Corona / Wuhan virus

Skarekrow said:
Also...the death toll was just 2400 two days ago, and now it's doubled ++
We are not in a position to reopen shit.
Just my opinion.
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Will the coronavirus kill more people than survive.

I want you to answer this honestly.

Is there any evidence to suggest that the coronavirus is going to kill, or is killing, 51% of people who get it?
 
slant said:
Will the coronavirus kill more people than survive.

I want you to answer this honestly.

Is there any evidence to suggest that the coronavirus is going to kill, or is killing, 51% of people who get it?
Click to expand...

That is not a logical question.
The fact of the matter is we can prevent more death from occurring but rich assholes want to make more money.
Seriously...we went from 2400 a day to 4800+ a day overnight.
Let's just go ahead and open up for biz.
I'm not worried about the economy.
Sorry it worries you so much.
I care more about unnecessary death, possibly my own and those I love.
 
Skarekrow said:
That is not a logical question.
The fact of the matter is we can prevent more death from occurring but rich assholes want to make more money.
Seriously...we went from 2400 a day to 4800+ a day overnight.
Let's just go ahead and open up for biz.
I'm not worried about the economy.
Sorry it worries you so much.
I care more about unnecessary death, possibly my own and those I love.
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You do realize that the quarantine is not to prevent death, right? It's to prevent the hospital systems from getting swamped. As well as funeral parlors. Without a vaccine, a lot of people are going to die. Most people who get put on ventilators are unable to get off of them, that's why there's a shortage, you don't just get put on a ventilator, recover, and then a new person gets put on it.

Quarantine is not preventing death. It is creating a bottleneck for the deaths that are going to happen in the future.
 
slant said:
Will the coronavirus kill more people than survive.

I want you to answer this honestly.

Is there any evidence to suggest that the coronavirus is going to kill, or is killing, 51% of people who get it?
Click to expand...
Being ok with people dying because it's not a majority of the population is just an acceptance of collateral damage. There would be far less collateral damage if life and health was rightfully placed about profits.
 
slant said:
You do realize that the quarantine is not to prevent death, right? It's to prevent the hospital systems from getting swamped. As well as funeral parlors. Without a vaccine, a lot of people are going to die. Most people who get put on ventilators are unable to get off of them, that's why there's a shortage, you don't just get put on a ventilator, recover, and then a new person gets put on it.

Quarantine is not preventing death. It is creating a bottleneck for the deaths that are going to happen in the future.
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I completely disagree.
It isn't just about slowing death, but also preventing death...you realize if you lower the numbers of infected then the risk of more being infected also decrease.
That lowers the number of deaths.
 
We have some early published data on percentages which vary widely. A paper from China involved 710 Covid-19 patients; 52 were admitted to an ICU. Of the 22 who eventually required mechanical ventilation, 19 (86%) died. Another early study reported 31 of 32 (97%) mechanically ventilated patients died.
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https://www.physiciansweekly.com/mortality-rate-of-covid-19-patients-on-ventilators/

Once you get out on a ventilator that's as good as a death sentence. We are keeping people alive who are already going to die.

The lives we are "saving" are not the most extreme cases. It's the people who were very likely going to survive anyway, people with stronger immune systems.
 
Also, if the hospitals DO become overwhelmed with patients then there will be unnecessary deaths occurring because there will not be the resources.
So no, it's not just about slowing it down.
 
That's
Skarekrow said:
I completely disagree.
It isn't just about slowing death, but also preventing death...you realize if you lower the numbers of infected then the risk of more being infected also decrease.
That lowers the number of deaths.
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That's a temporary solution. And it's not really a solution. It's as good as putting your head in the sand and hoping the virus will go away on its own. Imagine the people who are growing the food, delivering it, running the stores so we can all hide at home, they get exposed to it and slowly die or just have to stay home for 2 weeks until the infection passes.

Gradually that's going to effect our ability to have food and supplies. A small number of people cannot sustain an entire population of people who are not participating in the economy, unless we want to start up farms on our houses, this is not a solution and will lead to much bigger problems
 
slant said:
That's

That's a temporary solution. And it's not really a solution. It's as good as putting your head in the sand and hoping the virus will go away on its own. Imagine the people who are growing the food, delivering it, running the stores so we can all hide at home, they get exposed to it and slowly die or just have to stay home for 2 weeks until the infection passes.

Gradually that's going to effect our ability to have food and supplies. A small number of people cannot sustain an entire population of people who are not participating in the economy, unless we want to start up farms on our houses, this is not a solution and will lead to much bigger problems
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No, it's called being smart to prevent unneeded deaths.
No one here is hiding their head in the sand but our great leader.
Why so excited to kill more people?
 
Milktoast Bandit said:
Being ok with people dying because it's not a majority of the population is just an acceptance of collateral damage. There would be far less collateral damage if life and health was rightfully placed about profits.
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You can't save everyone. That's reality. I'm not happy that people are going to die. But if you're born... You're going to die. I'm not a fan of this protectionism mindset. We can't save everyone. We need to focus on what's going to be the best for the greater whole; which is not this. The population we are trying to protect is so small in comparison to the population that with be absolutely ruined by a global economic collapse.

It is ironic that, in many peoples attempt to be compassionate and save lives, they are not seeing the forest for the trees. Unfortunately there is never a perfect solution and both solutions have costs.

To me, the cost of a ruined economy has far more implications.
 
Skarekrow said:
No, it's called being smart to prevent unneeded deaths.
No one here is hiding their head in the sand but our great leader.
Why so excited to kill more people?
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I'm not excited about it. It's sad. It will definitely be sad. However, it's reality. Some people live, some people die. That's the cycle of life.
 
slant said:
I'm not excited about it. It's sad. It will definitely be sad. However, it's reality. Some people live, some people die. That's the cycle of life.
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Yeah, I've seen lots and lots and lots of people die in my career.
If they can be prevented, the economy be damned.
I find the view of saving the economy over the lives of people cold.
And no...they will not die anyhow.
They are preventable.
If the money was put where it's needed and not just in the pockets of the rich then we could handle this just fine.
 
Skarekrow said:
Yeah, I've seen lots and lots and lots of people die in my career.
If they can be prevented, the economy be damned.
I find the view of saving the economy over the lives of people cold.
And no...they will not die anyhow.
They are preventable.
If the money was put where it's needed and not just in the pockets of the rich then we could handle this just fine.
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The economy isn't some abstract concept.

If the food chain breaks down more people will die. That's what I'm talking about. That's what can happen if an economy stops.
 
slant said:
Will the coronavirus kill more people than survive.

I want you to answer this honestly.

Is there any evidence to suggest that the coronavirus is going to kill, or is killing, 51% of people who get it?
Click to expand...

Health system is gonna be overwhelmed with coronavirus patients. People with other diseases will not be treated in time.

Also, you are assuming people are gonna just go back to normal if the quarantine is lifted. Not gonna happen. Cinemas, shopping malls, sporting events...All gonna be empty. People aren't stupid.

2% mortality rate is still very high. It means you are literally >1000x times more likely to die than on a normal day before corona (even if you are young and healthy). I would not go out if there was 2% chance I will get stabbed to death on the street.
 
slant said:
The economy isn't some abstract concept.

If the food chain breaks down more people will die. That's what I'm talking about. That's what can happen if an economy stops.
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Our supply chain is just fine.
Have you ever seen a supermarket in the middle of Russia?
We have 50 types of bread, 50 types of salad dressing, etc. etc.
The economy isn't stopping, we are just fine.
People here in the US have no concept of what no food is like.
Another month or two to stop the upward trend isn't going to kill anyone.
 
philostam said:
Health system is gonna be overwhelmed with coronavirus patients. People with other diseases will not be treated in time.

Also, you are assuming people are gonna just go back to normal if the quarantine is lifted. Not gonna happen. Cinemas, shopping malls, sporting events...All gonna be empty. People aren't stupid.

2% mortality rate is still very high. It means you are literally >1000x times more likely to die than on a normal day before corona (even if you are young and healthy). I would not go out if there was 2% chance I will get stabbed to death on the street.
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That's 2% overall too...if you are older or even a younger person with asthma then those rates can be 20% or more.
 
Skarekrow said:
Also...the daily death toll was just 2400 two days ago, and now it's doubled ++
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Those numbers include NY's addition of over 2000 prior deaths that occurred without being labeled as COVID-19. It was a one day spike to add them in, not new deaths.

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I agree, we're looking at closures until June 1st at the earliest. Any moderately populated location that wants to open earlier will be putting the rest of us in danger.
 
Milktoast Bandit said:
Or not even trash bags... Just a few minutes ago, I got a text from my ex. A patient at her hospital with symptoms of covid died. The doctor refused to test him and made my ex and another nurse go in and clean the patient up with only a regular surgical mask. A different doctor demanded the deceased patient be tested. He was positive. The nurse my ex was with in the room tested positive. My ex is waiting on her results. Guess we'll see what happens.

At her hospital, they are now required to bring their own disinfectant wipes, rip them in two and use one side to wipe down their gown and the other side to wipe off their mask and goggles if they have any.
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Another nurse from her hospital just got sent home with a fever. :grinning:
 
and as we turn this into a mathematic equation we distance ourselves from the overwhelming horror. . December 7, a day that will live in infamy. . 2335 killed. . 9/11 2996 killed. . .yesterday, 4591. . let that sink into your soul. .4591 died. . does anyone in our administration care. . not a fucking word about it. . tomorrow. there will be more. . so by all means, let's all mingle together so the wealthy of the world will continue to grow their fortunes. .I am so fucking angry. . time for me to shut up
 
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