How would you promote this dating site?

[edwardh]

No, I will not post a link because this is a serious question and I don't want people think that I'm some spammer because this also happens to be my first post. (By the way - I'm also not one for introductions. At least online, as it doesn't make much sense to me to have a thread mostly just full of welcomes. Not judging, just explaining why I'm jumping right in - And still: Hello! )

I guess the first thing to explain would by why of all things I would register and post my question HERE.
Well... I have gotten to know some fellow INFJs in my life and I feel like that IF there is a group of people who might be able to provide a helping hand with my endeavors, it is other INFJs. Especially because they are also the group most likely to identify with my motivation for doing what I did and wanting to do what I try to do.

And another introductory thing before I get to the point... actually, I wanted to get the site online about a month before Christmas the latest, so that - knowing that people feel the loneliest around this time of year - they would be able to sign up and even if not find somebody in such a brief time, at least gain some hope again that SOMEBODY suitable for them might be out there. Maybe help avoid a severe depression or two. And the site is free and always will be, so this is no sinister plot to cash in on their pain.
It's obviously not purely altruistic though because I thought of the concept and orchestrated the whole thing because I couldn't find anybody on regular dating sites but still feel that online dating is the only way to go. It's basically my last try. But a try that will hopefully help many others, even if it won't work out for me.

But the problem I have now is to make people aware of it. I thought Google would crawl it in 1-2 days, 100 people would stumble across it, maybe 2% of those would actually enjoy the unique approach, sign up and tell two friends and within a week or two, I'd have at least 20 members.
A very modest goal but it still didn't work out that way.

My second idea after word of mouth was to find dating site indices and get it on there. But virtually all of those just list sites that are already established and have thousands of members.

The third one was ads but...
1.: How many thoughtful, critical people (who are the kind I want to attract and probably the only kind of people who would even bother signing up) who pay a lot of attention to ads do you know?
2.: The costs of that... considering that it's a free site...

And I really don't have another idea. Maybe somebody here does? (Please don't say "Facebook, dude!"...)

To make the discussion easier (see the slight misunderstandings below), I've decided to at least give you the option to look for the site yourself. It should be one of the first results when you google "mindmates online dating".

 

[thebodyelectric]

First of all I'm going to welcome you anyway. Here goes.

WELCOME!

That being said. I saw a TED talk a few days ago about this guy that wondered why some ideas reach the masses and others don't. You could check him out, it's a nice talk. http://www.ted.com/talks/seth_godin_on_sliced_bread.html
I think it's important to present your site as something that answers to a specific need of your specific target audience (is this the correct english word, not sure). Make sure they are happy and they will spread the word. I think this is also a matter of time though, it doesn't happen overnight. So don't give up! And kick some thoughtful people's ass. And be sure to create a super nice attractive lay-out. But, then again, I'm no ads wonder kid.

 

[edwardh]

Hehe still thanks for the welcome

Yes, "target audience" is correct and I have all of that covered. Design (I think aside from okcupid (although - because of its premium options, it's not even really a completely free dating site), it may just be the only free dating site roughly up to current standards in terms of user interface), getting the idea across and so on. The only thing I will never try to do is to cater to people's happiness by changing the basic approach, as I have thought it through for many hours, think it makes sense and have decided from the beginning that it will be a "sink or swim" project. If it will sink because there are really just 2-3 people out there who share my views on some really rough, basic ideas... then it should. I will accept that and live with the consequences (sounds very melodramatic, doesn't it? Well... there are more thoughts embedded in this...).

Thank you very much for that link, interesting TED talks are always nice (Haven't watched it yet though... will try to do so soon...)

[edit]
Oh and... are you suggesting that I kick thoughtful people's asses in real life in order to force to them to sign up?
[/edit]

 

[thebodyelectric]

Well, yeah, if that works.. why not? Haha!

Yeah but maybe the (love)boat won't sink because those 2/3 people will be really excited about it and tell their friends/colleagues/whatevers. So maybe the ship will come back up again after a while. (To stick with the melodrama )

"The only thing I will never try to do is to cater to people's happiness by changing the basic approach"

I'm not sure if I understand your correctly, but I don't think you should change the approach, it's more about focus on a specific kind of people. Like here in Holland we have a dating site called Menza or something, and it focusses on highly educated singles. Okey, it may border on social discrimination haha but such a focus or niche may help

 

[BMatt]

I've heard of a lot of free online dating sites which have an awesome idea for what makes them special, but anyone who goes to check them out says that their nearest match that isn't a practicing Wiccan lives more than 200 miles away.

Not to be dreary, but regardless of how good your idea might be, you're going to have a rough battle with getting recognized. The problem is that people want to check out a site that has people, and are driven away when they find out that there aren't any.


Personally what I'd do is try to mimic what the "HowAboutWe" site did. They contacted the people who ran the photoblog called "thechive" which had something like 2million daily viewers and got them to announce that they were setting up a special dating site for their fans. Boom, instant advertising to millions of people who all visit the same website. It's motivation to check it out, and everyone who joins already knows they have something in common. . . . and it gives you a decent database to have stored for when new people come by that makes your site look like people actually use it.

(Does Reddit have a dating site yet? )


If it works out, I have one request. . . become the replacement to the OK trends blog. I swear that blog provided the most meaningful insight into human psychology in the past decade.

B

 

[edwardh]

Yeah but maybe the (love)boat won't sink because those 2/3 people will be really excited about it and tell their friends/colleagues/whatevers. So maybe the ship will come back up again after a while. (To stick with the melodrama )

One would hope. But this isn't exactly a site one can recommend to a lot of people. Hm... this is getting a bit vague and I don't think it makes much sense to describe the whole site here. So... just to bring some clarity into the discussion, I will still provide the URL now: mindmates.org

Do you now see why? If not, you must have some great friends/colleagues/whatevers

I'm not sure if I understand your correctly, but I don't think you should change the approach, it's more about focus on a specific kind of people. Like here in Holland

Oh! Hello there, neighbor

we have a dating site called Menza or something, and it focusses on highly educated singles. Okey, it may border on social discrimination haha but such a focus or niche may help

There obviously already is. But I don't like communities that restrict their membership based on superficial criteria, like maybe IQ or level of education. That's why the rules of our site theoretically permit anyone to participate. Of course most uneducated people probably won't have enough to say about life and love (required essay topics) and won't want to put up with the other stuff. But there may be some among them who still are thoughtful and I don't see a reason why we should keep them out then.

I've heard of a lot of free online dating sites which have an awesome idea for what makes them special, but anyone who goes to check them out says that their nearest match that isn't a practicing Wiccan lives more than 200 miles away.

So? Everything has to start somewhere. If people let themselves be deterred by that, of course no such site will ever get enough members to find somebody within a radius they consider reasonable. And you will forever be stuck with the mainstream dating sites mostly filled with unsuitable members.

And because I would want to support those sites if they really are interesting - by all means, please list them!

Not to be dreary, but regardless of how good your idea might be, you're going to have a rough battle with getting recognized. The problem is that people want to check out a site that has people, and are driven away when they find out that there aren't any.

I'm not big on creating 10000 fake profiles. Not just because it's dishonest (although that's obviously the only important reason) but also because the way our site is constructed, that is simply impossible to do.
But again - if people aren't smart enough to support something good when they see it, they don't deserve it. It's just a damn shame for those who are idealistic enough to give it a shot. And you don't even have to be THAT idealistic to simply create a profile and wait. What's the harm in that? Losing 15 minutes of your life? You lose a LOT more than that looking for a partner, period, anyway.

Personally what I'd do is try to mimic what the "HowAboutWe" site did. They contacted the people who ran the photoblog called "thechive" which had something like 2million daily viewers and got them to announce that they were setting up a special dating site for their fans. Boom, instant advertising to millions of people who all visit the same website. It's motivation to check it out, and everyone who joins already knows they have something in common. . . . and it gives you a decent database to have stored for when new people come by that makes your site look like people actually use it.

LOL you mean I should send a message to the administrators of this forum?
Still... that IS a great idea. Although I would still have to find a site that is frequented by a lot of thoughtful people AND that is run by someone who wants to support our approach. Haha... oh boy

If it works out, I have one request. . . become the replacement to the OK trends blog. I swear that blog provided the most meaningful insight into human psychology in the past decade.

Everything I've read there only confirmed what I already knew or at least suspected
But... respecting the privacy of our users is very big on our site. Sure, should we ever get enough members, that wouldn't necessarily be hurt by statistics on e.g. the results of matching questions. But it might change how people answer questions because once they are aware that the data is used for statistics, they may be more likely to answer them in the way they are "supposed" to answer them and not according to how they truly feel. And that would defeat the purpose of the site.

 

[BMatt]

So? Everything has to start somewhere. If people let themselves be deterred by that, of course no such site will ever get enough members to find somebody within a radius they consider reasonable. And you will forever be stuck with the mainstream dating sites mostly filled with unsuitable members.

And because I would want to support those sites if they really are interesting - by all means, please list them!

I'm not big on creating 10000 fake profiles. Not just because it's dishonest (although that's obviously the only important reason) but also because the way our site is constructed, that is simply impossible to do.
But again - if people aren't smart enough to support something good when they see it, they don't deserve it. It's just a damn shame for those who are idealistic enough to give it a shot. And you don't even have to be THAT idealistic to simply create a profile and wait. What's the harm in that? Losing 15 minutes of your life? You lose a LOT more than that looking for a partner, period, anyway.

I agree with you on how simple it would be . . . but like I'm not the one you're trying to convince. If I were a person looking for a date, I'd want one with people on it to date. Creating a profile on a site that won't have people for me to date for an extended period of time would be silly . . . by the time it was up and working, I'd hope I already had a date!

The other thing is that most sites tell you who is active on their site . . . meaning how many people have been checking the site in the past 24 hours or something. Creating a profile on your site, then not checking in daily would be just as damaging as having no profiles. The thing that would make people check in is knowing there would be people, or getting messages.


The site I mentioned before started up by saying they were only focusing on the New York City area, though everyone else was welcome to join if they wanted. Once they had a good thing established within NYC, they pushed out into the rest of the country/world by partnering with some popular web communities.

(It's kinda what facebook did too. . . started in one school >branched out to other nearby schools > to anyone with a .edu email > to anyone)



As far as sites go :

www.herway.com always sounded awesome . . . my former housemate was a person who kept trying dating sites, and I saw her inbox a couple times. TONS of messages from random people who were 3x her age, and creepy. She got frustrated and didn't trust anyone to be who they said they were. This site tried to eliminate that problem

HowAboutWe was that site I said did a good job getting out there, though because of their partnerships they're known by a bunch of different names to different people. It's plot was to simply let you propose an idea for a specific date . . . if a person wanted to go streaking through the local park with you, they'd respond and you could go streaking together and see if sparks fly. It tried to let people find dates with similar interests and bring them together in the real world ASAP.




Having just typed all that out I googled "Failed dating sites" and this was the top hit: http://tech.co/cracking-the-love-code-why-most-online-dating-sites-fail-2012-02

 

[thebodyelectric]

One would hope. But this isn't exactly a site one can recommend to a lot of people. Hm... this is getting a bit vague and I don't think it makes much sense to describe the whole site here. So... just to bring some clarity into the discussion, I will still provide the URL now: mindmates.org

Do you now see why? If not, you must have some great friends/colleagues/whatevers

I see. And I totally dig the idea. Do you want to attract an international crowd? Just being curious

Oh! Hello there, neighbor

No way! Where you from?

There obviously already is. But I don't like communities that restrict their membership based on superficial criteria, like maybe IQ or level of education. That's why the rules of our site theoretically permit anyone to participate. Of course most uneducated people probably won't have enough to say about life and love (required essay topics) and won't want to put up with the other stuff. But there may be some among them who still are thoughtful and I don't see a reason why we should keep them out then.

I know, and I completely agree. My point was that you could jump into an empty niche, but you're obviously already doing that because I think the angle from which you approach the whole dating site phenomenon is pretty convincing, smart and inviting.

And yeah, maybe you should start with this forum! Who knows what will happen! I came across the "Confess your forum crushes" thread, so there may be a market here ;P. Let me rephrase that. There is a market here.

 

[edwardh]

@ thebodyelectric

Just watched the TED video. Remarkable idea that that guy expressed
Based on your new reply you wrote while I wrote more about this, my reply has become sort of obsolete
Because now you already know in which ways his talk exactly applies to our site and in which it does not. For instance that "talking to geeks". That's what I would like to do but it's not as simple because as you've said yourself... Obviously, forums like this would be filled with people who might like the ideas of mindmates. BUT it's next to impossible to inform them about it because you can't just say "Hey, check out my site, I think you might really enjoy it!". While that might be honest, I bet on most forums, one would be banned faster than one user can actually visit the site...
Although... I suppose if the administrators of a forum are reasonable, intelligent people, they would first visit the site and see whether it actually is of interest for their community and only then decide what to do. If anything at all. I guess I should bother to read the rules in detail once more and maybe try to contact one of them or something like that.

I see. And I totally dig the idea.

I am happy to hear that

Do you want to attract an international crowd?

Take a guess, considering that the default language is English (Unless you live in a country where German is the official language... the site is intelligent that way )
Of course - if people create profiles that are not in English or German, we can't guarantee anything since we couldn't provide proper service to such users. But it works for okcupid that people all over the world create their profiles in English, so I hope that it'll work like that for us too.

On a personal note though: I know people across North America and Europe and have lived in three different countries these past couple of years, so even out of my own interest, I would love it if people from all across the world would use the site.

Just being curious

By all means, ask away

I know, and I completely agree. My point was that you could jump into an empty niche, but you're obviously already doing that because I think the angle from which you approach the whole dating site phenomenon is pretty convincing, smart and inviting.

Well thank you very much

And yeah, maybe you should start with this forum! Who knows what will happen! I came across the "Confess your forum crushes" thread, so there may be a market here ;P. Let me rephrase that. There is a market here.

Hahaha I know there is, that's why I came here in the first place, remember?
Well... I didn't technically come here to simply market the site but I did come here because I figured chances would be good that at least some people here would identify with it and who would thus have an interest in helping me.

And on a sidenote (which is meant to be a lot more humorous than serious)
Are you by any chance in marketing or some other management field?
Because talking about "markets"... reminded me about "human resources" and people asking me to "pitch" my projects. All that cold lingo verbally degrading human beings and beautiful/interesting/living ideas into commodities. *shudder*
(I know/hope you probably didn't really mean it like that - hence humorous. But I seriously find such business terminology questionable/creepy...)

@ BMatt

Your reply made me realize that I really need to put at least directions to the site or something somewhere. Because if you knew exactly what the site tried to do, you would know why a lot of what you said doesn't really apply. I still appreciate the thoughts and the article though and it's something I will keep in mind should I ever actually create a mainstream dating site. Which I do have plans on and once again my basic idea won't be "gimmicky" but quite substantial. But that wouldn't be such a small, minimalistic hobby project, so I would need quite a bit of money do get that off the ground. So that one may never happen... who knows.

Your description of HowAboutWe just makes me feel sad/frustrated. All that instant gratification and thrill/fun-seeking. I'm not a fan of it. And there's something that makes people seem so hollow when all they seem to do is try to find ways to entertain themselves. One long joyride to their death, not one meaningful thought. Well... I'm exaggerating of course. Still... it does symbolize the tendency and why I don't think it's good to be as focused on that aspect of life as many people are.

The concept of herway basically would be interesting but... I find the way they promote it on the site and the general atmosphere of it very questionable.
I have to say I like our attempt at restoring balance in the dating world better
Mostly because we try to lessen the frustration for both women AND men.

 

[edwardh]

That's interesting... a very long reply of mine was just held for review.
Did I mistakenly write a "bad word"? Or was it too long? Man, what a pain in the ass
What a shame, guess we will have to wait for a mod in order to continue our conversation...
(But I obviously give the system the benefit of a doubt that my post was held for good reason)

[edit]Wow, that was way quicker than I thought! Kudos to the mod team if they actually did approve that manually.[/edit]

[edit2]Gotta love the irony of a reply in which I write "[...] if the administrators of a forum [...]. [...] read the rules in detail once more and maybe try to contact one of them or something like that." getting held for approval. Haha![/edit2]

 

[thebodyelectric]

@ thebodyelectric

Just watched the TED video. Remarkable idea that that guy expressed
Based on your new reply you wrote while I wrote more about this, my reply has become sort of obsolete
Because now you already know in which ways his talk exactly applies to our site and in which it does not. For instance that "talking to geeks". That's what I would like to do but it's not as simple because as you've said yourself... Obviously, forums like this would be filled with people who might like the ideas of mindmates. BUT it's next to impossible to inform them about it because you can't just say "Hey, check out my site, I think you might really enjoy it!". While that might be honest, I bet on most forums, one would be banned faster than one user can actually visit the site...

Take a guess, considering that the default language is English (Unless you live in a country where German is the official language... the site is intelligent that way )
Of course - if people create profiles that are not in English or German, we can't guarantee anything since we couldn't provide proper service to such users. But it works for okcupid that people all over the world create their profiles in English, so I hope that it'll work like that for us too.

Yeah, of course English is the common language. I was just thinking ahead that you would then get international crushes , was just wondering how that would work out and if that was the idea.

Hahaha I know there is, that's why I came here in the first place, remember?

Haha okey sorry, I guess I missed that

And on a sidenote (which is meant to be a lot more humorous than serious)
Are you by any chance in marketing or some other management field?
Because talking about "markets"... reminded me about "human resources" and people asking me to "pitch" my projects. All that cold lingo verbally degrading human beings and beautiful/interesting/living ideas into commodities. *shudder*
(I know/hope you probably didn't really mean it like that - hence humorous. But I seriously find such business terminology questionable/creepy...)

Noooo no no. Not at all haha! I wouldn't be in the marketing industry even if they'd offer me a million a year. No I study anthropology, and we discuss a lot of these terminologies and the implications and connotations they carry. And I agree, it's a party-killer. But in order to get a point across, I think you're sometimes forced to use words like that. It's embedded in people's brains and most don't really know how to think in another way than capitalism I guess

 

[edwardh]

Yeah, of course English is the common language. I was just thinking ahead that you would then get international crushes , was just wondering how that would work out and if that was the idea.

No, it's not a goal. The site is for average people, who can't stand the thought of dating someone who lives more than, say, 100km away as well as those who are more idealistic when it comes to love.
And I wouldn't talk about "crushes" because the point of the site is to find love, not a fling. Of course a crush can develop into more but still... it usually is more of a gut reaction to attractive appearance than something profound.

Noooo no no. Not at all haha! I wouldn't be in the marketing industry even if they'd offer me a million a year.

:rockon:

No I study anthropology, and we discuss a lot of these terminologies and the implications and connotations they carry.

Haha that's funny... considering your awareness, I guess you really may have been testing me then? ;P

And I agree, it's a party-killer. But in order to get a point across, I think you're sometimes forced to use words like that. It's embedded in people's brains and most don't really know how to think in another way than capitalism I guess

If you are accepting of social norms and want to to have it easy, yes. But that's not how I "work". I don't do things because they are easy but because I think they are right to do (usually... even I have my limits).
And I think instead of adopting such terms, one should push back. Just like with euphemisms. It's a "toilet", not a "bathroom", damn it! Being from Holland, you may not be aware of this, since they don't say that a lot in movies. But e.g. in Canada, people basically don't have separate words for "bathroom" and "toilet" any more... Which is why when I first got there, I was like: "No, I'm not looking for a bathroom, I need to use the toilet"

But I also do use those terms sometimes to get points across. Such as talking about how some companies treat people like "human resources"

 

[thebodyelectric]

Haha that's funny... considering your awareness, I guess you really may have been testing me then? ;P

Hahaha no, not really. It was interesting to see your reaction though .

And I think instead of adopting such terms, one should push back

Haha, rebel! I wouldn't say it would be more easy to adopt, but it sure would be better for your blatter.

 

[edwardh]

Hahaha no, not really. It was interesting to see your reaction though .

Haha, rebel! I wouldn't say it would be more easy to adopt, but it sure would be better for your blatter.

Haha! Fortunately, no matter how uptight people are, they will still understand

 

[edwardh]

Holy crap, having just stumbled across this thread, am I glad you two guys replied and none of the senior members, who are apparently very hostile towards online dating
Which also made me backtrack on the idea that the concentration of people interested in something like MindMates would be higher in forums such as this one...

 

[thebodyelectric]

Haha! Fortunately, no matter how uptight people are, they will still understand

Good, that means there is some hope left, not only for your blatter, but also for humankind

 

[thebodyelectric]

Holy crap, having just stumbled across this thread, am I glad you two guys replied and none of the senior members, who are apparently very hostile towards online dating
Which also made me backtrack on the idea that the concentration of people interested in something like MindMates would be higher in forums such as this one...

Maybe that's why only we replied haha! I don't have time to read the whole thread, but scanning through the replies: isn't this exactly why you're trying to approach this from a different angle? Seems like you provide an alternative to the workings of regular dating sites, rather than 'just making another one'.

 

[edwardh]

Good, that means there is some hope left, not only for your blatter, but also for humankind

:lol:
Considering you would grasp THAT desperately for a straw, it seems like you may have even less faith in humanity than I do

Maybe that's why only we replied haha! I don't have time to read the whole thread, but scanning through the replies: isn't this exactly why you're trying to approach this from a different angle? Seems like you provide an alternative to the workings of regular dating sites, rather than 'just making another one'.

But at least as I see it, that's not what they are talking about.
Instead...
... they talk trash: "I think part of the reason they are single is because they possess some combination of being both devoid of personality and motivation to look for a mate."
... make fun of people: "perhaps there's a reason why the slogan beneath the title at the INTJ Forum is: MASTERMINDS. INNOVATORS. VILLAINS. VIRGINS."
... are traditionalists/naturalists: "its [sic] still possible to find someone here, I guess. But that would be in a more natural way.", "It if it happens naturally it's much more interesting."
... have questionable views on relationships: "This forum was created by Shai Gar as his own personal INFJ dating site. [...] I'm not sure he ever got laid as a direct result of this website." - Because it seems to me one would only draw a conclusion like that if one's own interpretation of dating means "people getting laid".
... and then there is of course this: "Dating feature? Like, potential relationship? Here?! But I can't even see yos faces!"
(Oh, I just noticed "The Jester". Didn't actually read every post in detail before. Nice to see one voice of reason in there, even though I don't fully share his criticism. But it's something.)

Sure, MindMates is also supposed to attract those who previously were suspicious about online dating.
But that's not why it has a different approach. In fact, I bet that the people most likely to be attracted to it will be those who already understand the potential of online dating but simply don't like the how the average population uses dating sites.

And when I read naturalist arguments such as the ones above - if anything, that's an argument in favor of mainstream dating sites and shallow behavior. Because that is the natural thing to do.