[INTJ] What's INTJ's thought process when he says/acts this way?

Oh well there you go... it's a bloody ARIES, isn't it?


I've been following this thread for a while, intrigued by the subtext that you're communicating between the lines. You're asking about 'INTJs', but it's that subtextual context which determines what our responses are going to be.

As I think @acd and @Reason picked up on, there's some fishy fuckery going on here that you haven't been particularly forthcoming about, and I suspect that it's this that is determining his behaviour.

In particular, it's this:



Are these 'obstacles' you're speaking of actually real, living, breathing human beings with emotional attachments to the both of you? Is he still in a relationship with another person?

You've done a lot of cognitive distancing in the language that you use to refer to these 'obstacles', including making sure you refer to them as going on longer than they 'should have', thereby placing a premature 'end' to relationships which, for all practical purposes, are/were still ongoing.

This serves to abrogate yourself of any responsibility or guilt of overlapping relationships - at the very least I think you're aware that you engaged in some emotional infidelity towards the tail end of your relationship, and who knows about the guy.

So you're building a picture here of the two of you constructing a narrative which functions to smother whatever subconscious guilt you might be feeling. The other partners are dehumanised as 'obstacles', and the relationships they invested in as having gone on 'longer than they should have'.

Of course, the problem here is that it's ersatz or artificial closure - you're performing a language spell on your long-term partners to attempt to banish them into the past, whereas what you really ought to be doing is taking some time to disconnect properly from the relationships.

It's not difficult to understand why your INTJ is feeling weird about things if this is the context, and so I'd have to agree with Reason.


Now, I happen to be an INTJ myself apparently, so to answer your questions:

I've never put anyone in a position of emotional ambiguity like that, and I'm pretty clear with my intentions and position. INTJs, with that tertiary Fi, tend to be black-and-white like that, and so I'd agree with @acd's experience. If your chap is INTJ, then the ambiguous position he's put you in indicates that he's in some serious turmoil.


This week, I've been thinking a lot about Dune, and the week before it was fighter jets. Just tons and tons of fighter jets.



If my assessment isn't totally off, you're the source of his turmoil. You're the kernel of his guilt. He's robbed a bank and you're the dirty bag of cash under his bed; the symbolic embodiment of said guilt. He needs to get as far away from your influence as possible in order to figure out what the 'right thing to do' is. I don't think your absence is really anything to do with either of you as much as it's a necessary condition of navigating the situation.

If he's said he loves you, then he does. If he's said he wants to be with you, then he does. INTJs are pretty solid on what they want.

Maintain the distance, but reach out to push him on his commitment.

Hey Deleted member 16771,

Thanks for taking the time out to share that really thorough response! I really appreciate it. I can understand why you'd think that without much context and I'd rather not get into the weed of things, so I'll private message you to share a bit more details.
 
Hey Deleted member 16771,

Thanks for taking the time out to share that really thorough response! I really appreciate it. I can understand why you'd think that without much context and I'd rather not get into the weed of things, so I'll private message you to share a bit more details.
Okidoki, totally understandable :)
 
Hi!

I'm an INFJ and he's an INTJ. We've had such an insanely long history of liking each other (think 10 years), but due to circumstances, we never got a chance to be together. During this period of time, we'd reconnect then disconnect, reconnect and then disconnect... This goes on for about 10 years. Recently, we reconnected, but again, the timing is really bad, yet, we gave it a try anyway. Things were really hot and heavy very fast, saying "I love you" very early on and everything in between–I think we were both rushing and compensating for the times we lost over the years.

Anyway, we did struggle to find footing because of the less-than-ideal timing I mentioned and it led him to basically saying he doesn't feel good about our current "situation" and that he'd like to slow things down and take a step back. He wants to properly date me and get to know me, but not like this. Most importantly, he added that he still wanted an opportunity for us to be together. Now, I'm not a fussy lover, if you tell me you need something, I take it quite literally. So I asked him if by "slowing things down," he'd like to give each other space and time apart, and then we can reconnect later? He said yes and I left it at that–no more questions asked.

This all happened two weeks ago. Other than reaching out to him to wish him a happy birthday a week after we had this conversation–and we told each other we missed one another–I've basically had no contact with him at all.

What is your experience with/as INTJs when they/you feel and say something like this?

What are you guys thinking?

And am I doing the right thing here?

Thanks all.

I’m a HUGE advocate of space, in moderation. Be playful! Be yourself, that’s what’s always attracted him. You hit it off because, and I’m projecting here, you understand each other differently than anyone and it’s awesome!!!!

Go with space, but don’t freeze, or be scared. Be yourself!
 
Do consider yourself lucky you were able to express yourself. I had this love for an intj and he had it for me and neither of us told each other, until he was already engaged, and his old roommate told me. I cried for like, a year.

also, he basically made a decision based on the facts, according to him, which are in fact biased no matter what they tell themselves, by their inferior feeling, and those facts were that he could never provide for me the way I needed emotionally. That’s a pure reflection of his sense of self and UTTERLY DEVASTATING.
 
Hi Reason,

I was single for some time when I met him. At that point, he was just getting into a relationship. Then a few years later, I got into a very long term relationship (my current ex). Some time after I got into my relationship, he was just getting out of the one I mentioned above. Both of our relationships combined lasted really long when they really shouldn't have. We knew we had deep feelings for each other but never really communicated it. Things just lingered all these years. We'd check in on each other for 1-2 months consistently then go completely silent for months–at some points, it lasted years–because we'd develop such strong feelings for each other, we'd get afraid of betraying our significant others so we'd cut communication off. So, this was how we kept missing each other.

The headaches... Right?


Just one kiss on my lips
Was all it took to seal the future
Just one look from your eyes
Was like a certain kind of torture

Once upon a time
There was a boy
And there was a girl

Just one touch from your hands
Was all it took to make me falter

Forbidden love
Are we supposed to be together
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
We seal the destiny forever
Forbidden love
Forbidden love

Just one smile on your face
Was all it took to change my fortune
Just one word from your mouth
Was all I needed to be certain

Once upon a time
There was a boy
There was a girl
Hearts that intertwine
They lived in a different kind of world

Forbidden love
Are we supposed to be together
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
We seal the destiny forever
Forbidden love
Forbidden love

Just one kiss
Just one touch
Just one look

Forbidden love
Are we supposed to be together
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
We seal the destiny forever
Forbidden love
Forbidden love

Forbidden love
Are we supposed to be together
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
We seal the destiny forever
Forbidden love
Forbidden love

Just one kiss
Just one touch
Just one look
Just one love

My heart feels for you... I wish you peace of mind and lots of love. Don't worry everything will turn out just as it should... <3
 

Just one kiss on my lips
Was all it took to seal the future
Just one look from your eyes
Was like a certain kind of torture

Once upon a time
There was a boy
And there was a girl

Just one touch from your hands
Was all it took to make me falter

Forbidden love
Are we supposed to be together
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
We seal the destiny forever
Forbidden love
Forbidden love

Just one smile on your face
Was all it took to change my fortune
Just one word from your mouth
Was all I needed to be certain

Once upon a time
There was a boy
There was a girl
Hearts that intertwine
They lived in a different kind of world

Forbidden love
Are we supposed to be together
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
We seal the destiny forever
Forbidden love
Forbidden love

Just one kiss
Just one touch
Just one look

Forbidden love
Are we supposed to be together
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
We seal the destiny forever
Forbidden love
Forbidden love

Forbidden love
Are we supposed to be together
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
Forbidden love
We seal the destiny forever
Forbidden love
Forbidden love

Just one kiss
Just one touch
Just one look
Just one love

My heart feels for you... I wish you peace of mind and lots of love. Don't worry everything will turn out just as it should... <3
Oh boy.
 
Update: We are still experiencing a lot of pushing and pulling. Everytime I think we've overcome something, something else comes up that makes him upset and he goes silent again. I'm realizing that my INTJ may appear confident, hard, and cold on the outside, but man is he the most sensitive person internally.

Anyway, in our recent conflict, he went cold. I have finally urged him to come out of his shell to talk to me about it. I'm hoping to make our conversation really productive so that we can both learn how to be better at confronting conflicts and most importantly, how to better be there for each other when problems arise. I just don't want him to always feel like his problems and negative feelings are his own only and only he can deal with them. I want to be there and be a safe space for him to open up – and half his burden.

He's been in very turbulent relationships prior so I can only assume that's why he reacts the way he does. How do I undo this distrust/pessimism he often resorts to, guys? Any tips? How can I get him to trust that I can handle and that I'm a safe space for him to express himself?
 
I'm realizing that my INTJ may appear confident, hard, and cold on the outside, but man is he the most sensitive person internally.

This made me chuckle because my husband is the exact same!

In my experience, to earn his trust you need to be consistent in what you say and do. I've come to learn that if he doesn't want to disclose what's bothering he won't when he feels he is being pushed, most likely give him time and space but also show you're not someone who has time for this kind of behaviour and he will come and talk to you. I understand he has been in a turbulent relationship and that's affected him but he also needs to understand and know you're not someone that will hang around forever nor will you be a push over (just don't allow it even if you do!!).

However, there are some things my husband just won't disclose because he feels like he can fix it himself and he doesn't need anyone else's input. Purely because he doesn't want to show that he is weak so in those instances I leave him to it. I do however make it clear that I don't appreciate his cold behaviour and he will take it on board and apologise and ensure he doesn't do it again. You just have to be patient if you really want it to work just ensure you don't become a push over.

I hope I have given some kind of satisfactory answer and if not my apologies.
 
Hi!

I'm an INFJ and he's an INTJ. We've had such an insanely long history of liking each other (think 10 years), but due to circumstances, we never got a chance to be together. During this period of time, we'd reconnect then disconnect, reconnect and then disconnect... This goes on for about 10 years. Recently, we reconnected, but again, the timing is really bad, yet, we gave it a try anyway. Things were really hot and heavy very fast, saying "I love you" very early on and everything in between–I think we were both rushing and compensating for the times we lost over the years.

Anyway, we did struggle to find footing because of the less-than-ideal timing I mentioned and it led him to basically saying he doesn't feel good about our current "situation" and that he'd like to slow things down and take a step back. He wants to properly date me and get to know me, but not like this. Most importantly, he added that he still wanted an opportunity for us to be together. Now, I'm not a fussy lover, if you tell me you need something, I take it quite literally. So I asked him if by "slowing things down," he'd like to give each other space and time apart, and then we can reconnect later? He said yes and I left it at that–no more questions asked.

This all happened two weeks ago. Other than reaching out to him to wish him a happy birthday a week after we had this conversation–and we told each other we missed one another–I've basically had no contact with him at all.

What is your experience with/as INTJs when they/you feel and say something like this?

What are you guys thinking?

And am I doing the right thing here?

Thanks all.
I can relate to the scenario (I'm INTJ).

I love my solitude and independence probably more than I'm able to love any person. Nevertheless, I also feel love for people and the desire to maintain my relationship. It's an annoying contradictory position to be in, and makes commitment very unappealing.

To me nothing seems to ruin a pleasant relationship more than when the other person's expectations about time availability rises past the threshold where I still feel independent.

My current partner has her own sense of independence, and while we are exclusive and committed, we are not obligated, it's almost ideal.
 
This made me chuckle because my husband is the exact same!

In my experience, to earn his trust you need to be consistent in what you say and do. I've come to learn that if he doesn't want to disclose what's bothering he won't when he feels he is being pushed, most likely give him time and space but also show you're not someone who has time for this kind of behaviour and he will come and talk to you. I understand he has been in a turbulent relationship and that's affected him but he also needs to understand and know you're not someone that will hang around forever nor will you be a push over (just don't allow it even if you do!!).

However, there are some things my husband just won't disclose because he feels like he can fix it himself and he doesn't need anyone else's input. Purely because he doesn't want to show that he is weak so in those instances I leave him to it. I do however make it clear that I don't appreciate his cold behaviour and he will take it on board and apologise and ensure he doesn't do it again. You just have to be patient if you really want it to work just ensure you don't become a push over.

I hope I have given some kind of satisfactory answer and if not my apologies.

You did! Thank you, Quirky. Everything is such a delicate and fine line with an INTJ. I plan to request a sort of "terms and conditions" thing with him. For example, setting an acceptable amount of time for space, especially during times of disagreement, so that WE'RE both comfortable and not just him. I'll admit, I'm really patient with him but it's starting to wear thin.

I have a question for you, how do you get your husband to snap out of it when he's being negative? I notice with my INTJ that he can be REALLY dark in his thinking, regardless of how true or untrue his perception of things is. I could be saying something absolutely innocent and without any malicious intent and immediately he would think the worst, then he gets consumed by it and convinces himself that I'm the bad person. The behavior to me is really severe and bizarre, but I try to be understanding because I know he's traumatized by those who've betrayed him in the past.

It's hard. I'm trying. But, sometimes I feel like maybe I'm just not what he needs.
 
I can relate to the scenario (I'm INTJ).

I love my solitude and independence probably more than I'm able to love any person. Nevertheless, I also feel love for people and the desire to maintain my relationship. It's an annoying contradictory position to be in, and makes commitment very unappealing.

To me nothing seems to ruin a pleasant relationship more than when the other person's expectations about time availability rises past the threshold where I still feel independent.

My current partner has her own sense of independence, and while we are exclusive and committed, we are not obligated, it's almost ideal.

I love that! I have always tested between INTJ/INFJ so I appreciate and understand independence very well! But, I'm very astute with the human condition so it helps me understand and be a little more flexible when someone needs more "togetherness." I used to be especially bad at this when I was younger, demanding that I only see my SO once a week because any more than that I would feel suffocated. Now that I'm older and wiser, I realized that if I want to spend the rest of my life with another human being and have a family with this person, it's important to respect the other person's needs as much mine.

Everything in life is about balance.
 
I read through this- I’m not an INTJ- I am an INTP- For some reason my life has like 30 INTJs in it. They are everywhere. There is enough similarity there to make a suggestion I think-

I get in modes- moods I guess, but last longer where I am emo shut down. It’s not always bad. Sometimes I am all kinda of available for dense feelings conversations and SOMETIMES- for stretches of days and weeks- I. AM. NOT.
It doesn’t always mean I’m hurt or sad or reflective. Sometimes I will feel I have let my life get too fluffy and indulgent and will go into “get shit done mode“. A lot of times the internal landscape has nothing to do with other people in my life- just too many sloppy loose ends. The people who stress me out the most are those that pressure me to get in a head space I can’t be in at the moment.

I don’t know enough about this situation to say one way or another but it sounds like no matter what you two feel for each other, this is messy. As in what Reason and Hos said. If y’all’s stuff is complex and super messy- that may be draining him. Long soulful conversations about it may not get you what you want here.

How about trying to be his buddy right now? Instead of work. It out feeling conversations which are seen as work by we T types is not what he can deal with right now. Try just being easy and funny. Try to not be THE NEXT BIG THING WAITING FOR HIM TO DEAL WITH. I don’t mean always-your feelings and needs matter too of course. I’m just commenting on a possible head space he might be in.
 
I don't recognise any of this, really, but I'm not this subtype of INTJ. My first love language is physical touch and I like intimacy. I'm also pretty open.

This guy sounds avoidant more than anything, which is a separate issue from his MBTI type.

I'm very comfortable with solitude and do get drained by a lot of social contact, but I'm always up for snuggles.

And smash.


P.S. I forgot all the context of this thread.
 
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I read through this- I’m not an INTJ- I am an INTP- For some reason my life has like 30 INTJs in it. They are everywhere. There is enough similarity there to make a suggestion I think-

I get in modes- moods I guess, but last longer where I am emo shut down. It’s not always bad. Sometimes I am all kinda of available for dense feelings conversations and SOMETIMES- for stretches of days and weeks- I. AM. NOT.
It doesn’t always mean I’m hurt or sad or reflective. Sometimes I will feel I have let my life get too fluffy and indulgent and will go into “get shit done mode“. A lot of times the internal landscape has nothing to do with other people in my life- just too many sloppy loose ends. The people who stress me out the most are those that pressure me to get in a head space I can’t be in at the moment.

I don’t know enough about this situation to say one way or another but it sounds like no matter what you two feel for each other, this is messy. As in what Reason and Hos said. If y’all’s stuff is complex and super messy- that may be draining him. Long soulful conversations about it may not get you what you want here.

How about trying to be his buddy right now? Instead of work. It out feeling conversations which are seen as work by we T types is not what he can deal with right now. Try just being easy and funny. Try to not be THE NEXT BIG THING WAITING FOR HIM TO DEAL WITH. I don’t mean always-your feelings and needs matter too of course. I’m just commenting on a possible head space he might be in.

Hi Dopamine,

I think you have a very valid point. Funnily enough, before I saw your message I had a pretty deep conversation with the INTJ and I told him that I don't want to be a threat to him, I'm not the enemy, – that's how I feel like he's been treating me – I'm trying to be a friend and exist with him in harmony. But, it's getting difficult to do so because I get shunned and kept in the dark at a moment's notice with no explanation. Additionally, I also told him that he needed to take accountability for his own actions and feelings and how that affects me (and others). The way he goes about handling any kind of infraction and strain, even when it's insignificant and unintentional, is to resort to paranoia, blame, and silent punishment for weeks. It's not fair to the recipient and the [unintended] crime doesn't fit the punishment at all. Lastly, I advised him that if he feels anything very strongly, no matter how negative it is, even if the things he thinks and feels are irrational, too emotional, and/or embarrassing, that I am here to listen to him with no judgment. I'd like to try to talk and sort through the mess more efficiently because the weeks-long silences are unproductive and contemptuous.

Anyway, we ended the conversation with him at least acknowledging his faults and apologizing. In the last week, he's been messaging me pretty heavily and seems to be more expressive about the things he's been feeling and what's been bothering him. I've just been a good listener, trying to help him in whatever ways that I can by sharing thoughtful responses and helpful tips.

I hope he's recognizing (slowly lol) that my intentions towards him are pure. I don't even care if we don't end up romantically together, I just want to be there as a friend regardless because I know he could use someone like me in his life.
 
I don't recognise any of this, really, but I'm not this subtype of INTJ. My first love language is physical touch and I like intimacy. I'm also pretty open.

This guy sounds avoidant more than anything, which is a separate issue from his MBTI type.

I'm very comfortable with solitude and do get drained by a lot of social contact, but I'm always up for snuggles.

And smash.


P.S. I forgot all the context of this thread.

Hi Deleted member 16771!

He is VERY MUCH avoidant. He has a tendency to push the people he loves away. I brought it up to him and he acknowledges that he does that. I have a theory that because he's experienced some really significant events in his life in which his closest friend and lover betrayed/abandoned him, now he's consumed by that distrust and projects it onto every person he gets close to.

I'm trying so hard to be understanding and a beacon of light in his life, but he doesn't make it easy in the least! God willing, he will help this INTJ learn to trust and love again.
 
Hi Deleted member 16771!

He is VERY MUCH avoidant. He has a tendency to push the people he loves away. I brought it up to him and he acknowledges that he does that. I have a theory that because he's experienced some really significant events in his life in which his closest friend and lover betrayed/abandoned him, now he's consumed by that distrust and projects it onto every person he gets close to.

I'm trying so hard to be understanding and a beacon of light in his life, but he doesn't make it easy in the least! God willing, he will help this INTJ learn to trust and love again.
Hi Boots,

Yes, this sounds likely.

Perhaps you ought to take it as a strange kind of compliment - only someone who can connect with him deeply is actually capable of hurting him.

The connection is proportional to the capacity to inflict damage, and so ironically he's likely to push away those he cares about most, I imagine.
 
Hi Boots,

Yes, this sounds likely.

Perhaps you ought to take it as a strange kind of compliment - only someone who can connect with him deeply is actually capable of hurting him.

The connection is proportional to the capacity to inflict damage, and so ironically he's likely to push away those he cares about most, I imagine.

I think you're right. He admitted to me that in the almost decade he's known me, he always found reasons to avoid me. He doesn't know why he does it and he said that of all people, he hates that he does it to me. He thanked me and told me he appreciated that I haven't given up on him.

So in a twisted way you are absolutely correct. He wouldn't need to shut me out if he didn't let me in in the first place.
 
Hi all!

I just wanted to wish everyone a very happy 2021!

I thought I'd come back to this thread to give everyone a quick update on my current situation with said INTJ.

In my last interaction with INTJ last September, I had unintentionally hurt his feelings with a crude joke. It really took me by surprise because he can be incredibly inappropriate with his jokes as well. It was honestly such an innocent misunderstanding and I apologized for offending him. You would think that would be enough and life would go on as usual. But NOPE.

After three months of silence from him, he reached out to me in December to say hi and see how I've been, to which I didn't respond. I made a decision after the last incident that whatever it is he is battling within his life and mind, I simply do not have the capacity nor resources to handle it. I've come to realize that I can't keep jumping into the trenches that he keeps digging for himself thinking that I can somehow help him. He is his own worst enemy and this is his battle to fight, not mine.

So that's where we're at.
 
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