How can I gain an INFJ's forgiveness after fucking up in a major way?

[IndigoSensor]

Ok just a quick update to everyone before I do other responses: I've taken your strong and universal suggestion that brevity is the soul of wit under advisement, and I've cut it down to 9 pages.

You need flat out stay away from her in all accounts. I can not emphasize that enough.

 

[arbygil]

It sounds as if you're going to do what you want, regardless of what we're telling you (even cutting it back to 9 pages is too long, especially if it looks like a big old wall of single spaced text).

The overwhelming majority of us are either telling you to leave her alone and let her come to you (if she ever does). You're going to end up in jail if you keep harassing her (and yes, 9 pages is 9 pages too long - you need no more than a small, three line paragraph). Do yourself a favor and leave her alone. You'll both be better off in the long run.

 

[frozen_water]

eek... yeah, you know what, I think I agree with Indigo now. He just saw things clearer sooner *shakes fist at that frustratingly powerful Ni*. I second his advice... stay as far away from her as possible.

 

[Loki]

It sounds as if you're going to do what you want, regardless of what we're telling you (even cutting it back to 9 pages is too long, especially if it looks like a big old wall of single spaced text).

The overwhelming majority of us are either telling you to leave her alone and let her come to you (if she ever does). You're going to end up in jail if you keep harassing her (and yes, 9 pages is 9 pages too long - you need no more than a small, three line paragraph). Do yourself a favor and leave her alone. You'll both be better off in the long run.

First, one point of clarification: there is no restraining order. The communication rule is strictly a school rule.

I see what you all are saying. There's an extremely good chance that you're right. But you must understand--it just isn't my way to give up. Unfortunately, none of us can prove beyond a reasonable doubt that this won't turn out to be a good idea. And as long as there's reasonable doubt, I have to try. Once upon a time, I gave up in what seemed at the time to be impossible odds, and I almost died. Since then, I have never given up, no matter what the odds. I've taken the attitude of "It would be very nice to succeed, but in the end what really matters is knowing that I did everything I could." And ironically, whenever I've gone up impossible odds since then, I have succeeded every single time.

Telling me to let sleeping dogs lie is undeniably good advice, and I would be a fool not to take it. Unfortunately, I am a fool (in an ENTP sort of way). Telling me to give up is like telling Dr. Faust he shouldn't make his deal with the devil, and instead resign himself to old age and death. It's just not my way.

 

[IndigoSensor]

Well the I do not see the point of you starting this or deflecting this in the first place. If this blows up in your face then it is your own fault, and you will not get sympathy from anyone here. You are being such a typical undeveloped ENTP it is astounding. Gathering information then rejecting it because you have thought you were right in the first place. Get over your ego, and stay away from this person.

 

[Raccoon Love]

Well the I do not see the point of you starting this or deflecting this in the first place. If this blows up in your face then it is your own fault, and you will not get sympathy from anyone here. You are being such a typical undeveloped ENTP it is astounding. Gathering information then rejecting it because you have thought you were right in the first place. Get over your ego, and stay away from this person.

Could not have said it better yourself, you are not making this any better and you are hurting her. You would also end up hurting yourself by putting your hopes up, if she wants to forgive you let her take initiative. It is none of your business weather she wants to remain your friend or not, as in her eyes you are the one at fault.

 

[Ria]

Ok just a quick update to everyone before I do other responses: I've taken your strong and universal suggestion that brevity is the soul of wit under advisement, and I've cut it down to 9 pages.

I deleted this just now because it sounded sarcastic and I felt uncomfortable with that. However, I think I will re-post it as it might make some sort of difference to the outcome. I doubt it, but I thought I'd do it anyway. Just for what it's worth, please don't go with your natural responses, you are crossing boundaries with her and this will prove if anything to her, that you haven't changed enough yet to the degree that you think you have.

" interesting. I'm sitting here thinking you must be crazy...

If you don't want to listen to our advice on this account, then might I suggest you follow this part to the "T". Invest in a bottle of bodywash. "
__________________

 

[frozen_water]

Something that every NT needs to learn is that 99% of the time, "reasonable" is an intuitive judgment call that's so strongly tied to other parts of yourself that it reflects little more than a combination of "how you see this situation" and "how you've seen siituations like this in the past."

Your words are saying what your brain doesn't want to admit.

I see what you all are saying. There's an extremely good chance that you're right. But you must understand--it just isn't my way to give up.

It sounds like you're doing this for yourself, and I'd be surprised (and feel a little bit sorry for her) if she didn't think so as well. I hope this does work out for both of you... but on the chance that your actions burn everything to the ground in the future, I still suggest you spend a good bit more quality time focusing on your own development as a person, instead.

I won't go so far as to agree with Indigo that you won't get any sympathy from anyone if this goes as badly as everyone thinks it will, though. That's just the ugly side of Fe talking. If you don't think someone has the right to discard your advice, then you weren't really giving them advice at all. Just orders.

 

[Loki]

I deleted this just now because it sounded sarcastic and I felt uncomfortable with that. However, I think I will re-post it as it might make some sort of difference to the outcome. I doubt it, but I thought I'd do it anyway. Just for what it's worth, please don't go with your natural responses, you are crossing boundaries with her and this will prove if anything to her, that you haven't changed enough yet to the degree that you think you have.

" interesting. I'm sitting here thinking you must be crazy...

If you don't want to listen to our advice on this account, then might I suggest you follow this part to the "T". Invest in a bottle of bodywash. "
__________________

Don't worry about it Ria. I certainly took no offense at it. There's nothing wrong with a little dose of reality now and then.

 

[Loki]

Well the I do not see the point of you starting this or deflecting this in the first place. If this blows up in your face then it is your own fault, and you will not get sympathy from anyone here. You are being such a typical undeveloped ENTP it is astounding. Gathering information then rejecting it because you have thought you were right in the first place. Get over your ego, and stay away from this person.

I'm sorry I've given you the impression that I'm ignoring all your advice. Let me assure you I am not. Your advice and your reactions are immensely helpful. Will they stop me from sending a letter? Probably not. I'm sorry for how irritating that must be. Will it change the content of the letter and give it a great chance of success (or, from another perspective, a lesser chance of doing harm)? Absolutely.

You guys are also giving me the gift of a cautious voice, which my mind seems to lack. Whether or not I listen to it is a whole other story, but it helps make sure that I don't have any expectations, so if I fail, I won't be disappointed. You're giving me a greater perspective than I would have on my own, and I don't know about you, but I find that valuable. And I think it will lead to better outcome, even if it doesn't lead to the best possible outcome. So thank you.

 

[IndigoSensor]

Will they stop me from sending a letter? Probably not. I'm sorry for how irritating that must be.

We told you point blank that you need to step away, or say "I'm sorry" and nothing more (which I personally also feel is a dumb idea), yet you won't do it. As such there is no point in discussing this.

You are actually doing a parallel to us what you did to your INFJ friend; Draining our energy and asking for help when you aren't doing what you need to do. See a common theme? As such I am walking away.

I'm done, go ahead and make your life worse.

 

[Blind Bandit]

First, one point of clarification: there is no restraining order. The communication rule is strictly a school rule.

I see what you all are saying. There's an extremely good chance that you're right. But you must understand--it just isn't my way to give up. Unfortunately, none of us can prove beyond a reasonable doubt that this won't turn out to be a good idea. And as long as there's reasonable doubt, I have to try. Once upon a time, I gave up in what seemed at the time to be impossible odds, and I almost died. Since then, I have never given up, no matter what the odds. I've taken the attitude of "It would be very nice to succeed, but in the end what really matters is knowing that I did everything I could." And ironically, whenever I've gone up impossible odds since then, I have succeeded every single time.

Telling me to let sleeping dogs lie is undeniably good advice, and I would be a fool not to take it. Unfortunately, I am a fool (in an ENTP sort of way). Telling me to give up is like telling Dr. Faust he shouldn't make his deal with the devil, and instead resign himself to old age and death. It's just not my way.

No we're telling you to listen to us as we (INFJ ) can tell how this girl will most likely react. And your of course taking the ENTP route and ignoring good advice. Trust us this will end badly. No matter how much your trying to make up logical reasons to keep pushing. YOUR NOT DEALING WITH A (NT) HERE! I'm sorry but its clear that your not understanding this. INFJs don't take kindly to be stalked witch is pretty much the vibe your giving off. I'm sorry but your thinking about this from your side and not her's. This isn't about you. You need to come to understand that to ever get back to the way things where. You can't argue her into agreeing with you. And thats why I think you want to send such a big letter. To argue, but that won't work in this case. Not everything can be fixed by arguing .

Well the I do not see the point of you starting this or deflecting this in the first place. If this blows up in your face then it is your own fault, and you will not get sympathy from anyone here. You are being such a typical undeveloped ENTP it is astounding. Gathering information then rejecting it because you have thought you were right in the first place. Get over your ego, and stay away from this person.

Yup!

Something that every NT needs to learn is that 99% of the time, "reasonable" is an intuitive judgment call that's so strongly tied to other parts of yourself that it reflects little more than a combination of "how you see this situation" and "how you've seen siituations like this in the past."

Your words are saying what your brain doesn't want to admit.



It sounds like you're doing this for yourself, and I'd be surprised (and feel a little bit sorry for her) if she didn't think so as well. I hope this does work out for both of you... but on the chance that your actions burn everything to the ground in the future, I still suggest you spend a good bit more quality time focusing on your own development as a person, instead.

I won't go so far as to agree with Indigo that you won't get any sympathy from anyone if this goes as badly as everyone thinks it will, though. That's just the ugly side of Fe talking. If you don't think someone has the right to discard your advice, then you weren't really giving them advice in the first place.

Yes, this isn't about the OP, its about her.

We told you point blank that you need to step away, or say "I'm sorry" and nothing more (which I personally also feel is a dumb idea), yet you won't do it. As such there is no point in discussing this.

You are actually doing a parallel to us what you did to your INFJ friend; Draining our energy and asking for help when you aren't doing what you need to do. See a common theme? As such I am walking away.

I'm done, go ahead and make your life worse.

This is truly a great example of why I could see her slamming the door harder.

 

[Odyne]

I'm sorry I've given you the impression that I'm ignoring all your advice. Let me assure you I am not. Your advice and your reactions are immensely helpful. Will they stop me from sending a letter? Probably not. I'm sorry for how irritating that must be. Will it change the content of the letter and give it a great chance of success (or, from another perspective, a lesser chance of doing harm)? Absolutely.

You guys are also giving me the gift of a cautious voice, which my mind seems to lack. Whether or not I listen to it is a whole other story, but it helps make sure that I don't have any expectations, so if I fail, I won't be disappointed. You're giving me a greater perspective than I would have on my own, and I don't know about you, but I find that valuable. And I think it will lead to better outcome, even if it doesn't lead to the best possible outcome. So thank you.

I am still reading a lot of "I"'s and "Me" and "success". Seriously, is this about you or about her?

I get the feeling that you want to become friends with her for your own benefit, and not because you appreciate what she has done for you. And you may not even be aware of it.

It sounds like you are devising some plan as to how win a bet.

And you know what, I think the more we tell you not to do it, the more hardheaded you'll get and will do it anyways, just to show us that you have succeeded and that you were right, and your ego just won't accept it.

I realize that this is awfully harsh, and to be honest with you (and more harsh perhaps) I don't care, because all that you are doing feels all too familiar, and I know that you are going to screw up. If not now, you'll ruin whatever slim chances of reconcile you have in the future, by not changing who you are

Stay away and leave her alone, and move on!

Give her a chance at a better and a happier life.

 

[athenian200]

Ok just a quick update to everyone before I do other responses: I've taken your strong and universal suggestion that brevity is the soul of wit under advisement, and I've cut it down to 9 pages.

Umm, well, that's trying. Got to give you credit for that.

But I don't think you're understanding my point. The longer it is, the more desperate you'll seem, and the less likely she is to forgive you. It's that simple. Make it look like you just want to apologize in order to seek closure, and then leave it be. Say what I told you before: "Thank you for being my friend, and giving me the strength to move on with my life. I'm sorry, and I'll miss you."

That's ALL you need. I'm serious. If you just say that, and leave it alone... that gives you the best chance of success (though it may take quite awhile for her to contact you if she decides to). In fact, I think it might be better if you would just copy and paste what's in those quotes rather than using your own words. I have no doubt you're intelligent, but you're not really good with emotional stuff.

 

[Loki]

We told you point blank that you need to step away, or say "I'm sorry" and nothing more (which I personally also feel is a dumb idea), yet you won't do it. As such there is no point in discussing this.

You are actually doing a parallel to us what you did to your INFJ friend; Draining our energy and asking for help when you aren't doing what you need to do. See a common theme? As such I am walking away.

I'm done, go ahead and make your life worse.

I completely respect that. I'm sorry if I've drained your energy. Please know that whether you realize it or not, you have done some good here. I thank you for your thoughts and your time.

 

[Odyne]

You are actually doing a parallel to us what you did to your INFJ friend; Draining our energy and asking for help when you aren't doing what you need to do. See a common theme?

+1000!

 

[Raccoon Love]

+1000!

+∞

 

[894tt3h9]

Yep, I think if you're actually going to go ahead with emailing you should just take athenian's quote, copy and paste it and send it like that. You don't need 9 pages. You don't even need one entire page. One or two sentences is enough.

It's clear to me that convincing you NOT to contact her is just not going to happen. I feel sorry for this girl if she gets a huge letter from you. I really really do.

 

[Blind Bandit]

Yep, I think if you're actually going to go ahead with emailing you should just take athenian's quote, copy and paste it and send it like that. You don't need 9 pages. You don't even need one entire page. One or two sentences is enough.

It's clear to me that convincing you NOT to contact her is just not going to happen. I feel sorry for this girl if she gets a huge letter from you. I really really do.

Its a typical NT fault. When immature (older NT's often seem to not have this problem) NT's hate to be wrong and they use flawed logic to twist out a situation that makes them right. All while ignoring the other persons needs or wants. As long they're right thats all that matters.

 

[894tt3h9]

Its atypical NT fault. When imature (older NT's often seem to lose this problem) NT's hate to be wrong and they use flawed logic to twist out a situation that makes them right. All while ignoring the other persons needs or wants. As long they're right thats all that matters.

It seems really apparent in this situation that this is exactly what's going on.