the available evidence fit. Then Galileo looked at the bigger picture and saw the heliocentric model.
Your Facebook comment, I can't find the picture you are talking about, so without seeing I can't say for sure. However, that would seem to be a perfect case of seeing what you want. Have you ever heard stairway to heaven played backwards? Many people claim that it was some satanic song because it sounds like it says Satan and some kind of praise for him. However, the words are gibberish. You see your brain tries to see patterns in the world, and is so good at that it will impose those patterns where it seems reasonable, but it isn't really there. That's what happens in that song. If you are told that if you hear that song backwards, you will hear a praise of Satan, then you notice you will pick out what sounds like Satan said over and over again. Then if you add the "lyrics" of the backwards version, you can pick that out too. But really its nothing. You can do that with other songs as well with varying degrees of success. Some people honestly believe stairway to heaven is a Satanic song because of this, even though there is absolutely no logical reason to say this.
That sounds like what you are doing. You want to see this pattern so you find it, even if its not necessarily there. Now my point in saying this is not that it is not there, only to try to get you to see that you might be seeing a pattern that isn't really there. It is ok to believe that pattern is there, but try to come up with better evidence than just showing things that support the pattern.
Have you heard of the black swan used in showing philosophy of science? It goes like this. Before they discovered Australia (because apparently Australia has black swans, I don't know, lol I want to see one) people would always say there's no such thing as a black swan. Every time they saw a white swan however does not prove them correct. All they ever saw was white swans, and all they ever looked for was white swans, so it would seem reasonable to say that there are only white swans. When they discovered Australia, they discovered the black swan and that idea of no black swans exist went up in smoke. You see, this shows that you get far more evidence from something that disproves your theory rather than things that agree with your theory.
I think this might be what you are doing. Your only looking at the things that support your theory. Try looking for things that disprove your theory, and you will be better for it. This is what the scientific method is based off of.
It might be extremely hard to do in this context we are discussing, maybe even impossible to prove one way or the other. Just something to think about.
As for all the technological advancements, there is a very logical reason for each one of those I'd be willing to say (however please do not start this in a nit pick over every single little example. If you wish to bring up two or three examples, I will respond to those). To say that there is potential for them to be used for a totalitarian society does not say that it will be used for a totalitarian society.
 
I'm afraid that now he and I are on summer break (we both go to college together). He lives in Chicago and I live in southern Illinois, so I don't want to bother him over this. Now I think you are right that some of these things are happening. Its just you seem to assume there is some single entity or group that is running this change with express intent to use these advances to reach this totalitarian government you are talking about. However, that is your jump in logic. There is no proof of such a group.

There is proof of such a group. We know who they are and we know the entities that they operate through

A good book for following the money back to the source behind world events is 'big oil and their bankers in the persian gulf' by Dean Henderson (he has a great website full of informative articles: https://deanhenderson.wordpress.com/

The book is just crammed full with information. literally every page connects so many dots that it becomes impossible to remember all the specifics as you progress through the book. However through a process of repetition (ie the same names appearing again and again and again) a picture begins to form in the mind of the reader

The picture is of a network operating through corporations and groups like the bilderberg club who are pulling the strings

The US historian Prof. Carrol Quigley wrote a book called 'tragedy and Hope' in which he talks about this network. Quigley was allowed for several years to access the files of this group and is not hostile to their plan, he just objects to their use of secrecy



This information is out there but it is not freely given to the public...they have to reach out to it

Every single thing that you just listed can be shown to have a different intent.

They can all be shown to have the same intent

Are you aware of the attempted fascist coup in the 1930's in the US? Are you aware that a group of bankers got together and asked a marine officer called Major General Smedley Butler to put together a private army to takeover the government through force in order to instal a fascist dictatorship?

This coup no doubt would have worked except Butler went public and told the press and the public about the coup. the plotters however were not arrested

A similar coup was carried out successfully in germany leading to the Nazi party taking power. (the initial munich putsch failed but the coup was then achieved through political means via false flags and violence and intimidation by the brown shirts)

A fascist coup was also planned in the UK in the 1970's involving military, aristocracy and members of the royal family. The coup was never executed.

I can see where you might try to reach this conclusion, however when you say your looking at the big picture, I think you are missing how all that you said is a small part of all that's going on in the world. Now with everything that goes on in the world, statistical probability would suggest that you can pick and choose things to find the patterns you are looking for. That does not mean that pattern is actually what is happening.
Cases of this have existed and still exist today. One of my favorite examples is the geocentric model of the solar system. It worked nearly perfectly. All the available evidence fit. Then Galileo looked at the bigger picture and saw the heliocentric model.
Your Facebook comment, I can't find the picture you are talking about, so without seeing I can't say for sure. However, that would seem to be a perfect case of seeing what you want. Have you ever heard stairway to heaven played backwards? Many people claim that it was some satanic song because it sounds like it says Satan and some kind of praise for him. However, the words are gibberish.

Are you aware that Jimmy Page bought the house of satanist Aleister Crowley, called Boleskine house?

Also are you aware that the band members each drew up their own personal magickal sigils:

led-zeppelin-symbols-1-G.webp
You see your brain tries to see patterns in the world, and is so good at that it will impose those patterns where it seems reasonable, but it isn't really there. That's what happens in that song. If you are told that if you hear that song backwards, you will hear a praise of Satan, then you notice you will pick out what sounds like Satan said over and over again. Then if you add the "lyrics" of the backwards version, you can pick that out too. But really its nothing. You can do that with other songs as well with varying degrees of success. Some people honestly believe stairway to heaven is a Satanic song because of this, even though there is absolutely no logical reason to say this.

Lol

You don't need to listen to the song backwards...jut listen to it forwards: ''if there's a bustle in the hedgerow, don't be afraid now, it's just the sprinkling of the May Queen''

These are lyrics that any wiccan can appreciate

That sounds like what you are doing. You want to see this pattern so you find it, even if its not necessarily there. Now my point in saying this is not that it is not there, only to try to get you to see that you might be seeing a pattern that isn't really there. It is ok to believe that pattern is there, but try to come up with better evidence than just showing things that support the pattern.

Go onto wikipedia and type in 'the council on foreign relations'

This is one of the groups through which the globalists (who quigley called 'the milner group' or the round table group) operate through

Scroll down the membership list including the corporate membership list

20 minutes of doing this will tell you more about who runs your country then reading mainstream newspapers for a year

Have you heard of the black swan used in showing philosophy of science? It goes like this. Before they discovered Australia (because apparently Australia has black swans, I don't know, lol I want to see one) people would always say there's no such thing as a black swan. Every time they saw a white swan however does not prove them correct. All they ever saw was white swans, and all they ever looked for was white swans, so it would seem reasonable to say that there are only white swans. When they discovered Australia, they discovered the black swan and that idea of no black swans exist went up in smoke. You see, this shows that you get far more evidence from something that disproves your theory rather than things that agree with your theory.
I think this might be what you are doing. Your only looking at the things that support your theory. Try looking for things that disprove your theory, and you will be better for it. This is what the scientific method is based off of.

Did the nazis exist?

They were a group of occultists from the germanorden and thule society who formed a political group that represented the interests of the corporations and industrialists who supported them

The merger of political and corporate power is what fascism is and that is what has happened in the US today

Do you think people like those that formed the nazi party only exist in germany? No of course not...they exist in every country and they are very determined people

Stop chasing philosophical mice around your head for a minute and look at the hard facts.....start following the money. get busy online....start researching these people and groups and you will soon learn how things actually work

It might be extremely hard to do in this context we are discussing, maybe even impossible to prove one way or the other. Just something to think about.
As for all the technological advancements, there is a very logical reason for each one of those I'd be willing to say (however please do not start this in a nit pick over every single little example. If you wish to bring up two or three examples, I will respond to those). To say that there is potential for them to be used for a totalitarian society does not say that it will be used for a totalitarian society.

They have centralised their power more and more each decade.....the aim of that is to concentrate power into a few hands

To do that they want to centralise power and to control everything and everyone...they are control freaks

A great documentary that looks at how the real history of the US has been a struggle between the people and the bankers for control over the money supply, is ''the money masters''. I strongly recommend it! Its a fair length...i think the first time i watched it i watched it in instalments, but i have watched it many times since

[video=youtube;HfpO-WBz_mw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfpO-WBz_mw[/video]

I'll leave you with the words of mayer amschel rothschild:

Give me control of a nations money supply, and I care not who makes it’s laws
 
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I was looking for a quigley quote and found this piece which discusses the network Prof Quigley spoke about

http://www.jonesreport.com/article/05_08/30quigley.html

Dr. Quigley’s Tragedy and Hope reveals a Call by Cecil Rhodes for an “American Union”​
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Dr. Carroll Quigley, a highly respected professor of history at the Foreign Service School of Georgetown University for 28-years, revealed in his 1348 page magnum opus, Tragedy and Hope (1966), the nefarious goal of Cecil Rhodes’ secret society calling for an American Union, coming to fruition today as the “North American Union.” From 1884 to about 1915, according Dr. Quigley, the members of The Rhodes Secret Society exhaustively worked at extending the British Empire and forming a federal system. The Rhodes Secret Society was “constantly harping on the lessons to be learned from the failure of the American Revolution and the success of the Canadian federation of 1867, and hoped to federate the various parts of the empire as seemed feasible, then confederate the whole of it, with the United Kingdom, into a single organization...(hoping) to bring the United States into this organization to whatever degree was possible…(making) Washington the capital of the whole organization or allow parts of the empire to become states of the American Union (emphasis added. Below see scan copy of page 133 of Tragedy and Hope).”​
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It is interesting to note that, despite an aversion by The Rhodes Secret Society towards the success of our American Revolution accentuating a victory for sovereignty and freedom predicated upon a Constitutional Republic, the Rhodes Secret Society was willing to adhere to diplomacy by deception in order to confederate independent nations into a single federation or union disregarding the sovereignty of nations. Diplomacy by deception continues to be adhered to by the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) under the patronage and guidance of the Rockefellers. It is of utmost importance to understand the deeply rooted genesis in the world of foreign affairs as the Royal Institute for International Affairs (RIIA) headquartered at Chatham House, St. James Square, London, is the “mother” of the American Council of Foreign Relations (CFR).​
(Article continues below)​


Dr. Quigley attributes the success of The Rhodes Secret Society to their effectiveness in concealing its existence. Its members’ preference was to maintain a stealthy appearance with a series of overlapping circles or rings partly concealed by being hidden behind formally organized groups of no obvious political significance and avoiding an appearance of being an integrated group. Dr. Quigley provides a lengthy roster and structure of A Tentative Roster of the Milner Group in the “Appendix” of his book, The Anglo-American Establishment. The “front organization” for The Rhodes Secret Society was The Round Table Group in Great Britain which was working in concert with J. P. Morgan in the United States to establish its “front organization” in the United States. Dr. Quigley described the genesis of the Council on Foreign Relations as follows:​
At the end of the war of 1914, it became clear that the organization of this system had to be greatly extended. . . . Lionel Curtis . . . established, in England and each dominion, a front organization to the existing local Round Table Group…This front organization, called the Royal Institute of International Affairs, had as its nucleus in each area the existing submerged Round Table Group…in New York it was known as the Council on Foreign Relations, and was a front for J. P. Morgan and Company in association with the very small American Round Table Group. The American organizers were dominated by the large number of Morgan 'experts'… The Round Table for years (until 1961) was edited from the back door of Chatham House grounds in Ormond Yard, and its telephone came through the Chatham House switchboard (Tragedy and Hope: 951-952).​
“Stealth” is the preferred “modus operandi” practiced by The Rhodes Secret Society, Royal Institute for International Affairs (RIIA), and the Council of Foreign Relations (CFR) in establishing the European Union (EU), the North American Community (AKA: North American Union – NAU), and last week’s Union of South American Nations (UNASUR). “Stealth” has enabled them to manipulate the American people by keeping us ignorant, uninformed, and confused from the days of Cecil Rhodes to today. Dr. Quigley described the manipulation of such tactics over our American political process visa-via the false left vs. right paradigm:​
The chief problem of American political life for along time has been how to make the two Congressional parties more national and international…(therefore) argument that the two parties should represent opposed ideals and policies, one, perhaps, of the Right and the other of the Left, is a foolish idea acceptable only to doctrinaire and academic thinkers…Instead the two parties should be almost identical, so that the American people can ‘throw the rascals out' at any election without leading to any profound or extensive shifts in policy (Tragedy and Hope: 1247-1248).​
Such stealthy underhanded tactics have always been the means to an end, including but not limited to the eradication of the sovereignty of independent nations in order to achieve their ultimate goal of establishing a one world government, transcending from the inception of The Rhodes Secret Society to The Round Table Group in Great Britain to Royal Institute for International Affairs (RIIA), and the Council of Foreign Relations (CFR). Tragedy and Hope took Dr. Quigley over twenty years of researching the coveted archives of Cecil Rhodes secret society. Dr. Quigley dedicated his career “to training undergraduates in techniques of historical analysis which will help them to free their understanding of history from the accepted categories and cognitive classifications of the society in which we live, since these, however necessary they…nevertheless do often serve as barriers which shield us from recognition of the underlying realities themselves (Tragedy and Hope: ix).”​
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Dr. Quigley had a profound influence on numerous future diplomats and government officials. Amongst these individuals included former President Bill Clinton who commended Quigley during his Democratic Presidential Nomination Acceptance Address stating “as a teenager, I heard John Kennedy’s summons to citizenship…then, as a student at Georgetown I head that call clarified by a professor name Carol Quigley, who said to us that America was the greatest nation in history because our people had always believed in two things: that tomorrow can be better than today and that every one of us has a personal moral responsibility to make it so (http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/wjclinton1992dnc.htm).” Clinton specifically referenced Dr. Quigley in his autobiography, Bill Clinton- My Life, when he wrote, “Quigley’s insights had a particularly lasting impact… (so) from the 1992 campaign through my two terms in office, I quoted Professor Quigley’s line often (Clinton: 77-78).”

According to Dr. Quigley, “ by the middle 1890's Rhodes had a personal income of at least a million pounds sterling a year (then about five million dollars) which was spent so freely for his mysterious purposes…his desire to federate the English-speaking peoples and to bring all the habitable portions of the world under their control…leaving part of his great fortune to fund the Rhodes Scholarships at Oxford in order to spread the English ruling class tradition throughout the English-speaking world as (his mentor Professor at Oxford) Ruskin had wanted (Tragedy and Hope: 130-131).” It is interesting to note that former President Bill Clinton was a recipient of Rhodes Scholarship in 1968 along with extremely powerful and prominent individuals from predominantly the two political party paradigm including but not limited to Dean Rusk in 1931, U.S. Secretary of State, 1961-1969, in 1951 Richard N. Gardner U.S. Ambassador and CFR Director, in 1968 Strobe Talbott, American diplomat U.S. Deputy Secretary of State (1994-2001) and Time Magazine Editor-at-Large, Foreign Affairs journalist and President of the Brookings Institution, and in 1973 Richard N. Haass President of the Council on Foreign Relations and Director of the Policy Planning Staff at the U.S. Department of State, 2001-2003 (http://www.americanrhodes.org/). All of these individuals are members of the Council on Foreign Relations.

Dr. Quigley exposed their matrix of complete control over individuals and society:​
It is increasingly clear that, in the twentieth century, the expert will replace ... the democratic voter in control of the political system. Hopefully, the elements of choice and freedom may survive for the ordinary individual in that he may be free to make a choice between two opposing political groups (even if these groups have little policy choice within the parameters of policy established by the experts) and he may have the choice to switch his economic support from one large unit to another. But, in general, his freedom and choice will be controlled within very narrow alternatives by the fact that he will be numbered from birth and followed, as a number, through his educational training, his required military or other public service, his tax contributions, his health and medical requirements, and his final retirement and death benefits (Tragedy and Hope: 866).​
Perhaps, this is the reason why a third party candidate has never won a presidential election in the history of the United States. Just as importantly, Dr. Quigley attested to the forces that have controlled and continue to control England and the United States:​
The Liberal Party was not so closely controlled as was the Conservative Party, but its chief leaders were on intimate relations of friendship and cooperation with the Cecil Rhodes crowd… which was especially true of Lord Rosebery, who was prime minister in 1894-1895, and H. H. Asquith, who was prime minister in 1905-1915. Asquith married Margot Tennant . . . in 1894, and had Balfour as his chief witness at the ceremony. . . . In later years Balfour was the closest friend of the Asquiths even when they were leaders of two opposing parties (Tragedy and Hope: 475).…(likewise) There does exist, and has existed for a generation, an international Anglophile network which operates, to some extent, in the way the ... Right believes the Communists act. In fact, this network, which we may identify as the Round Table Groups, has no aversion to cooperating with the Communists, or any other groups, and frequently does so...I know of the operations of this network because I have studied it for twenty years and was permitted for two years, in the early 1960's, to examine its papers and secret records. I have no aversion to it or to most of its aims...but in general my chief difference of opinion is that it wishes to remain unknown, and I believe its role in history is significant enough to be known (Tragedy and Hope: 950).​
Dr. Quigley taught at Harvard where he received his undergraduate degrees and his doctorate. He also taught at Princeton and at the Industrial College of the Armed Forces in 1951. Moreover, he also taught in Africa at the Brookings Institution in 1961, and lectured at many other places, including the U.S. Naval Weapons Laboratory, the Foreign Service Institute of the State Department, and the Naval College at Norfolk, Virginia. In 1958, Dr. Quigley was both a consultant to the Congressional Select Committee that established the national space agency. Also, he was a collaborator in history to the Smithsonian Institution after 1957 assisting in the establishment of the Museum of History and Technology and in the summer of 1964 he served at the Navy Post-Graduate School in Monterey, California, as consultant to “Project Seabed,” a visualization and future design program of what American weapons systems would like in the 1970’s. In short, Dr. Quigley’s Circum Vitae is unequivocally scholarly, impressive, and indicative of the confidence by the Eastern Establishment and the security clearance from both the United States government during the Cold War.

Dr. Quigley’s Tragedy and Hope is loaded with far more revelations than this article can possibly cover here. However, Dr. Quigley’s provocative revelations may account for his “fall from grace” amongst the circles of the intellectual elite, the British Establishment, and the American Eastern Establishment all of which had trusted him to the extent of allowing him to access to their most coveted archives and inner workings. In fact, a few thousand copies of Tragedy and Hope were sold prior to the “accidental destruction” of the plates in an attempt to suppress subsequent editions from being printed according to a taped interview discovered in Quigley's archives at Georgetown University by Dr. Stanley Montieth (http://www.radioliberty.com/newbkvd.htm).

Exposing the truth about their nefarious “Great Plan, the Great Work, the Lost Word” is the most effective weapon each and every American patriot must utilize in restoring our Constitutional Republic.
 
I give up on this topic. You don't even seem to be trying to see it from my side. I can't convince you if you won't even consider what I'm talking about. Each point I make you have some argument put up. When I try to show you a jump in logic and explain why, you jump to another topic making another jump in logic. It's a continuing cycle and I'm getting very tired of it. I was just trying to get you to see there might be another explanation than some group bent on world domination manipulating the politics of every country and spying on every person. You want to see conspiracy theories, then fine. Believe them all you wish. We will simply agree to disagree.
I respect your persistence, I just wish you were more open to the other persons perspective and consider ideas that disagree with your own. You would then be an excellent debater. Perhaps its just this topic. Maybe we should debate on philosophy some time. Until then.
 
I give up on this topic. You don't even seem to be trying to see it from my side. I can't convince you if you won't even consider what I'm talking about. Each point I make you have some argument put up. When I try to show you a jump in logic and explain why, you jump to another topic making another jump in logic. It's a continuing cycle and I'm getting very tired of it. I was just trying to get you to see there might be another explanation than some group bent on world domination manipulating the politics of every country and spying on every person. You want to see conspiracy theories, then fine. Believe them all you wish. We will simply agree to disagree.
I respect your persistence, I just wish you were more open to the other persons perspective and consider ideas that disagree with your own. You would then be an excellent debater. Perhaps its just this topic. Maybe we should debate on philosophy some time. Until then.

They are not 'jumps in logic' if they are true

There is no debate here for me...i already know
 
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