[INFJ] Types you're attracted to?

David Nelson said:
it makes sweeping, simplistic conclusions which miss so much it’s unreal.
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Right, because nothing says nuanced and complex quite like constantly reducing one thing to its most base components and then projecting it as all there is.

Are you not yet tired of this anti-Te charade? Any dimwit can make something sound bad. That's the stuff of populists and social media agitators. Your constant attribution of Te to some scummy dictators is fundamentally the same as playing the Hitler card and thinking yourself intelligent. I can easily make Ti users seem like complete morons with the correct wording. Let's give it a shot.

"Ti users lack any understanding of object relations and their investigations take place in an imaginary vacuum world where objects exist somehow completely independent of each other. Since their ignorance of causality puts them on an intellectual level of a toddler, they constantly pump out inane philosophies with zero relation to reality and pretend to be insightful to cope with being useless. When talking about cognitive functions, they will unironically believe that comparing two functions in isolation is relevant to how people function as a whole. They suffer from a delusion of being a detached observer of the universe, utterly oblivious to how many external events accumulated to effect their latest brain fart, actually thinking it's the second best idea since the wheel. Then they engage in a prolonged mental masturbation while adulating their bullshit as they desperately try to scrounge for any vestige of self-worth, because nobody else can take them seriously."

I don't know, I think that's a pretty reasonable take. :sunglasses:
 
From Jung, C. G. (1971) [1921]. Psychological Types. Collected Works of C. G. Jung. Vol. 6. Translated by Adler, Gerhard; Hull, R. F. C. Princeton University Press. ISBN 978-1-4008-5086-0

“Extraverted thinking is the thinking function that is objective (being extroverted). Extroverted thinking often places information such as facts in high order; it is a process that is concerned with organisation and hierarchy of phenomena.”

“Introverted thinking is the thinking function that is subjective (being introverted). The nature of introverted thinking means that it is primarily concerned with its ‘subjective idea’ and insights gained by formulation, with facts and objective data being of secondary importance.”

Cheers,
Ian
 
Jexocuha said:
I get a lot of what you are saying @David Nelson about Te vs Ti. Te is not the "intelligence" function, in a cultural layman's image of an xNTP-like version of intelligence. Te seeks certainty and clarity in the environment. But that's all broad brush whitewashing of types. And you're right, INFJs can be extremely intelligent. Imo, based on some observations, they can have that sort of "wild intelligence" that I see also possessed by xNFPs and ENFJs. What I have observed though is lack of acknowledgement of this - especially of how "crazy smart" one can be at times to have Ti in the tertiary position. I think INTJs can get more acknowledgement of their intelligence not necessarily because of their Te function, but have you considered their Fi function? In order for one to make a case for an argument and make it powerful, one has to actually care about it and get others to also care. INTJs, I've noticed, have this power. Ti, although a truly analytical function, can be so far removed from reality(especially coupled with Ni), that to others it's so alien, no one cares. And that is the big point I'm trying to make - you have to care and/or get others to actually care about the arguments you are trying to make.

just my two cents.
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Some great points here. Thanks.
 
Sidis Coruscatis said:
Right, because nothing says nuanced and complex quite like constantly reducing one thing to its most base components and then projecting it as all there is.

Are you not yet tired of this anti-Te charade? Any dimwit can make something sound bad. That's the stuff of populists and social media agitators. Your constant attribution of Te to some scummy dictators is fundamentally the same as playing the Hitler card and thinking yourself intelligent. I can easily make Ti users seem like complete morons with the correct wording. Let's give it a shot.

"Ti users lack any understanding of object relations and their investigations take place in an imaginary vacuum world where objects exist somehow completely independent of each other. Since their ignorance of causality puts them on an intellectual level of a toddler, they constantly pump out inane philosophies with zero relation to reality and pretend to be insightful to cope with being useless. When talking about cognitive functions, they will unironically believe that comparing two functions in isolation is relevant to how people function as a whole. They suffer from a delusion of being a detached observer of the universe, utterly oblivious to how many external events accumulated to effect their latest brain fart, actually thinking it's the second best idea since the wheel. Then they engage in a prolonged mental masturbation while adulating their bullshit as they desperately try to scrounge for any vestige of self-worth, because nobody else can take them seriously."

I don't know, I think that's a pretty reasonable take. :sunglasses:
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I think @David Nelson is reading too much 20th century leftist books, that's where all of his misrepresentation of reality comes from.

Te and Ti are both great if applied to science/engineering/math, but unfortunately a lot of Ti users are attracted to social "sciences" which is a minefield. There you can read a lot of logically consistent arguments and theories that appeal to Ti in combination with Ni/Ne, but are actually completely made up woke narratives. This can poison and blind people. It takes years to get rid of that stuff.

While in the meantime Te users just go about their day solving actual problems.

And the INTJs that do go into social sciences are usually more objective and can see trough bullshit, and don't fall pray to woke made up unproven narratives about how the world works.
 
Sidis Coruscatis said:
Right, because nothing says nuanced and complex quite like constantly reducing one thing to its most base components and then projecting it as all there is.

Are you not yet tired of this anti-Te charade? Any dimwit can make something sound bad. That's the stuff of populists and social media agitators. Your constant attribution of Te to some scummy dictators is fundamentally the same as playing the Hitler card and thinking yourself intelligent. I can easily make Ti users seem like complete morons with the correct wording. Let's give it a shot.

"Ti users lack any understanding of object relations and their investigations take place in an imaginary vacuum world where objects exist somehow completely independent of each other. Since their ignorance of causality puts them on an intellectual level of a toddler, they constantly pump out inane philosophies with zero relation to reality and pretend to be insightful to cope with being useless. When talking about cognitive functions, they will unironically believe that comparing two functions in isolation is relevant to how people function as a whole. They suffer from a delusion of being a detached observer of the universe, utterly oblivious to how many external events accumulated to effect their latest brain fart, actually thinking it's the second best idea since the wheel. Then they engage in a prolonged mental masturbation while adulating their bullshit as they desperately try to scrounge for any vestige of self-worth, because nobody else can take them seriously."

I don't know, I think that's a pretty reasonable take. :sunglasses:
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Lol but you are throwing the baby out with the bath water. Of course no one is just Te and it’s position in any type will manifest differently.
I think my point is that Te is overall less useful in the making the world better than Ti. It might be controversial like my belief in INFJ having possibly the most important function stack. This can only be resolved in an essay/book imo, and will likely always polarise people in their opinions about it.
 
aeon said:
From Jung, C. G. (1971) [1921]. Psychological Types. Collected Works of C. G. Jung. Vol. 6. Translated by Adler, Gerhard; Hull, R. F. C. Princeton University Press. ISBN 978-1-4008-5086-0

“Extraverted thinking is the thinking function that is objective (being extroverted). Extroverted thinking often places information such as facts in high order; it is a process that is concerned with organisation and hierarchy of phenomena.”

“Introverted thinking is the thinking function that is subjective (being introverted). The nature of introverted thinking means that it is primarily concerned with its ‘subjective idea’ and insights gained by formulation, with facts and objective data being of secondary importance.”

Cheers,
Ian
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Yes, Ti works up but Te just looks at external data and ‘facts’ which may be wrong of course.

As an example the INTJ I knew said she thought MBTI was nonsense because it wasn’t explored in academia, only mentioned briefly. She did a psychology degree. She is probably a BPD INTJ, so a pretty unhealthy one. Probably not a good example. But she is using Te to assumed academia knows all the truths that are knowable and anything outside must be rubbish.
 
philostam said:
I think @David Nelson is reading too much 20th century leftist books, that's where all of his misrepresentation of reality comes from.

Te and Ti are both great if applied to science/engineering/math, but unfortunately a lot of Ti users are attracted to social "sciences" which is a minefield. There you can read a lot of logically consistent arguments and theories that appeal to Ti in combination with Ni/Ne, but are actually completely made up woke narratives. This can poison and blind people. It takes years to get rid of that stuff.

While in the meantime Te users just go about their day solving actual problems.

And the INTJs that do go into social sciences are usually more objective and can see trough bullshit, and don't fall pray to woke made up unproven narratives about how the world works.
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Completely disagree here.
 
Wyote said:
You would say that lol
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Without printing press, radio, television, internet and smartphones information would not even have a chance to spread. We would not be on this forum.

We had some good ideas too, to be fair. Democracy, free speech, capitalism, competition, free market etc. Social movements can play a positive role too, of course. We've seen it many times, like in abolishing extremely harsh working conditions, abolishing slavery, fighting racism etc.

At the end, people do have the power. Ultimately we decide trough our action what technology we adopt and think it's useful. And we can even rally and unite around a a particularly good idea or movement. But seems like today we are too polarized to be able to achieve that.
 
philostam said:
Without printing press, radio, television, internet and smartphones information would not even have a chance to spread. We would not be on this forum.

We had some good ideas too, to be fair. Democracy, free speech, capitalism, competition, free market etc. Social movements can play a positive role too, of course. We've seen it many times, like in abolishing extremely harsh working conditions, abolishing slavery, fighting racism etc.

At the end, people do have the power. Ultimately we decide trough our action what technology we adopt and think it's useful. And we can even rally and unite around a a particularly good idea or movement. But seems like today we are too polarized to be able to achieve that.
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Even more amazing that we did it without the use of written communication
 
philostam said:
I know. That's why you are wrong and pessimistic on top.

Ti/Fe users always think that change in the world comes trough policy and social movement. While these do have an impact, the biggest changes come from engineering, technology and innovation.
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That was a total Te/Fi take on the situation. You are proving my points above nicely.
 
philostam said:
Without printing press, radio, television, internet and smartphones information would not even have a chance to spread. We would not be on this forum.

We had some good ideas too, to be fair. Democracy, free speech, capitalism, competition, free market etc. Social movements can play a positive role too, of course. We've seen it many times, like in abolishing extremely harsh working conditions, abolishing slavery, fighting racism etc.

At the end, people do have the power. Ultimately we decide trough our action what technology we adopt and think it's useful. And we can even rally and unite around a a particularly good idea or movement. But seems like today we are too polarized to be able to achieve that.
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You are posing a binary choice, probably stemming from my comparison of Te and Ti, but technology and social science both have benefits. You seem to parody social movements, and I don’t even think they are necessarily all that fruitful. They are usually from minorities on the periphery, or are fairly mass movements like anti gulf war one and ignored by elites in power, more likely wielding Te lol.
 
David Nelson said:
Change takes time. I believe in the power of books, without them we’d be living quite primitively. It’s easy to downplay their influence.
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Books are obviously important, but maybe less so today. Podcasting is taking over because now you can actually listen to the best contemporary thinkers speak. Obviously fiction is a different thing all together.

I did mention printing press as a great technological innovation that helped spread of information which ultimately brought down the church.
 
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