the climate change scam

88chaz88 said:
Hey I agree with most of your posts, and funnily enough agree wholeheartedly with your first point, but this one is some real privileged liberal bollocks. How can you take all the insults towards a person's race, gender, sexuality, and potential disability, and conclude that "racist" is the worst thing someone could direct towards you?
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I think @Deleted member 16771 was referring to insults in the context of conversations in which different opinions are expressed.
 
kinglear said:
so how does supporting an elite agenda to enslave all humans under a technocracy before reducing population numbers through eugenics count as 'kinship towards your fellow humans?'

explain this to me...
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How is having a kinship towards your fellow human a support to an elite agenda to enslave humans?
Did you really just try to kinship shame me?:unamused:

edit:
Also, what you said prior:
kinglear said:
well if you aren't from britain then it's not really any of your business is it?

sit back, relax, do the 'fuck it' meditation and let the british people decide their own fate

and that was the beauty of the referendum....for once the people got to decide something for themselves
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May I remind you that this was your point. The referendum was our argument. We weren't including in it the goal to reduce population, now were we?
First of all, You don't get to twist things and put words in my mouth to support your view point. Kinship is love for people, humanity, whatever (and that includes you and everyone else).
Secondly, I have enjoyed your arguments because well, it's completely different from mine and I respect when people fight for what they believe in. However, you do not get to shame me for taking a stand against something I feel is unfair towards people even though I'm not from there, and then twist it into some elite enslavement.
Lastly, gaslighting rattles with my 8wing. ;)

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Deleted member 16771 said:
A point of order here: I don't think we ought to call people racists simply for expressing conservative opinions - it's not the same thing.

There is practically no greater insult in our society, and it should not be lightly used.
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Ren said:
I think @Deleted member 16771 was referring to insults in the context of conversations in which different opinions are expressed.
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You are all literally Hitler.

upload_2018-11-1_14-40-54.webp

Top my insult. I dare you. ;)
 
Ren said:
I think @Deleted member 16771 was referring to insults in the context of conversations in which different opinions are expressed.
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I don't think it matters.

The exact words used were "no greater insult in our society". If I was being generous and thinking this only applies to modern debate where such an insult would be used to discredit someone's opinions then it's still wrong, there are many insults that I wouldn't feel comfortable typing out which still do that job and are used to attack someone based on external things other than their opinions. (It also implies that etiquette matters more than ideas which is an opinion I clearly take issue with)

Also if someone calls you racist based on opinions conservative or otherwise, a lot of times I find there's a reason as to why which may not be obvious. "Racist" should be treated more than an adjective than a noun that's a judgement on your character. If someone says something you said is racist, just ask why. Don't view it as the greatest insult to our society, or as an insult at all.

If there is no reason, then just ignore it. It's not like it's an insult based on something you can't control.
 
88chaz88 said:
I don't think it matters.

The exact words used were "no greater insult in our society". If I was being generous and thinking this only applies to modern debate where such an insult would be used to discredit someone's opinions then it's still wrong, there are many insults that I wouldn't feel comfortable typing out which still do that job and are used to attack someone based on external things other than their opinions. (It also implies that etiquette matters more than ideas which is an opinion I clearly take issue with)
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I think you missed the point that @Deleted member 16771 was trying to make. I will let him take care of explaining that later, if he wishes to.

88chaz88 said:
Also if someone calls you racist based on opinions conservative or otherwise, a lot of times I find there's a reason as to why which may not be obvious. "Racist" should be treated more than an adjective than a noun that's a judgement on your character. If someone says something you said is racist, just ask why. Don't view it as the greatest insult to our society, or as an insult at all.

If there is no reason, then just ignore it. It's not like it's an insult based on something you can't control.
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Let's just say that we completely disagree, then.
 
Ren said:
Let's just say that we completely disagree, then.
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You completely disagree?

So without any further expansion I'm to gather that you think:
  • A lot of the times there is no reason as to why someone calls you racist.
  • You should view it completely as a judgement on your character.
  • You shouldn't question it.
  • It's the greatest insult someone could throw at you.

And most baffling of all (or most telling of all):
  • It's something you can't control.
 
Puzzlenuzzle said:
Basically, Deleted member 16771 was saying that calling someone racist for expressing conservative opinion is harmful for the society.
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And that was the point I agreed with.

I don't get why y'all seem to be so concerned over me having a problem with someone else's exaggerated claim.
 
88chaz88 said:
You completely disagree?

So without any further expansion I'm to gather that you think:
  • A lot of the times there is no reason as to why someone calls you racist.
  • You should view it completely as a judgement on your character.
  • You shouldn't question it.
  • It's the greatest insult someone could throw at you.

And most baffling of all (or most telling of all):
  • It's something you can't control.
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Yes, if someone calls you racist, you should take it as a judgement on your character. Otherwise, the person should have said: "What you said there was racist, because..." and give a very careful explanation of why. The onus is not on the person being called racist to figure out why they are racist, or to make the bizarre deduction that even though they were called racist, what was really meant was that their utterance was racist.

When you make an accusation, the onus is on you to explain why you make it, not on the person accused to defend themselves just because they were accused of it. This is a basic principle of the logic of debate. And the accusation of racism is certainly a very serious one, which could destroy a person's entire career. It is dangerous and slippery, and should be handled with care, precisely because it tends to be associated with character.

That being said, if someone makes a good case for one of your statements being racist, then you should definitely be open to that, and question it. But that would not be an insult, and therefore it is not what @Deleted member 16771 was talking about.
 
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Calling someone a racist is such character assassination that it pretty much ensures that nothing that person says from then on out is taken seriously. Calling someone a nazi or a fascist is pretty much on par. They're the ultimate show stoppers. Debate over, goodbye sir.

Of course there are reasons why someone calls you a racist:
- They got the butt hurts and use it as an insult.
- They can't win the argument legitimately, and hence resort to discrediting tactics.
- You are an actual racist.

Interestingly enough, it is mostly just the first two reasons, so yes, you can safely ignore that and move on with your life.
 
88chaz88 said:
And that was the point I agreed with.

I don't get why y'all seem to be so concerned over me having a problem with someone else's exaggerated claim.
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We got no problems. Debate with him all you like lol, I think he's fine with it.
One day this will be written in history books! : how racism was an insult used in Britain to lower the opponent. epistemology.
In some other countries mysoginist is an even worse insult in certain societies so, I get your point. Prior to racism being a proper insult in UK then pointing out different classes was hardcore.
 
88chaz88 said:
Fair enough to everything else but this is depressingly a complete fantasy. Whose career has ever been even slightly damaged by accusations of racism, unfounded or not?
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Many in UK. That's for sure.
 
88chaz88 said:
Fair enough to everything else but this is depressingly a complete fantasy. Whose career has ever been even slightly damaged by accusations of racism, unfounded or not?
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There's countless examples, but I will pick a telling one.

Look up the name of Stéphane Hessel, a member of the French resistance and holocaust survivor, who should be a national hero, if not for the fact that he was unjustly accused of being antisemitic (despite being Jewish) after he took a strong pro-Palestinian stance towards the end of his life. He was accused of being antisemitic, barred from giving certain conferences in universities, and the wall of his building was tagged with the word "ANTISEMITE". There's a link to this article for evidence. He has since been rehabilitated, on the occasion of his death particularly, but he was greatly affected by what happened to him.

I consider that I said what I had to say. There's a subtle tone of haughty sanctimoniousness in your use of adverbs like "depressingly", "tellingly" etc. which I do not care for. If you still disagree, well then, we disagree, and that's it. This exchange is over as far as I am concerned.
 
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