Why dont avoid me now lol
rhetorics is just part of the layout...stop playing speech therapist sir. The thread title does what it says on the can lol
Scottish Independence
- Thread starter muir
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Why dont avoid me now lol
rhetorics is just part of the layout...stop playing speech therapist sir. The thread title does what it says on the can lol
muir
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That's a logical fallacy...you have set up a straw man by trying to say i am a 'speech therapist' for pointing out how you have offered no facts or figures but merely opinion which i fear you have swallowed from the tabloid papers and regurgitated out onto my thread about the beautiful subject scottish independance
I can't say i will miss the likes of your attacks on scottish self esteem that we in the north have become so accostomed to hearing in your bigoted press
If you watch any of the mainstream media talks, speeches and debates they all lack facts and fugures and substance....it's all rhetoric and that is why i am advising you not to get sucked into that because it is no more than emotinal manipulation
The financial facts in that clip above would urge any scot who is of sound mind to leave the union before it sinks (even the MSM media is talking about a 'great depression'....what they won't tell you is that it is going to hit England whether the union stays together or not)
You can also read posts of mine dating back years here warning about the coming great depression
Kanamori
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There are many uses for oil, plastics etc, but hemp can also be used in plastics and doesn't require doing God knows what to the oceans, not that using a bunch of super fertilized crops will necessarily be better.
muir
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I would be totally onboard with scotland growing hemp and legalising marijuana
Indeed i would expect a strong political voice to emerge post independance calling for the legalisation of pot
There was a hash cafe that opened in leith in defiance of the law but the police were on hand waiting and swooped as soon as the door opened
There would be many in support of the legalisation of marijuana in Scotland and with independance there will be opportunities to create new political parties any of which could put pot on the political map
Kanamori
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It would be a shame for it to be legal over here first, say what you will of Britain, but I felt that it was "protect and serve", at least for the most part, and not "prosecute and shoot" like it is in the States, from my experiences. With independence, Scotland could rule the UK/Ireland Marijuana trade
Something good about divying out legislative powers across smaller states anyway (cuz look at how many people die from marijuana compared to alcohol........................................................................ Ie, you'd have to replace the blood in your body with liquefied THC for it to ever kill you, and then you're dying from lack of oxygen [I mean, there aren't too many drugs where it is practically impossible to OD and kill yourself, ibuprofen or those will kill you with stomach bleeding long before pot, and ibuprofen is one of the few miracle drugs around]).
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muir
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It would be a shame for it to be legal over here first, say what you will of Britain, but I felt that it was "protect and serve", at least for the most part, and not "prosecute and shoot" like it is in the States, from my experiences. With independence, Scotland could rule the UK/Ireland Marijuana trade
The reality of pot here is that those that want to smoke it smoke it regardless of the law
The law makes criminals of hundreds of thousands of otherwise sensible, responsible, hard working, tax paying adults
If it was legalised it would boost tax, tourism and the quality of the gear
i haven't done nothing.
and fear not, im accustom to the media projects so i understand mainstream has its pros and cons.
To be real with you. The facts and numbers are not important to this thread. We are not here to do finacial economics.
The other thing about emotional manipulation was a low blow.
You somehow managed to allegedly "free" Scotland from the UK and land it in top Drug deals lol
you realy do remind me of that member yesterday lol who goes......."i dont do any drugs!!!!!" You know...on that psychotic anxiety thread haha shes obv on something haha
anyblah
We love scotland too. Ayyy would b sad to c dem leave. So sad. Really.
muir
Banned
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That's a double negative...it means you have done something
Yes we're setting sail into the wild blue yonder
You'll never see us again!
well, sail your boat. Just remember if you guys ever need the bank of england to bail your debts we will be here waiting....maybe. Depends on the weed crops.
And you will change your mind, at some point.
Ive noticed i live in England so.....don't know how it affects ¿us?
muir
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Bah ha ha!
Bail outs?
You must be joking!
There is NO MONEY LEFT in the public purse to bail out anyone....do you get it?
There will be no more bail outs
The next thing will be BAIL INS
This is where the banks reach into your bank account and take a percentage of your money directly from your account
This and a whole host of other events are what i hope to avoid by going indie
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Ah.... Yes...we did....But we're back under the boot heel of the old world power and now we need to do it again.
muir
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Looks this time like it is a global revolt!
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Scots created Scotch and as such rank among some of the finest human beings on the planet in my book.
Skarekrow
~~DEVIL~~
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It’s called satire people…
http://www.theonion.com/articles/da...lMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:1:Default
David Cameron To Scottish People: ‘I’ll Kill Myself If You Leave’
LONDON–
In an emotional public address this morning ahead of Thursday’s national referendum in Scotland, U.K. Prime Minister David Cameron pleaded with the Scottish people to stay and vowed that he would take his own life if the territory votes in favor of independence.
“Scotland, the second you leave I will kill myself–I swear I’ll do it,” said a visibly disheveled Cameron, who spoke with a shaking voice and appeared at several points during the speech as if he was on the verge of breaking down in tears.
“How can I go on living if you’re gone? If you vote yes to independence, that’s it–you can say goodbye to me right now, because I’ll be dead the next time you see me. Just look at what you’re doing to me!”
At press time, Cameron was seen sobbing softly and climbing up the stairs to the top of Parliament’s Elizabeth Tower.
http://www.theonion.com/articles/da...lMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:1:Default
David Cameron To Scottish People: ‘I’ll Kill Myself If You Leave’
LONDON–
In an emotional public address this morning ahead of Thursday’s national referendum in Scotland, U.K. Prime Minister David Cameron pleaded with the Scottish people to stay and vowed that he would take his own life if the territory votes in favor of independence.
“Scotland, the second you leave I will kill myself–I swear I’ll do it,” said a visibly disheveled Cameron, who spoke with a shaking voice and appeared at several points during the speech as if he was on the verge of breaking down in tears.
“How can I go on living if you’re gone? If you vote yes to independence, that’s it–you can say goodbye to me right now, because I’ll be dead the next time you see me. Just look at what you’re doing to me!”
At press time, Cameron was seen sobbing softly and climbing up the stairs to the top of Parliament’s Elizabeth Tower.
muir
Banned
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It’s called satire people…
http://www.theonion.com/articles/da...lMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:1:Default
David Cameron To Scottish People: ‘I’ll Kill Myself If You Leave’
LONDON—
In an emotional public address this morning ahead of Thursday’s national referendum in Scotland, U.K. Prime Minister David Cameron pleaded with the Scottish people to stay and vowed that he would take his own life if the territory votes in favor of independence.
“Scotland, the second you leave I will kill myself—I swear I’ll do it,” said a visibly disheveled Cameron, who spoke with a shaking voice and appeared at several points during the speech as if he was on the verge of breaking down in tears.
“How can I go on living if you’re gone? If you vote yes to independence, that’s it—you can say goodbye to me right now, because I’ll be dead the next time you see me. Just look at what you’re doing to me!”
At press time, Cameron was seen sobbing softly and climbing up the stairs to the top of Parliament’s Elizabeth Tower.
Nothing would boost the YES vote more
muir
Banned
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http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/16/media-shafted-people-scotland-journalists
[h=1]How the media shafted the people of Scotland[/h] Journalists in their gilded circles are woefully out of touch with popular sentiment and shamefully slur any desire for change
George Monbiot
The Guardian,
Tuesday 16 September 2014 20.03 BST
‘Here is the chronic inability to distinguish between a cause and a person: the referendum is widely portrayed as a vote about Alex Salmond … a Telegraph *editorial *compared him to Robert Mugabe.’ Photograph: Andrew Milligan/PA Perhaps the most arresting fact about the Scottish referendum is this: that there is no newspaper – local, regional or national, English or Scottish – that supports independence except the Sunday Herald. The Scots who will vote yes have been almost without representation in the media.
There is nothing unusual about this. Change in any direction, except further over the brink of market fundamentalism and planetary destruction, requires the defiance of almost the entire battery of salaried opinion. What distinguishes the independence campaign is that it has continued to prosper despite this assault.
In the coverage of the referendum we see most of the pathologies of the corporate media. Here, for instance, you will find the unfounded generalisations with which less enlightened souls are characterised. In the Spectator, Simon Heffer maintains that: “addicted to welfare ... Scots embraced the something for nothing society”, objecting to the poll tax “because many of them felt that paying taxes ought to be the responsibility of someone else”.
Here is the condescension with which the dominant classes have always treated those they regard as inferior: their serfs, the poor, the Irish, Africans, anyone with whom they disagree. “What spoilt, selfish, childlike fools those Scots are ... They simply don’t have a clue how lucky they are,” sneered Melanie Reid in the Times. Here is the chronic inability to distinguish between a cause and a person: the referendum is widely portrayed as a vote about Alex Salmond, who is then monstered beyond recognition (a Telegraph editorial compared him to Robert Mugabe).
The problem with the media is exemplified by Dominic Lawson’s column for the Daily Mail last week. He began with Scotland, comparing the “threat” of independence with that presented by Hitler (the article was helpfully illustrated with a picture of the Führer – unaccompanied, in this case, by the Mail’s former proprietor). Then he turned to the momentous issue of how he almost wrote something inaccurate about David Attenborough, which was narrowly averted because “as it happens, last weekend we had staying with us another of the BBC’s great figures, its world affairs editor John Simpson”, who happily corrected Lawson’s mistake. This was just as well because “the next day I went to the Royal Albert Hall as one of a small number of guests invited by the Proms director for that night’s performance. And who should I see as soon as I entered the little room set aside for our group’s pre-concert drinks? Sir David Attenborough.”
Those who are supposed to hold power to account live in a rarefied, self-referential world of power, circulating among people as exalted as themselves, the “small number of guests” who receive the most charming invitations. That a senior journalist at the BBC should be the house guest of a columnist for the Daily Mail surprises me not one iota.
In June the BBC’s economics editor, Robert Peston, complained that BBC news “is completely obsessed by the agenda set by newspapers … If we think the Mail and Telegraph will lead with this, we should. It’s part of the culture.” This might help to explain why the BBC has attracted so many complaints of bias in favour of the no campaign.
Living within their tiny circle of light, most senior journalists seem unable to comprehend a desire for change. If they notice it at all, they perceive it as a mortal threat, comparable perhaps to Hitler. They know as little of the lives of the 64 million inhabiting the outer darkness as they do of the Andaman islanders. Yet, lecturing the poor from under the wisteria, they claim to speak for the nation.
As John Harris reports in the Guardian, both north and south of the border “politics as usual suddenly seems so lost as to look completely absurd”. But to those within the circle, politics still begins and ends in Westminster. The opinions of no one beyond the gilded thousand with whom they associate is worthy of notice. Throughout the years I’ve spent working with protest movements and trying to bring neglected issues to light, one consistent theme has emerged: with a few notable exceptions, journalists are always among the last to twig that things have changed. It’s no wonder that the Scottish opinion polls took them by surprise.
One of the roles of the Guardian, which has no proprietor, is to represent the unrepresented – and it often does so to great effect. On Scottish independence I believe we have fallen short. Our leader on Saturday used the frames constructed by the rest of the press, inflating a couple of incidents into a “habit” by yes campaigners of “attacking the messenger and ignoring the message”, judging the long-term future of the nation by current SNP policy, confusing self-determination with nationalism.
If Westminster is locked into a paralysing neoliberal consensus it is partly because the corporate media, owned and staffed by its beneficiaries, demands it. Any party that challenges this worldview is ruthlessly disciplined. Any party that more noisily promotes corporate power is lauded and championed. Ukip, though it claims to be kicking against the establishment, owes much of its success to the corporate press.
For a moment, Rupert Murdoch appeared ready to offer one of his Faustian bargains to the Scottish National party: my papers for your soul. That offer now seems to have been withdrawn, as he has decided that Salmond’s SNP is “not talking about independence, but more welfarism, expensive greenery, etc and passing sovereignty to Brussels” and that it “must change course to prosper if he wins”. It’s not an observation, it’s a warning: if you win independence and pursue this agenda, my newspapers will destroy you.
Despite the rise of social media, the established media continues to define the scope of representative politics in Britain, to shape political demands and to punish and erase those who resist. It is one chamber of the corrupt heart of Britain, pumping fear, misinformation and hatred around the body politic.
That so many Scots, lambasted from all quarters as fools, frauds and ingrates, have refused to be bullied is itself a political triumph. If they vote for independence, they will do so in defiance not only of the Westminster consensus but also of its enforcers: the detached, complacent people who claim to speak on their behalf.
[h=1]How the media shafted the people of Scotland[/h] Journalists in their gilded circles are woefully out of touch with popular sentiment and shamefully slur any desire for change
George Monbiot
The Guardian,
Tuesday 16 September 2014 20.03 BST
‘Here is the chronic inability to distinguish between a cause and a person: the referendum is widely portrayed as a vote about Alex Salmond … a Telegraph *editorial *compared him to Robert Mugabe.’ Photograph: Andrew Milligan/PA Perhaps the most arresting fact about the Scottish referendum is this: that there is no newspaper – local, regional or national, English or Scottish – that supports independence except the Sunday Herald. The Scots who will vote yes have been almost without representation in the media.
There is nothing unusual about this. Change in any direction, except further over the brink of market fundamentalism and planetary destruction, requires the defiance of almost the entire battery of salaried opinion. What distinguishes the independence campaign is that it has continued to prosper despite this assault.
In the coverage of the referendum we see most of the pathologies of the corporate media. Here, for instance, you will find the unfounded generalisations with which less enlightened souls are characterised. In the Spectator, Simon Heffer maintains that: “addicted to welfare ... Scots embraced the something for nothing society”, objecting to the poll tax “because many of them felt that paying taxes ought to be the responsibility of someone else”.
Here is the condescension with which the dominant classes have always treated those they regard as inferior: their serfs, the poor, the Irish, Africans, anyone with whom they disagree. “What spoilt, selfish, childlike fools those Scots are ... They simply don’t have a clue how lucky they are,” sneered Melanie Reid in the Times. Here is the chronic inability to distinguish between a cause and a person: the referendum is widely portrayed as a vote about Alex Salmond, who is then monstered beyond recognition (a Telegraph editorial compared him to Robert Mugabe).
The problem with the media is exemplified by Dominic Lawson’s column for the Daily Mail last week. He began with Scotland, comparing the “threat” of independence with that presented by Hitler (the article was helpfully illustrated with a picture of the Führer – unaccompanied, in this case, by the Mail’s former proprietor). Then he turned to the momentous issue of how he almost wrote something inaccurate about David Attenborough, which was narrowly averted because “as it happens, last weekend we had staying with us another of the BBC’s great figures, its world affairs editor John Simpson”, who happily corrected Lawson’s mistake. This was just as well because “the next day I went to the Royal Albert Hall as one of a small number of guests invited by the Proms director for that night’s performance. And who should I see as soon as I entered the little room set aside for our group’s pre-concert drinks? Sir David Attenborough.”
Those who are supposed to hold power to account live in a rarefied, self-referential world of power, circulating among people as exalted as themselves, the “small number of guests” who receive the most charming invitations. That a senior journalist at the BBC should be the house guest of a columnist for the Daily Mail surprises me not one iota.
In June the BBC’s economics editor, Robert Peston, complained that BBC news “is completely obsessed by the agenda set by newspapers … If we think the Mail and Telegraph will lead with this, we should. It’s part of the culture.” This might help to explain why the BBC has attracted so many complaints of bias in favour of the no campaign.
Living within their tiny circle of light, most senior journalists seem unable to comprehend a desire for change. If they notice it at all, they perceive it as a mortal threat, comparable perhaps to Hitler. They know as little of the lives of the 64 million inhabiting the outer darkness as they do of the Andaman islanders. Yet, lecturing the poor from under the wisteria, they claim to speak for the nation.
As John Harris reports in the Guardian, both north and south of the border “politics as usual suddenly seems so lost as to look completely absurd”. But to those within the circle, politics still begins and ends in Westminster. The opinions of no one beyond the gilded thousand with whom they associate is worthy of notice. Throughout the years I’ve spent working with protest movements and trying to bring neglected issues to light, one consistent theme has emerged: with a few notable exceptions, journalists are always among the last to twig that things have changed. It’s no wonder that the Scottish opinion polls took them by surprise.
One of the roles of the Guardian, which has no proprietor, is to represent the unrepresented – and it often does so to great effect. On Scottish independence I believe we have fallen short. Our leader on Saturday used the frames constructed by the rest of the press, inflating a couple of incidents into a “habit” by yes campaigners of “attacking the messenger and ignoring the message”, judging the long-term future of the nation by current SNP policy, confusing self-determination with nationalism.
If Westminster is locked into a paralysing neoliberal consensus it is partly because the corporate media, owned and staffed by its beneficiaries, demands it. Any party that challenges this worldview is ruthlessly disciplined. Any party that more noisily promotes corporate power is lauded and championed. Ukip, though it claims to be kicking against the establishment, owes much of its success to the corporate press.
For a moment, Rupert Murdoch appeared ready to offer one of his Faustian bargains to the Scottish National party: my papers for your soul. That offer now seems to have been withdrawn, as he has decided that Salmond’s SNP is “not talking about independence, but more welfarism, expensive greenery, etc and passing sovereignty to Brussels” and that it “must change course to prosper if he wins”. It’s not an observation, it’s a warning: if you win independence and pursue this agenda, my newspapers will destroy you.
Despite the rise of social media, the established media continues to define the scope of representative politics in Britain, to shape political demands and to punish and erase those who resist. It is one chamber of the corrupt heart of Britain, pumping fear, misinformation and hatred around the body politic.
That so many Scots, lambasted from all quarters as fools, frauds and ingrates, have refused to be bullied is itself a political triumph. If they vote for independence, they will do so in defiance not only of the Westminster consensus but also of its enforcers: the detached, complacent people who claim to speak on their behalf.
tfg345i4u5lw
On Holiday
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http://www.marketwatch.com/story/scotland-vote-to-stay-in-uk-projections-show-2014-09-19
badabingbadaboom
Scotland votes no
badabingbadaboom
Scotland votes no
D
Deleted member 10171
Crikey! I missed all the action! Went to bed yesterday night and was so focused on work that I had completely forgotten about the referendum!
Woke up this morning to the Guardian/ Telegraph news feed & was shocked to find that Scotland has rejected independence!
I'm pleased that the UK is not being split up. I do hope that the Scottish people's cry for change will genuinely lead OUR government to work towards a greater sense of unity that will benefit everyone. Let's also not forget that the EU is our one common enemy!
Woke up this morning to the Guardian/ Telegraph news feed & was shocked to find that Scotland has rejected independence!
I'm pleased that the UK is not being split up. I do hope that the Scottish people's cry for change will genuinely lead OUR government to work towards a greater sense of unity that will benefit everyone. Let's also not forget that the EU is our one common enemy!
muir
Banned
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No there will not be a greater sense of unity
The vote was 45% to 55% which shows a deeply divided country
There are also divisions in Northern Ireland as we all know, there is also a divide in England with the northern English increasingly disgrunteld that all the wealth and power is being sucked down into London
There is also a divide in Wales as they watch their properties bought up by English absentee landlords
So there is no unity in the UK just deep divisions that i anticipate will get worse as the economy gets worse and also with the creation of the high speed railway which i think will further benefit London at the expense of other regions of the UK
Our governments prime concern is not unity and neither do i believe will it deliver on its promises to the Scots to give them more devolved powers
The UK governments prime concern is doing what the global investors that it is indebted to want it to do. the global investors want the status quo to remain so the British government is not interested in change.
What they will do is what they always do which is to maintain the status quo whislt trying to conceal that behind a smoke screen of lies and empty promises
On a positive note 45% of Scots have woken upto that, on a negative note 55% of Scots haven't
However perhaps many of those 55% are aware that the government are liars who never deliver on promises but have voted out of fear
I think the YES vote was a vote for change which is born out of hope
The NO vote was a vote for more of the same which is a vote born out of fear
The fear mongering of the UK politicial class has possibly swayed many Scots who in their fear induced tunnel vision have then lost sight of the wider picture
The wider picture is that the figures the government provide for inflation are incorrect as they do not include food and energy and yet anyone on the street can see that food and energy prices are going UP!
Inflation will destroy the savings of the short sightedly cautious middle class who have voted NO
The other thing that will happen is we will now be dragged into more wars including the one being stoked in the middle east. ISIS (controlled by the CIA, Mossad & MI5) will continue to provoke westren countries until they take some sort of military action in the middle east)
ISIS will stage faked beheadings of people from the various countries that the powers that be want to suck into the conflict and it will stage provocative false flag attacks like the one in Australia to try and suck them into the conflict
Ultimately the real target though is Assad and beyond him Iran and Russia
So the NO vote will keep us tied into whatever crazy project NATO want to pursue
It will also drag us into the faillng fiat currencies as the petrodollar collapses and the pound suffers with it
There really are no positives to take from the situation
The FEAR vote has carried the day.....and the older generation who have passed on the age of austerity to the younger generation have helped to not only pass on an unstable world with a damaged environment and a corrupt political class dominated by the central bankers, that harbours high level peodophile rings, but they have also voted to prevent the younger generation from making the changes needed to counter that
We need to keep the SNP in power, wait for the economy to worsen to try and radicalise more of the populace and hold another referendum and next time vote YES
Concerning the EU being our one common enemy that is only partially true. The EU is nothing more than a vehicle of the globalist central bankers. The globalists are already in our country controlling our economy and government. So the EU is not the sole problem...the roots of the problem are in our country and they need to be rooted out
If you focus on the EU then you will fail to see that many of the architects of the EU are living in our country and pulling the economic and political strings
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