The End of Firefox

CrazyBeautiful said:
Telling you what now? If it's that I thought your type of logic is flawed, then I thought that was self-evident in my responses. And if you were referring to me stating that I was not trying to be rude, well, I hardly think disagreeing with someone would be considered rude.

In your words:

CrazyBeautiful said:
Telling you what now? If it's that I thought your type of logic is flawed, then I thought that was self-evident in my responses. And if you were referring to me stating that I was not trying to be rude, well, I hardly think disagreeing with someone would be considered rude.

In your words:

"If hate means "to passionately or intensely dislike someone or something.", than yes, I do hate homosexuality. I'm a Christian, and I think homosexuality is sin. We are commanded in Bible to hate sin, but love the siners. So yes, I do hate homosexuality. But I have nothing against gay people. They are responsible for their values, decisions and lifes."

^^^ News Flash: Gay people are homosexuals. Therefore....
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Therefore WHAT? SAY it, say what's on your mind!, so I can reply to you and end this non-sense.
I'm tired of your accusations, and reading beetwen lines words or affirmations that don't belong to me.

And I don't feel that I am being harsh at all. I am trying to point out a different perspective to you. One that involves love and acceptance of others, not hatred towards a persons sexual preferences just because they are different than your own. I AM showing you love and affection in these posts, you just choose to see that I am being harsh. Not so.
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Is that what you understood from me saying this?:
If I would reverse the love accusation, its like I would say to you: "I'm having a hard time seeing love in your posts. You are so harsh with me. You never show me love and affection in your posts." Does this sound like a good argument to you against love?
Its a good argument for love as childrens understand it.
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I didn't had been enough clear? I wan't saying your harsh, I was shoing you the naivety of your lack of love accusation, that you "are having a hard time seeing love in my post" (to quote you) by a example. Its how children see love. I could say online to you that I'm so affectionate and loving with gay people, and so accepting, and yet in reality hating them. Children's look at appearences, not adults.

And by the way, I have no problems with harshness. As long as you telling me the truth. Say what is on your mind. Don't speak in ambiguities.


I respect that you are a devout Christian, but I think where your argument falls short with me is when you try to base your opinion in religion and prooftexts from the bible. It would be one thing if you said, "I feel this way. Regardless of religion".
When you throw religion into the mix, then the are too many ways to poke holes in that argument.
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Well, I am a religious person. Therefore, I can give you a opinion, but I don't think it would be really independent from Christianity.
I am a Christian. I have christian values, and I see the world by these values.

If the bible said that homosexuality and same sex marriage was acceptable, would you hold a different view?
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Of course. But you know why? Because the Bible would have been right, would have speak the truth, because the Bible is Word of God.
But since Bible says what it says know, it means to me that things are this way, sotherefore, the possibility of the Bible saying other things, could be true only as a imagination exercise, but not a possible reality. Truth is actual, present, and never changing.
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sprinkles said:
It would imply for example that rocks could be possibly sinful.
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Are rocks made out of dough and chocolate chips? Because if so, I would have to agree.
 
Stu said:
To not accept that evil and sin are divine creations is to invite the repression of evil in yourself. Repression of evil will only make it stronger.

I do think it is unfair that you are being pilloried for your beliefs. There are and have been many forum members who believe as you do and this kind of spiraling arguments has been repeated many times on this site.

Know this, in the west there is a strong movement to disengage sexuality between consulting adults and scripture.

In the Mennonite church today, like literally this week, there is a movement to expel churches that have hired practicing, monogamous homosexual pastors. These pastors have studied your scriptures and do not see the clear cut evil that you believe exists in homosexuality.

If you want to argue scripture, find some folks that are as well versed in it as you and argue it.

Simply calling something a sin because you claim, by your reading of scripture, it is not what your god intended is just a heap of smell bullshit.

BTW

The petition, hosted on the Credoaction website
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When one brings this to a logical analysis of what is true, they should not expect things to be bent to harbor their beliefs.

If one doesn't want to play this game then don't bring the ball into this court.
 
LucyJr said:
because the Bible is Word of God.
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The bible is NOT the word of God. The bible was physically written by man and knowing that man is imperfect and sinful as you do, you know they could never accurately write Gods words down in a way that was entirely accurate to what he\it intended.
 
Eventhorizon said:
Ok. I cant help it. [MENTION=9401]LucyJr[/MENTION] you believe that Gods word is Gods word yes? Gods word should be obeyed without question? Explain to me why people moved away from the old testament then, the original of Gods word.
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Well from where do you know they did move it?
 
Stu said:
Simply calling something a sin because you claim, by your reading of scripture, it is not what your god intended is just a heap of smell bullshit.
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I don't know if your are implying you need direct quotes or if you simply don't believe the bible therefore her opinion of sin is bullshit.
 
Eventhorizon said:
The bible is NOT the word of God. The bible was physically written by man and knowing that man is imperfect and sinful as you do, you know they could never accurately write Gods words down in a way that was entirely accurate to what he\it intended.
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There are a few thoughts on this. One is that the bible is 100% gods word and the other is that Gods word is contained within the book. The old testament being a historical account of man's relationship with God and the introduction of Gods law, 10 commandements. The new testament being breathed by the Holy spirit. In some cases Paul defines what he says as either his opinion of what would be good for us and what is from God speaking through him with the holy spirit.
 
sprinkles said:
What does this mean? What makes a possibility 'actualized'?
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Happening or not. Actualised means made to be real, to be present. Otherwise, its just a possibility, which is not existent.
A possibility must be actualized the moment it becomes possible otherwise the thing which is supposed to be possible cannot happen which makes it not possible.
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Let's say I have the possbility to write you this post with bold letters. Its a possbility. Its a possible way in which reality can be.
The possibility is actualised and become a reality only when I, by free will, decide to writte with bold letters.
Nevertheless, If I wouldn't do that, that possibility would have never been actualised, and it would never exist. Only as a possibility, in my mind, as a thought. But not a way in which reality, the actual world, can be.
In philosophy, actual world is taken to mean the brute reality, with possibilitites actualised. Possible worlds (which are considered to be infinite), can be in the long time actualised (for example, someone, or even I, might writte to you with bold letters in the future), but it doesn't mean if they can be actualised, they necessarely will be actualised.
And a impossible world would be a world, or a reality that by all standards, is not possible. For example, theere is not a single possibility for i to become a God, with all His attributes (I'm talking about the Christian God). therefore, that world, in whcih I am God, is impossible. That's the nature of existence.

If you're saying that a possibility becomes only actualized when the possible event actually happens then this is a contradiction because the event must first be possible in order to happen which means there must be an actualized possibility before the event happens.
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Not necessarely. For a event or a action to be transformed into reality or actualised, it only has to be possible.
 
Grayman said:
I don't like if a kid enters my property without asking. I don't hate trespassers or the kid, I just don't much like trespassing.
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If I release a bunch of lunatics from an asylum and they come and trespass on your property, eat your dog, and pee all over your furniture, am I not culpable even though I don't directly control their actions, and didn't even put them up to it? All I did was let them be free. They're doing their own stuff, not me. I have nothing to do with it, right?
 
LucyJr said:
Well from where do you know they did move it?
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No one follows the Old Testament anymore. Or at least the vast majority does not. They look to the King James version instead.
 
LucyJr said:
Happening or not. Actualised means made to be real, to be present. Otherwise, its just a possibility, which is not existent.

Let's say I have the possbility to write you this post with bold letters. Its a possbility. Its a possible way in which reality can be.
The possibility is actualised and become a reality only when I, by free will, decide to writte with bold letters.
Nevertheless, If I wouldn't do that, that possibility would have never been actualised, and it would never exist. Only as a possibility, in my mind, as a thought. But not a way in which reality, the actual world, can be.
In philosophy, actual world is taken to mean the brute reality, with possibilitites actualised. Possible worlds (which are considered to be infinite), can be in the long time actualised (for example, someone, or even I, might writte to you with bold letters in the future), but it doesn't mean if they can be actualised, they necessarely will be actualised.
And a impossible world would be a world, or a reality that by all standards, is not possible. For example, theere is not a single possibility for i to become a God, with all His attributes (I'm talking about the Christian God). therefore, that world, in whcih I am God, is impossible. That's the nature of existence.


Not necessarely. For a event or a action to be transformed into reality or actualised, it only has to be possible.
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You won't write in bold letters if the possibility is not already actual.

The possibility of writing in bold letters is very much actualized by there being a large and bold 'B' button up there on the tool bar, and it is also already actualized by the function being programmed into the forum.

Your analogy is invalid, as is your hypothesis.
 
sprinkles said:
If I release a bunch of lunatics from an asylum and they come and trespass on your property, eat your dog, and pee all over your furniture, am I not culpable even though I don't directly control their actions, and didn't even put them up to it? All I did was let them be free. They're doing their own stuff, not me. I have nothing to do with it, right?
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Did you know theywere going to do that?... God did but i'm sure there was a good reason.
 
Stu said:
To not accept that evil and sin are divine creations is to invite the repression of evil in yourself. Repression of evil will only make it stronger.
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What?????

I do think it is unfair that you are being pilloried for your beliefs. There are and have been many forum members who believe as you do and this kind of spiraling arguments has been repeated many times on this site.

Know this, in the west there is a strong movement to disengage sexuality between consulting adults and scripture.

In the Mennonite church today, like literally this week, there is a movement to expel churches that have hired practicing, monogamous homosexual pastors. These pastors have studied your scriptures and do not see the clear cut evil that you believe exists in homosexuality.
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I know, and it was all prophecied in Bible. It says that would come 'techers' that twist the truth, to make itr sound good and confortable.

Simply calling something a sin because you claim, by your reading of scripture, it is not what your god intended is just a heap of smell bullshit.
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You can read yourself Bible.
And this is not my subjective interpretation of Bible. This is 2.000 years Christianity.

Romans 1:
18.The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness,
19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them.
20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities–his eternal power and divine nature–have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened.
22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools
23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another.
25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator–who is forever praised. Amen.

26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones.
27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.

28 Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done.

29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips,
30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents;
31 they have no understanding, no fidelity, no love, no mercy.
32 Although they know God’s righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.
 
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