[INFJ] Friends or something more?

[Ren]

Personally, I'm very glad you have that attitude (speaking for myself, I'd be quite sad if a friend broke a friendship with me for this type of reason). I think when it really comes down to it, I don't see any good reasons that would hold under ideal circumstances at least behind breaks of friendship in these situations. I think it can become necessary to break the friendship due to non-ideal circumstances (like simply being psychologically crippled with distress).

The circumstances are rarely ideal when it comes to us finite humans, though.

Given the way in which @BlackHorse is describing her feelings, I'm not sure just preserving the friendship while doing nothing else is the best approach. I think there is a high likelihood that she will end up frustrated and unhappy if she doesn't either 1) find a way to express how she feels or 2) realise she was exaggerating her romantic feelings, which is quite possible as well. In the heat of the moment we can feel very intensely only to realise a few weeks later that we weren't really in love, just infatuated.

 

[BlackHorse]

Even if he were dating someone else?

Idk hard question.. He was in a relationship for almost 2 years a year ago when we had no contact at all.. So whenever we were hanging out he was single, and i can't really picure being his friend while he's with someone else.

That wouldn't be fair on the people with whom you made plans, either. If he texts asking to meet up on a particular day but you happen to be busy that day, don't cancel, just suggest another day.

No, if i would have plans with other people i wouldn't just ditch them (depends who lol but no, not friends). I meant plans like hobbies, movie with family members .. stuff i can basically do every day. I have a whole day organized by hours and i just meant i would reorganize everything for him, which i don't do for just anyone. But on the other hand yes I suppose I should't give him too much power to influence my life and routine.

 

[Professor Snep]

I heard a theory once. . that when we fall for someone we dissolve all our walls and borders and allow them fully in. all of our protective castle is torn down. Then over time we begin to re-build it all back around us. If it is true love, they are inside our newly built stronghold. .but it takes hard work. . compromise, from both of you. . you can't do it alone, something I learned far too late in life. It's all to easy to become them and start to live their life, and not your own. But that only works for awhile, and eventually you will long for yourself again, and trouble soon follows. .

Would you let the love of your life inside your castle if they brought stinkin' banjos with them?

 

[BlackHorse]

Personally, I'm very glad you have that attitude (speaking for myself, I'd be quite sad if a friend broke a friendship with me for this type of reason).

Yes I agree, but I think when someone expresses romantic feelings for the other and gets rejected they usually drift apart naturally. The whole situation gets a bit awkward so that friendship is more or less ruined. But then again it depends on maturity level and the whole process of expressing feelings.
But if they don't express it and the love and interest is real, strong you can't really have a friendship anymore either. Would be too painful. So it's not a simple decision, especially if its a long term friendship.

1) find a way to express how she feels or 2) realise she was exaggerating her romantic feelings, which is quite possible as well. In the heat of the moment we can feel very intensely only to realise a few weeks later that we weren't really in love, just infatuated.

Yeah ... One of those will definitely happen in the near future.

 

[charlatan]

The circumstances are rarely ideal when it comes to us finite humans, though.

I think that's true in a very general sense of course -- the world is not ideal in every way. But to be clear, when someone says "Ideally, you will not fail all your classes," that is not suggesting that the world must be ideal in every way for this to happen -- it just means that as relevant to the problem of passing the classes, circumstances are ideal. And they often are -- i.e. for many students, circumstances are perfectly up to their finishing without failing every class.

Here, the point is whether circumstances are ideal enough that BlackHorse is able to maintain the friendship. I know that varies person to person, but I think I've run across a reasonable number of people who can handle that sort of thing, but not everyone. I don't judge them, obviously -- it's not their fault. But it's also undeniably a sad state of affairs.

I'm not sure just preserving the friendship while doing nothing else is the best approach. I think there is a high likelihood that she will end up frustrated and unhappy if she doesn't either 1) find a way to express how she feels

As I've said, the ideal circumstance is, for me, if everyone can be fully open and nothing bad would happen. That's what I strive for with my friends. I do think it kind of sucks to have to hold these things in when it's an intimate part of someone.

However, it depends to me a lot on the parties involved ... if BlackHorse were OK with it, but knew that her friend would probably find it harder to carry on, I'd say the optimal decision is to not let him know. It sort of seemed like she was OK with it at the start, and I was pushing to see whether, despite the growing feelings, it could still be the best decision. Purely having strong feelings does not, to me at least, close the deal.
It depends if she is psychologically disposed so that the loss of the friendship is more painful or so that not having her feelings reciprocated is more painful. I've encountered both types in my life.

they usually drift apart naturally. The whole situation gets a bit awkward so that friendship is more or less ruined. But then again it depends on maturity level and the whole process of expressing feelings.

Yeah, I know that's often the case, I just consider it unfortunate/don't see good reasons for it in the sense that sure we accept that it may happen, but it seems reasonable to see how to prevent it. It seems to be more or less a habituated thing. There were probably times when the fact that a son or daughter converted to a different religion would make it too painful for the parents to maintain much more than a distant relationship with them... but with times, those trends can change as people realize it's sad and there's not that good a reason for it.

 

[charlatan]

But if they don't express it and the love and interest is real, strong you can't really have a friendship anymore either

Also wanted to comment that I think that may be true for a fair number of people, but far from all. ... It seems to me it's perfectly possible for some people to have intense feelings of being in love, not say anything, and enjoy it deeply, kind of like "I'm so glad someone like that exists".
A condition here is that one does not find no reciprocation to be all that bad. I think for some, that's actually true -- the love is still more energizing than crippling, regardless the reciprocation.

 

[Reason]

This is a really long thread, I think I need a TL;DR recap of what happened after the original post before dispensing advice.

 

[BlackHorse]

@Reason TL;DR I have feelings for my friend of 4y, we were hanging out a lot in the past month but now I haven't seen him for 2 weeks. I wrote him around Christmas if he wants to meet, he said sure and then the conversation ended (he didn't reply anymore) and we haven't spoken since. And now we're discussing in this thread about what to do next. Came to the conclusion to not write him and wait, but it's not a final decision.
He seemed interested but had his times when I felt he's a bit weird or not really in the moment. We were hanging out either with another friend or alone.

 

[Reason]

@Reason TL;DR I have feelings for my friend of 4y, we were hanging out a lot in the past month but now I haven't seen him for 2 weeks. I wrote him around Christmas if he wants to meet, he said sure and then the conversation ended (he didn't reply anymore) and we haven't spoken since. And now we're discussing in this thread about what to do next. Came to the conclusion to not write him and wait, but it's not a final decision.
He seemed interested but had his times when I felt he's a bit weird or not really in the moment. We were hanging out either with another friend or alone.

Thanks for the recap! I agree, wait and see.

 

[BlackHorse]

Thanks for the recap! I agree, wait and see.

Yeah easy to say but what if he doesn't write

 

[Reason]

Yeah easy to say but what if he doesn't write

Well if he wants to communicate through interpretive dance or something that's no problem is it?

EDIT: plus he's an adult, surely someone taught him to write along the way

 

[BlackHorse]

plus he's an adult, surely someone taught him to write along the way

He rarely puts an effort to maintain friendships, as far as I've experienced it.. We haven't spoken for a year because he just doesn't try to stay in touch. And he's like that in general. I'm his only female friend (a close one at least). And he's said that to me a couple of times that he's sorry he doesn't write and that he just sucks at it. It's not a good excuse to me tho.

 

[Ren]

He rarely puts an effort to maintain friendships, as far as I've experienced it.. We haven't spoken for a year because he just doesn't try to stay in touch. And he's like that in general. I'm his only female friend (a close one at least). And he's said that to me a couple of times that he's sorry he doesn't write and that he just sucks at it. It's not a good excuse to me tho.

So basically how is he ISFJ? lol

That just doesn't sound very ISFJ at all. Are you sure he's not an Fi user? What makes you think he's ISFJ?

I think this question is potentially important because this could give us more insight into what he might be like. ISFJs can be shy but they are usually quite straightforward. I'd say they are one of the types least likely to "play", as well as one of the least likely to be swayed by another's games.

 

[Ren]

This is a really long thread, I think I need a TL;DR recap of what happened after the original post before dispensing advice.

lol you are such a chancer And it worked!

 

[Deleted member 16771]

He rarely puts an effort to maintain friendships, as far as I've experienced it.. We haven't spoken for a year because he just doesn't try to stay in touch. And he's like that in general. I'm his only female friend (a close one at least). And he's said that to me a couple of times that he's sorry he doesn't write and that he just sucks at it. It's not a good excuse to me tho.

Er... is this me? Alice, is that you?


I'm with @Ren here - this sounds like Fi. In addition, a lot of male friendships are very very low pressure - nobody expects anything and nobody gets upset. You're probably just in that friend category right now - don't worry about it.

 

[Impact Character]

Hey @BlackHorse


(For further exploration and if I may ask )..
Skipping ahead, let's say somehow you both have ended up on a Date.

Have you explored the Version where you end up together but he does not keep up with your Vision or even that he turns out to be very different (from how you know him) as a romantic partner?
What happens with you when you think about this? or what happens to you in that Version, you think?

 

[Ren]

Have you explored the Version where you end up together but he does not keep up with your Vision

Ni users be like: vision with a capital V

 

[Professor Snep]

a lot of male friendships are very very low pressure - nobody expects anything and nobody gets upset.

True, weeks can go by without your friendship suffering from it. And when you get back it's just like it has always been

 

[BlackHorse]

So basically how is he ISFJ? lol

That just doesn't sound very ISFJ at all. Are you sure he's not an Fi user? What makes you think he's ISFJ?

I think this question is potentially important because this could give us more insight into what he might be like. ISFJs can be shy but they are usually quite straightforward. I'd say they are one of the types least likely to "play", as well as one of the least likely to be swayed by another's games.

Umm he did the test. 56% introverted, 64% observant, 60% feeling, 60% judging ... 70% turbulent. Those where the results. Yes i know they're almost 50-50%.
He has easier time than me telling people to piss of thats for sure.. But idk how he's with expressing romantic emotions. He is the kind of guy that wants to be nice to everyone, until they cross the line then he lets them know instatnly. I don't think he ''plays'' at all, if he wants to hang out he asks and if not he won't but if someone else (friend) wants to hang out and he doesn't he will try not to hurt their feelings and will find a proper excuse that seems legit - that's what I've picked up from his other guy friends ... He seems a bit shy at times tho.
Why would he sound like Fi?

I'm with @Ren here - this sounds like Fi. In addition, a lot of male friendships are very very low pressure - nobody expects anything and nobody gets upset. You're probably just in that friend category right now - don't worry about it.

Gee thanks

 

[BlackHorse]

True, weeks can go by without your friendship suffering from it. And when you get back it's just like it has always been

Yes it feels like that with him. Even though we haven't seen each other for over a year everything stayed exactly as we left it.